My husband and I have been married for 6 years. We have 2 children together, plus another (unplanned) on the way.

I thought we a great marriage until I was pregnant with our first child. He began going out with a friend to the bar almost every night and not always coming home. His excuse being that I couldn't drink didn't mean he couldn't. Obviously, as this behavior continued, our marriage got worse. I eventually found through our cell phone bill that he had been texting and calling a certain number in an almost obsessive fashion. When confronted, he told me I was crazy. I gathered more proof until I was told she was a lesbian who's girlfriend was pregnant and hey just discussed things about pregnancy. I eventually called her only to be that she didn't have sex with my husband and to never contact her again. I don't think she knew he was married as all contact with her stopped that day.

That was 5 years ago. There have been numerous women since. A few have admitted to having sex with him. He still denies that he's ever been unfaithful, saying that I'm crazy, jealous and that my snooping violates his privacy and that I ruined the trust. Never mind what I find in texts and facebook messages. Either they're just joking around or knew I'd be snooping and did it to teach me a lesson. If I look, he claims he'll make sure there is something there to hurt me. Obviously, I know this is BS and that all of these women are either a PA, EA or he hopes they're leading to one.

I finally kicked him out after I didn't come home until 4:30am and seeing FB messages telling a girl where to meet him. He came home, passed out and I found texts to his friend asking him to come out and be his wingman with this girl. He took the phone, deleted everything right in front of me and then told me none of those messages ever happened. That's how much he thinks of me.

My current pregnancy and hormone overload gave me the strength to make him leave. Of course, now life is just a huge drunken orgy for him. But he still tries to be sweet occasionally to keep me from divorce. He doesn't want a divorce, he wants his family sitting at home while he parties and cheats.

I have learned so much from this site and wish I found it sooner. I now know that we've never been able to get passed the first affair and that the cycle keeps continuing because I enable him with secrecy. I know that while the first affair was not my fault, we drifted apart from not meeting each other's needs and my reliance on the first 3 love busters whenever he hurt me.

After seeing his recent attempts to reconcile without change, I informed him of my need for the extraordinary precautions. This was met with denial and refusal. He claimed that most of it was BS, names a few women he doesn't talk to anymore (ignoring the big one that has become a huge issue in the past 6 months) and refused a poly and marriage recovery program because "he's been completely honest with me and either I believe him or I don't." I just said that I was sorry to hear that and exited the conversation. He replied that I had to stop my attitude about the gym (since January, he's joined a mixed martial arts gym where he takes classes 5 days a week during the only time he would be home while the kids are awake and I don't really have any way of knowing he's actually going - only that he spends the drive there and back texting other women - much like his work commute.) I refused to engage and told him that we can discuss any issues he likes once we get past this point, that the precautions are nonnegotiable and that there is no point in discussing anything else in our relationship until the actions that violate the marriage are over.

Is this completely hopeless? Can a serial cheater who's more after sex and attention rather than love become a committed family man? Should I just move onto Plan B at this point?

Did you ever plan A? Have you exposed the affairs, asked people to help influence him to knock it off and work on your marriage?

I think you are doing the right thing by demanding extraordinary precautions, your H has been very reckless with your young family.

How are you financially? Have you filed anything yet? Protect yourself and your children. Hugs to you today!

I exposed the affairs to both of our parents and our friends. Currently, may parents don't want me or the kids to have anything to do with him. His parents have made it quite clear to him that they are angry and disappointed, but he lies to them claiming that nothing ever happened and to mind their own business if they want to see there grandchildren. My friends are supportive of me by hating him and thinking I'm crazy to not immediately divorce him and his friends have denied that he's done anything wrong and attempt to support him by taking him out drinking and introducing him to other women, telling them what a good guy he is. It seems that most people don't understand why I wouldn't immediately divorce him and think less of me because of it.

Financially, I'm not good. I've been a stay at home mom for years. I have no income, no credit, nothing. I filed for child support a while back when he began using money as a means to punish me for questioning his fidelity. The children and I live on that along with anything his decides to give us. It's been like that since I was granted the support.

Getting rid of any friends who are not friends of the marriage would have to be an EP he would need to agree to, as well. Your friends, too...you could not move forward with people who are not willing to forgive him if you do.

How old are you guys?

It's a bit slow here today with the holiday, but hang on for other more experienced (in this area) posters during the beginning of the week. I honestly don't know what to tell you; I know you want to save your marriage, and the people here can help you to at least do your best to try to accomplish that. Your husband seems to need to grow up quite a bit, and you seem to need to get even tougher. So I'll go with just some more hugs for you, please take care of yourself.

I only just realized it was Easter, even while celebrating with the kids, it never dawned on me. That's just how messed up my mind has been lately.

I agree with we need to get rid of any friends like this. We've done this before, but eventually my husband just aligns himself with new, single guys to go out with.

I'm 32. My husband will be 30 in 2 weeks.

I appreciate all advice and thoughts. It's hard to be tough, but I know now that things will always come back to the situation I'm in now if I am always willing to move past his affairs when things start to seem better. He needs to fully commit and be willing to show that because he's very good at going back to fulfilling my ENs (for a while anyway) without completely stopping this undermining behavior.

Jennifer you're doing very well and welcome!

The EP regarding friends should not simply be that he cuts out all present friends, but that he never spends time with any friend who does not have your express approval. That's POJA.

Do a rock star Plan A but do it for you. Spend just a few weeks showing him EXACTLY what he's missing if he won't get on board. Use it to empower yourself. Have you read the carrot and stick of Plan A thread?

In just a few short weeks you'll be in Plan B and it will be his job to show whether or not he's man enough for the job.

Hugs to you.

Thanks indiegirl! I believe not spending time with any friends that do not have my approval would greatly relieve a lot of the worry I have.

My question is - should I ask for these precautions at this stage, when he won't even stop talking to some of the women and exists in a state of denial of any wrongdoing, or should I wait on the ones that are less relevant to the current crisis (I do have a few more that will need to be met if we were to reconcile) when he may be more receptive?

I did read the carrot and stick thread and have tried to follow it, but find it difficult not bursting into tears when he whips out his phone to start texting right in front of me. Pregnancy hormones are making me fragile, at best. I plan on getting back on antidepressants (I have a history of severe depression even without pregnancy in the mix) as soon as I see my ob/gyn next week so that I can stop breaking down and being overly emotional about the entire situation.

I find it easy to show him the person and home life he'll be missing, especially because he immediately responds by giving me the affection and attention that I've been missing. I just need to do it without forgetting what got us here in the first place and by being able to show my hurt without it becoming the hysterical, hyperventilating pregnant woman.

Okay, so maybe Plan A isn't going to be as easy for me as I thought.

I spent some time yesterday going over the EN questionnaire for my WS. One of his biggest ENs is admiration, something I haven't even attempted to meet in years. Thinking back, when I did meet it accidentally now and then, it was like dealing with a whole new person.

So, I texted him last night telling him how much I appreciate his taking the kids to his grandmothers, even though I knew he didn't want to, since the kids had such a great time. The conversation was friendly, including his saying that he's always thinking of me and missing me, that I'm always on his mind. The things I always hope for, but can never truly believe knowing he says anything to keep women interested in him.

So what to I do? When he asks how I'm feeling this morning, he gets told how much I miss him. That I'm sorry I made him leave, but the pain was just too bad. That I wished that he been committed to our marriage. And that now the pain is almost unbearable. My neediness has probably undermined any good my admiration did yesterday.

Any show of feelings on his end and I immediately bombard him with something that says I'm broken - you broke me - fix it, and that's just not going to work. I need to get a handle on this because I'm sure he's only hearing blame when my goal was to make him aware that I still cared deeply.

I'll hear from him on and off tonight while he's working and I'm just going to have to really evaluate my responses before sending them. Tomorrow will be the bigger issue since he's coming with me for an ultrasound and face to face usually ends in tears. I know I should not be expecting anything during Plan A, but it's like I have no control over my emotions or reactions.

So maybe this is all pointless in my case.

I wanted him to talk to me about our relationship. Not gonna lie, I was hoping for, well, hope. Regret. Remorse. Not this.

Apparently, all I do is talk down to him, go through his stuff and threaten to divorce him. He claims that he's inflicted no pain on me, that he has nothing to hide, but it's the point of it. That it's (cellphone, Facebook, email, etc) isn't mine, so leave it alone. That if he wants to go out, he will. And that he sees the kids every chance he gets, so stop bitching.

He went on to say that I'm his best friend, but honestly after the things I've said to him, he really doesn't know if he cares about losing me.

It seems like I'm jut leaving myself open for him to hurt me more here. I know I've reacted badly to his actions over the years. I know I've relied almost exclusively on the first 3 love busters. But should I really be treated like I deserve everything he did? That I caused it? That I should just shut up and deal with it if he does decide to come back someday?

I don't think I can handle much more of this.

Today was ultrasound day. I got a text last night asking if I still wanted my WS there. I told him that he's more than welcome, that despite whatever feelings he may have about me, this is about the baby.

Of course, in the usual fashion, the conversation quickly deteriorated into his claiming that I'm not alone and that he's always there for me and the girls despite the fact that I raise them all on my own with his seeing them maybe 2 hours a week. Yes, that should certainly help when I have a 3 year old that still doesn't sleep through the night and a newborn that needs feeding every 3 hours while I recover from a c-section. I did manage to phrase this in a non-attacking manner yesterday, but honestly, who does he think he's kidding here?

The ultrasound itself went smoothly. He met me there, everything looked good from a medical standpoint. When we were leaving, the doctor pulled me aside and told me to come back in 3 weeks instead of 10 weeks because he couldn't be sure all the parts of the heart had formed correctly. But not to worry. Yeah, because my anxiety isn't through the roof already. My WS thought this was a good time to bite me on the back of the neck. Seriously, WTH?

In the parking lot, he thanked me for allowing him to come, gave me an awkward hug and left. Then immediately texted me saying he's going to try for FMLA when I deliver the baby so he can be around to help. I told him I wasn't sure, but I thought you could only take it for children that are in your care full time and that he should research it more. This pissed him off, ranting about how unfair it was.

I left it alone, but honestly, if those aren't the rules, they should be. He's already inches away from getting fired because he always calls out. His job will not like it and definitely won't believe he's helping me with the kids and not just using the baby as an excuse to get time off to hang out with friends and go to bars. My father got him the job and while not his direct superior, the higher ups often go to my dad to find out if his ludicrous excuses for not making it in are even remotely true. Of course, my father does not lie for him and tells them that he's not in jail for unpaid child support, not in the hospital, or that I'm not so horribly sick that he's home helping me.

Annoyed. Confused. Still completely hurt. No idea how to deal with any of this.

What do you want from us?

More immediately, what do you want from him? Yeah, I know, a supportive, sober, hard-working, faithful husband-and-father, right?

Have you ever had it? Does ANYTHING in his past/present give you evidence that he can be that person, especially since "husband" to him changed from being the person who partied with you, and became instead (supposedly) the provider of support and stability for you and your children?

He's a child, friend - actually a spoiled child, at that. He's thirty years old and screwing up the job "daddy" got him? He's abandoned his family, drops in when he's sober ebough to act concerned, and make fanciful plans to assist you with the kids, like they're some kind of rented video-game.

You can't afford to raise the "child" that is your husband right now. You've got other responsibilities. I'm going to ask someone who's about three years past your current situation to stop in here. She might not choose to, but she might let someone post for her.

Honestly, NeverGuessed, I've stared at your first question of a half hour without being able to come up with an answer. I don't expect anyone to be able to fix this for me, or tell me what to do that will magically make things better. The most accurate response I can come up with is I needed a place where I could talk about what was going on without the immediate response of "he cheated, you divorce him, end of story" which is all I get from those in my life. Perhaps let me know when I'm doing something that's obviously going to make things worse. And honestly tell me from their own experiences (rather than the revenge mentality of just taking him for everything he's worth because he hurt me) if the situation is hopeless and cutting my losses is a better path than trying to save my marriage.

I probably would have responded that I wanted him to be a honest, faithful husband that put me and the kids above all others, but your words work just as well.

The thing is that he has been that person in the past. Not that doing it for months to a year at a time and then going back to this garbage is something to praise him for. It's one of those situations where when he's good, he's great, but when he's bad, it's hell. I believe that if it was always like it is now, if I never experienced those times of good then I wouldn't be trying to save my marriage - that I would have believed that as my family and friends do. Or maybe that has nothing to do with anything and I'm just scared to be on my own with the kids and a tiny bit of support seems like a better deal than no support at all. I really can't say at this point.

Everything you say is correct. He is the person you describe. And I really can't afford to raise him. It is effecting my health, my pregnancy, my ability to function day to day as a normal human being. Not even taking him into consideration, I just don't know how to make things better for me.

JIL,

Correct me if i am wrong, it sounds like your relationship with your WH was ok up until you started having children. Then things changed correct? Or did he have the party lifestyle prior to pregnancy only to see an escalation after pregnant?

How is your current support system? Friends, family, church? Has that slowly diminished over the years as well?

I know you hands a full, being pregnant with you 3rd child, having 2 little ones at home in addition to your WH who has become a rebelious spoiled teenager because you wont let him cake eat while you are doing all of work.

What would you like to accomplish?

My suspicion is that he's always been like this, but it was JenniferIsLost that matured while WH didn't.

I'd say Plan B is in your very near future, as it sounds as though any attempts at Plan A are wearing you out with the pregnancy only complicating matters. Removing yourself from his drama would probably help immensely. Too, your oldest (age 4 or 5?) is going to start picking up on this mess very fast and will need one sane parent around to protect him/her.

NW...that is why the statement of things were OK prior to pregnancy. I am sensing that there was many, small, subtle comments made here and there by WH.

She's got the rose-colored glasses, probably. And you know how some guys just don't ever grow up. They become the 40 year olds hanging around in the underaged college bars. Family and kids just don't fit into that equation.

Logans_Run, Northwood is correct. He's always been into the partying lifestyle. Once I became pregnant, I was left at home while he continued and found "friends" to take my place. After having kids, I still like to go out every once in a while, but not daily or weekly and never without him and he seemed happy with only going when I could join him for a while. But now if I can't or won't join him, he just finds someone else.

My support system if almost non-existent. My relationship with my parents has become strained because we fight over him. Most of my close friends are no longer close, and the ones I have remained close to now live far away and we rarely get to actually see each other. I was never active in the church.

I want to make him realize all that he's giving up. I think he believes I'll always be waiting for him and that he can come strolling back after he's had his fun. I want him to know that isn't the case, that even though I love him and want him to be a good husband and father, that this is unacceptable behavior and can't even happen again. I don't want to give up, but I also don't want to have him come back and things stay as they are now either.

Northwood, I was afraid of that, but if Plan A isn't going to work here, I have no problem going to Plan B. As much as I want to save my marriage, I'd really like to avoid the constant hurt more. Plan A gives him the ability to mess with my mind, no hope one minute, hope the next, constantly back and forth.

"And you know how some guys just don't ever grow up. They become the 40 year olds hanging around in the underaged college bars. Family and kids just don't fit into that equation."

I know that's a real possibility. I'd hate for that to be the case, obviously, but you are probably completely right. That depresses the hell out of me. I knew guys like that. I can't be the wife of someone like that. I'm really going to have to give up the fantasy of a happy life with him, aren't I?

Looks like I'll be studying up on Plan B tonight.

Well, unless your fantasy consists of what you're living with now then, yes, I'd consider your old/current marriage dead. Now, whether a new one emerges or you divorce is anyone's guess, but I suggested Plan B because it seemed that the emotional toil of Plan A just wasn't manageable.

That's your call, of course, as only you know what you can put up with.

As an aside, try to shore up the strained relationships with your family and friends. Having someone to actually talk to during this kind of crap really helps.

When are you due?