Still here. Will find time to post progress in a bit. We don't have a lot of UA time, and we're maximizing it as best as we can, so I don't post. I'd rather spend time with AI.

Our anniversary was yesterday. There were painful moments, but it was a calm and wonderful time with my wife. I'll explain more later, as there were many moments that hurt and helped.

Reading these threads constantly, though. The inspiration is amazing.

trt, perhaps you could stroll over to my WH's thread and kick him in the rear for me?? LOL.

I'm glad to hear you are keeping up with things. And I think everyone has teared up over Gloveoil's "Ordinary Day"

I'm sure you know now how many hours you need. Do you have a plan to adjust your schedule?

Markos: We've laid out a plan for UA time and have even designated activities for those times. We're both really stoked about it, but with the baby feeding on demand, it's a crapshoot. Being home on leave helps, though. We get to eat, smoke, and chat pretty much any time we want. It's helping us both immensely. I'm going to look into extending my leave even more.

RocketQueen: Can you link me to his thread? Now I'm super curious. And yeah, between HPB, GO, and HHH's threads, I'm pretty damned sold that *this* is the lifestyle for us. I'm 100% in and have never been more sure of anything in my life. Now if Markos would link me to HIS story...

His username is kiss and the thread is I want my wife back

Thanks

Glad you stuck around, life is so much more rewarding isn't it?

Life is definitely more rewarding. I'm still working through Love Busters, but I'm struggling with WS feelings that in *did not* anticipate. I don't know if it's withdrawal from the ENs, an overdose of ENs, or just an exacerbation of my existing depression. There's a general, yet heavy, malaise going on in the old brain bucket. And it's starting to affect AI as well.

I NEED to know how to get past this. I'm already on ADs, and have recently upped both meds to double dose.

Any other WS's experience this? Is there a magical fairy that can take it away so I can get back down to business?

I'm trying to explain this to AI. Failing miserably.

Hey dude. Sorry for not responding. Things move quick around these parts, apparently. And kudos for telling such a brutal story in such a beautiful way. "Ordinary Day" was heart breaking.

To answer:

- we've been rehashing the feelings I had for the OW and how I felt about AI (BS) at that time. As well as my goings on while in those few 'lost' months. And everything in between, really. And now *I'm* bringing it up and apologizing like a junkie all over the place.

- normally we talk about everything under the sun, but for the past few days (after a few days of AO's from your truly... which, might I add, have stopped dead after reading the AO chapter in Love Busters) we've been talking about both of our feelings. She doesn't know where I am, but I'm trying to explain the inner insanity.

- we've got around 21 hours scheduled, but it's looking more like less than 15 with all the insano children running around. (I don't know how HPB and SMB do it...)

- when we spend our UA time together, we usually talk about future plans, finances, stuff we want to do, and MB theory. We plan Gin, Scrabble, and have lengthy SF sessions. That's another story for another time that is directly linked to my AD's, and it's also causing a HUGE problem for me psychologically.

Things are noticeably better, but she wants to know what she's supposed to do to bust through the initial stage and zig zag through to recovery, and I want to show her everything I can be, beat the ever living hell out of myself for being such a hurtful [censored], and defeat this depression once and for all.

We both agree that IC is completely out of the question, so I'm basically using y'all as a sounding board.

I also came across OW's phone number in AI's phone (which was a MAJOR trigger for me) she found the date in my phone where I had marked the day my EA went PA (that I have NO IDEA why I put there, and has totally bummed out AI), and I've been reading threads here that are making me think that no matter how hard I work, there's still a possibility that she'll leave me, as she has the right and every reason to, admittedly.

She'll probably be posting something over at her thread soon with more information, as she has a few specific questions for the lot of you to attack.

What say you, random invisible people of the interweb? Am I still foggy, should I talk to Meester Docktor about switching meds? What's the deal? I'm so utterly confused and struggling to beat this back and fulfill AI's ENs.

I am ROYALLY screwing this up. I've broken several EPs, Come close to, or just put my toe in a few AO's, and am REALLY having a terrible time explaining my inner feelings with openness and honesty without sounding like a selfish douchecanoe.

Okay, rightthing,

First off, calm down. Self-flagellation (that means beating yourself up) won't help anything. A lot of wayward husbands and wives, and in fact a lot of husbands in general, make the mistake of trying to be very dramatic about how much they regret what they have done, how wrong they are, etc.

That really doesn't help anything. It's words, not actions. Also, it gets you all excited, which means your adrenaline is flowing, which means you are irrational, which means nothing you do in that state is going to help your situation.

So, put a cork in it.

Next, extraordinary precautions:
You shouldn't be breaking EPs at this point. What did you do?

Next, angry outbursts:
Again, the watchward here is calm down.
HerPapaBear has stated that if he had had even one solitary angry outburst during their recovery, his wife would not have recovered with him. I can't emphasize how serious this is.
This seems to be a recurring problem, so you are going to have to step it up. Do the following for AO education:
* Read this: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3401_angry.html
* Read the AO chapter in Love Busters. (Good, you did this!)
* Listen to Dr. Harley's radio clips on anger management: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2603602

Then, start practicing what Dr. Harley says on this:
* Acknowledge that you and only you are responsible for your angry outbursts, that it is possible for you to always choose a reaction other than anger, even if your wife does something to upset you.
* Begin practicing relaxation every day, a few times a day.
* Once you know how to completely relax, start practicing thinking about situations that frustrate you, while staying completely relaxed and calm.
* If you or your wife ever feels that you are upset DO NOT SAY OR DO ANYTHING. Rule number one is shut up! Nothing you might be thinking of saying or doing in that state will be productive.

You will need to keep after angry outbursts for a long time, so implement AO continuing education:
* Read Love Busters, the whole book
* Pull up the following section of the site: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5505_qa.html
. Read Controlling Husband #1 & #2,
. Angry Outbursts #1 & #2,
. Domestic Violence #1, #2, #3,
. Abusive Marriage #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6
* Become a daily listener of Marriage Builders Radio. You will hear Dr. Harley discuss angry outbursts all the time, and you will be constantly reminded how important this is. If there's a repeat one day, listen to a show from the archives.

Next off, UA time:
* Take your wife out on dates. Get babysitters. Figure out how to make this happen. The quality will be much better if you get out of the house. You can't afford to miss this. Only skip this if your wife isn't willing.
* If children are interfering, schedule more hours. If 21 hours scheduled comes out to less than 15, then shave something else out of your schedule and schedule 25.

Okay, I know why you put this there.

You put it there because it was important to you. It was the biggest mistake of your life, and it hurts like hell for your wife.

Be open and honest about that. No need to claim you don't understand yourself: you were being reprehensible, and we all understand it. Admit the truth, let her process her feelings about it. Give her the space and freedom to react in whatever way she chooses.


Yes, sir, that is absolutely correct. And acknowledging that is important: you need to relinquish any desire to control her, any desire to force an outcome here. Just quietly do the work. Don't have discussions trying to persuade her how important it is to stay together, or whatever. Leave that decision entirely up to her. Communicate to her BY YOUR ACTIONS your willingness to meet her needs, your willingness to PROTECT her (i.e., avoid Love Busters), and your plan to do this for the rest of your life.

She will not feel secure otherwise, and in that case you definitely won't recover.

And don't skimp on any part of the plans here. As you can see, you can't afford it!

Are you on leave from the military?

Do you regularly spend nights away from home?

Also here's a fantastic radio clip on a WH not being able to tell his BW why he had the affair.
Radio clip on How to tell your spouse why you had the affair

Please let me know what you think.

This is from one of your older posts, but I am pulling it up.

You have got to figure out how to solve this problem, now, in a way that your wife is comfortable with. It cannot wait for years.

Stop bringing up the affair. You guys MUST stop rehashing the affair.

You cannot recover without intimate conversation. Read what Dr. Harley has to say about the four friends and four enemies of good intimate conversation:
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5056_qa.html


Whatever you are doing, make sure that it is not a miserable experience for her. The conversation needs to be enjoyable, and she needs the chance to open up to you.


You need to understand that this is a marathon, not a sprint. You are not going to create a fantastic marriage two weeks after D-Day. Just start practicing the habits that you will adopt for a lifetime, and patiently wait for feelings to follow.

By the way, according to Dr. Harley, depression in men is typically caused by career. Perhaps you need a change?

Brain: I'll listen to that tomorrow morning. This discussion is my sole focus right now. Just stepping in because she went to the facilities.

Markos: That will not be an option for years. There is no way.

Thank you for the previous posts. I'll be ripping through the material ASAP.

There is a way. You just haven't found it, yet.

Anyway, I had a lot more than just one suggestion.

Several questions I put to you, rightthing. I'm not seeing answers. Just an "I can't do it."

Your recovery is not going to make it if you don't address these issues, and make them iron tight. You can't afford to skimp or to cut corners; you guys are at way too much risk. Don't say "I can't." Put the problem on your brain to think about for an extended period of time. Think about it every day, and don't give up until you have a solution. Otherwise, you are not going to make it.

These are the problems you've got to address, and this is the order I believe you've got to address them in:
Extraordinary Precautions
Angry Outbursts and other Love Busters
the Policy of Undivided Attention