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Originally Posted by Restarting
Yeah. Dirtbag,POS.
Then. Not now - unless you have maintained contact with any of them.


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Originally Posted by Restarting
He did, however, break down our apartment door when he stomped out and I locked it behind him. He is mortified over that. Maintenance is repairing it right now.

Please call the police.


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Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8.
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Originally Posted by Restarting
I know the thing to do is get on a Plan A, if only for me. The thing I worry about is EXPOSURE again. It would truly devastate his image in his children's eyes and my own immediate family.

You mean it would "devastate" his FAKE image. That would be a good thing, not a bad thing. It doesn't help him or your kids to whitewash your husbands crimes.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by markos
Originally Posted by Restarting
He did, however, break down our apartment door when he stomped out and I locked it behind him. He is mortified over that. Maintenance is repairing it right now.

Please call the police.

You guys are alcoholics, aren't you? This is all too crazy for normal people. It sounds like the insane asylum.

Are you alcoholics?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by Restarting
OH.

I found texts between them and records of calls.

The texts were, "why dont u call??" "R U ignoring me" a pic of bare breasts being held up to the phone porn style.

He had texted, "I sent 20 dollars" "I miss you too" and "I'll be leaving Columbas soon, I'll call then" "I'm at my favorite place (a HS he can't stand"

All far, far too chummy and familiar in current events for sporadic "I didn't want her to call" calls.

The thing about sending money really was terrible. She cost us a lot back in '04 and '05.
What do you think really has been been going on? Have they been continuing contact (thus the affair) all this time, or has contact recently been re-established?

What did your H tell you about contact when you confronted him? Did he admit that they have been having a sexual affair?

BTW, the point about spyware for his phone or PC is that it wouldn't matter what he deleted. You would get a report showing every keystroke he typed. You can see from your own experience how important it is to monitor his phone.


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Originally Posted by Restarting
I confessed them sporadically and what was "safe" for me. I did not come totally clean until March of 2006, when my own OM keyed my car and threatened to get me fired when I refused to "take him back" after being out of the A for a year and 1/2.

I'd finally bitten the bullet, and decided within myself, that I could not live with myself if I did not confess everything. I left the decision to stay together in his hands. I accepted, in advance, that all my efforts to split up his A might have been worth nothing without the confession.

It was the hardest thing I ever did.

I'd say 10 OM.

Yeah. Dirtbag,POS.

I am still ashamed.

Did I see this correct? That you had 10(TEN) OM?


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Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Restarting,

Did your WH ever get counseling for the psychological damage from your 10 OM? Does he even have anyone he can confide in or has he posted to MB.

I agree with your exposing your WH, but to be fair, in your H's eyes too, you need to exposure your OM to their wives was that ever done? Have you apologized to the OMWs?

God Bless
Gamma

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ah. Oh, wow. I knew I'd need to be honest, but had no idea how much this was gonna hurt.

No, I never apologized to any OM wives. Except for in my heart and in prayers. Each of these guys were also serial cheaters. I probably would have helped a few women, but in that environment, they pretty much all knew their husbands were doing this and better than half did themselves. Hell, that's how half of them landed their Hs in the first place. The retail car industry is pretty sordid.

You did not read wrong. But after posting, I didn't an self-honesty recount, It was 9. Over the span of 14 years.

Essentially, as I confessed to you here, I was basically prostituting myself for advancement at work. It was a rationale that was pretty stupid.

We've spoken again since he got home. He is mortified at every level. Crying and begging forgiveness and expressing remorse.

But it becomes more and more clear that he had re-engaged his "rescuer" title, and was enjoying the ego massage.


Restarting
me: FWS/BS, 46 ~ 8w7
him: FBS/WS, 45 ~ 2w3(probably)
M-24y 0329, DDay: Sep 8 2004-2:10p
Last C: 3/25/04 - (that I know of....)UPDATED: 6/4/05 - saw her at jail when she got out, & she called again --- H was asked to leave
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You guys are alcoholics, aren't you? This is all too crazy for normal people. It sounds like the insane asylum.

Are you alcoholics?

Wow. ML, I think you've been here for a long time, right?

I think I remember you being pretty direct.

We drink. Last night I did indeed drink a lot. It was not a quiet discussion, no. Yes, I repress a lot of emotions, almost all, in fact. And, yes, if I drink, I have no governor. There were a lot of "f" bombs, a lot of sobbing, a lot of wailing and a lot of wild waving of hands. There was also calm dialogue, quiet cursing, silent tears and wretched hand wringing. It went on for about 4 hours.

Also, "breaking the door down" turns out to be a hyberbole. It wasn't DOWN, but he did crack the jamb.

I do not fear for my life or my well being, other than a shattered heart.


Restarting
me: FWS/BS, 46 ~ 8w7
him: FBS/WS, 45 ~ 2w3(probably)
M-24y 0329, DDay: Sep 8 2004-2:10p
Last C: 3/25/04 - (that I know of....)UPDATED: 6/4/05 - saw her at jail when she got out, & she called again --- H was asked to leave
6/25/05 - H moves back and recovery begins
3/06 - DD2 - I confess all to H; true recovery begins
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Did you both conduct a proper exposure/set EP's/plan A etc. from the start of your last recovery? For both you and him? Which is 2006, right?

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What do you think really has been been going on? Have they been continuing contact (thus the affair) all this time, or has contact recently been re-established?

What did your H tell you about contact when you confronted him? Did he admit that they have been having a sexual affair?

Initially, he denied it. This alone ramped up the adreneline re: PTSD. I had the proof in my own hands, read it and recited it to him. Finally, he allowed that it was recent, then he tried to say he never wanted her to call him and had been ignoring her texts. Then I recited his own texts.

Today he has admitted more. It has been ongoing calls and texts since Sep. No physical contact, as there are over 500 miles between. The sexual tension she generates is what he was after, too.


Restarting
me: FWS/BS, 46 ~ 8w7
him: FBS/WS, 45 ~ 2w3(probably)
M-24y 0329, DDay: Sep 8 2004-2:10p
Last C: 3/25/04 - (that I know of....)UPDATED: 6/4/05 - saw her at jail when she got out, & she called again --- H was asked to leave
6/25/05 - H moves back and recovery begins
3/06 - DD2 - I confess all to H; true recovery begins
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I think it might go without saying, but I'll say it anyway, my own shame and guilt are what kept me in.

Although I haven't been unfaithful since 2004 (when his A shattered my previously ego-centered world), I have not strayed. Not to mention that I found that "f"ing your way up the career ladder just doesn't work in the long run. and it certainly does not provide any protection.


Restarting
me: FWS/BS, 46 ~ 8w7
him: FBS/WS, 45 ~ 2w3(probably)
M-24y 0329, DDay: Sep 8 2004-2:10p
Last C: 3/25/04 - (that I know of....)UPDATED: 6/4/05 - saw her at jail when she got out, & she called again --- H was asked to leave
6/25/05 - H moves back and recovery begins
3/06 - DD2 - I confess all to H; true recovery begins
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You need to do everything for the OM and their BW's that WH should have done long ago. It doesn't matter if they're easy women themselves, it's the right thing for *you* to do as you continue your quest to become a new person.

I'm very impressed that ML can smell the alcohol ONLINE! That is a huge issue that clearly needs to be addressed for both of you. You can't make WH do it, but you can get started with yourself.


A smooth sea never made a skilled mariner.
~ English proverb



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Restarting,

I'm not sure when you got married, but if you started cheating in 1990, your WH has to feel that almost his entire married life was a lie. Did your WH ever get to confront these OM?

Telling the OMW has nothing to do with the character of the OMWs, it's more about reestablishing your integrity.

Did you ever report these OM to management or the car company they were selling for, Toyota, Ford etc.

And again did you ever try to get counseling for your WH?

God Bless
Gamma

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Originally Posted by Restarting
Quote
You guys are alcoholics, aren't you? This is all too crazy for normal people. It sounds like the insane asylum.

Are you alcoholics?

Wow. ML, I think you've been here for a long time, right?

I think I remember you being pretty direct.

We drink. Last night I did indeed drink a lot. It was not a quiet discussion, no. Yes, I repress a lot of emotions, almost all, in fact. And, yes, if I drink, I have no governor. There were a lot of "f" bombs, a lot of sobbing, a lot of wailing and a lot of wild waving of hands. There was also calm dialogue, quiet cursing, silent tears and wretched hand wringing. It went on for about 4 hours.

Also, "breaking the door down" turns out to be a hyberbole. It wasn't DOWN, but he did crack the jamb.

I do not fear for my life or my well being, other than a shattered heart.


Yeah, you guys are both serial cheaters, hard drinkers and brawlers. Brawling and serial cheating is a way of life for you both. NINE affairs in 14 years? You must be kidding? This is your LIFE. You and your husband have a LIFESTYLE problem that is much worse than just another affair. [one of many] This is your way of life.

This is bigger that this forum is equipped to handle. Marriage Builders does not work when there is alcoholism present. You need to address your drinking problem first and get your life in order.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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ok. We are drinkers, but not alcoholics. Sounds to me like you don't mind lobbing a couple LBs yourself. It WAS a traumatic day, after all. Would you have me leave out these vital truths to have them come out so much later? Shame on you. You've seen this time and again. I just wanted to get it all on the table at once.

Yeah. so I'm a POS circa 8 years ago, reformed.

Yeah. So I doused my sadness and anger in alcohol.

I really did not expect self-righteous horse pucky (or so much of it!). I expected some release, some pats on the back that I may actually be ok, and some advice to help me sort through this mess and make some decisions.

No prob. So be it.

I've been shown the door.

So much for honesty.

Last edited by Restarting; 03/26/12 07:30 PM.

Restarting
me: FWS/BS, 46 ~ 8w7
him: FBS/WS, 45 ~ 2w3(probably)
M-24y 0329, DDay: Sep 8 2004-2:10p
Last C: 3/25/04 - (that I know of....)UPDATED: 6/4/05 - saw her at jail when she got out, & she called again --- H was asked to leave
6/25/05 - H moves back and recovery begins
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Originally Posted by Restarting
ok. We are drinkers, but not alcoholics. Sounds to me like you don't mind lobbing a couple LBs yourself. It WAS a traumatic day, after all.

No prob. So be it.

I've been shown the door.

So much for honesty.
You have NOT been shown the door, Restarting. You have been shown where to start addressing your problems. The issue of your drinking was identified by someone who was herself an alcoholic and who STOPPED DRINKING. That's what you and your H need to do.

You are trying to say that it is not a problem: "we are drinkers but not alcoholics" but many people here can see that it is a big problem, and that you won't be able to have a good marriage until and unless you solve that problem.


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In 2004 you wrote

"So let me be fair about my drinking. Not only has he mentioned his concern before this A, but I have, too. My Dad was a severe alcoholic (died of cancer at 52) and his Mom was one too (died of Hep at 50-something), and I recognize my propensity to 'self-medicate.' I've always used it as an escape tool. When I'm very distressed, I drink more frequently. But even then, rarely more than a bottle of wine (standard bottle, not the magnum.)"

Originally Posted by Restarting
LINY:

you said,

Did you have this drinking problem before or after the A? The reason I ask this, is because it wouldn't be too bad of a POJA your H offered. HOWEVER, I don't think his intention (only you can be for sure) was to better your M or you: it was fingerpointing in a warped way. "You stop drinking and I'll stop drugging and f'ing this girl." WTF?!?!?

So let me be fair about my drinking. Not only has he mentioned his concern before this A, but I have, too. My Dad was a severe alcoholic (died of cancer at 52) and his Mom was one too (died of Hep at 50-something), and I recognize my propensity to 'self-medicate.' I've always used it as an escape tool. When I'm very distressed, I drink more frequently. But even then, rarely more than a bottle of wine (standard bottle, not the magnum.)

His criticism/concerns for my drinking did step up w/i the last year. Of course, this last year has been a personal doozy for me. Mom died at 61 Apr 03; my job/mgt posiiton w/ company I've been with for past 11 years was challenged (behind scenes/secretly, but I knew)bc of my damaged rep from former boss (I'd been blissfully unaware how OM had exagerated our encounters and the frequency and to whom - God that really sticks with you!) and bc I'd become a harsh, crass, hard-hitting MFr and lost interest in keeping a professional,feminine image; many troubles w/ S's behavior at home, school and socially; continued threat to lose my job for monthss; owed a ton in taxes last Apr, but borrowed to pay, etc.

There's more, but the gist of it is, I took a good long look at myself last Nov (when I thought it'd 'come to a head')and decided I couldn't be doing things right if so many things were going wrong. Made a decision to be a 'kinder, gentler' Me. Quit cursing. Looked for things to compliment in others. Showed the compassion I'd always felt in my heart, but rarely showed. Read tons of books to re-explore and re-awaken my spiritual side. Dieted and took off about 20 lbs (This was getting easy, as stress 'helps' w that!) Curbed my critical tongue. Resolved to quit wasting energy on petty things. Hug my S, D, H and friends and tell them I love them each day....

I was becoming a new person! No, I was restoring myself back to the pleasant, optimistic, good person I had once been, but hoping in a better way.

But to find out this Sep that H had already started the 'friendship' w OW 2 years ago, that in the midst of my cirsis in Nov, he was bailing her out of jail, that when I almost lost my job in Jan, he was attending her court date, that while I struggled to go to work every day, fearful every day that I might lose my job Feb through Jun, he was visiting her regularly at the county jail to comfort her and get to know her and 'falling in love' with her. Wow, that's a blow.

Yep. Tough year. But especially this has been a very tough month. Yep, I have definitely self -medicated.

I see my problem drinking as a problem waiting to become a big problem. There are healthier ways to escape. But to be frank, I'm not certain it's another project I can take on right now.

BTW, I'm pretty certain he's not drugging. Of course, if you'd asked me a month ago, I'd have been absolutely certain he'd NEVER have an A, let alone 'falling in love' with her and struggling with 'which one', either. These are things that had NEVER occurred to me... so, I'm not certain of much anymore, that's for sure.

I'm honestly becoming exhausted.

So, when and if we actually get to point where we actually work together, I think a POJA on the drinking is reasonable. Not now, though. I've got bigger fish to fry.

Thanks so much for the wise input.

[ October 25, 2004, 03:17 PM: Message edited by: restarting ]
http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1192318#Post1192318

Restarting, you have a serious problem with drinking.


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Originally Posted by Restarting
ok. We are drinkers, but not alcoholics.

Well, maybe .....

http://depression.about.com/od/screeningtools/l/blmast.htm

The link is to screening questions.

Sounds to me your life/ relationship flips out under the influence.

Having drunken brawls is NOT normal and is a redflag You have drinking issues.

Get help.

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Originally Posted by Restarting
ok. We are drinkers, but not alcoholics. Sounds to me like you don't mind lobbing a couple LBs yourself. It WAS a traumatic day, after all.

I am not trying to fill your lovebank, though. I am trying to point out something that is very obvious to me, and that there is a serious drinking problem going on here that is leading to this chronic craziness and high drama. Is your husband a drug addict or alcoholic? What is his problem? Do he use dope? You are talking to a fellow alcoholic who has been sober for 27 years who recognizes one of her own. The only place I have ever heard dramatic stories like yours was either in my own family [all drunks] or at AA meetings. That is how I knew you were one.

I went back and read some of your old posts and people were telling you back then that you needed to go to AA. You admitted then that you had a serious drinking problem. [all blamed on your problems though] You and your husband fought, cheated and got into drunken brawls back then too. Your old posts are filled with endless drama.

My point is that you folks need more help that we can offer here. Certainly AA and maybe a life coach or a pastor who can help you navigate life in a sane and adult way? I am not saying this to be mean, but you should understand how crazy your life looks to outsiders.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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