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jah Offline OP
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Thank you for all your advice. I realize that I am 'enabling' her by not going to full exposure. You are all correct. She needs to learn the consequences and right now she is cheating over and over because there is none. And letting her family and friends also know will be helpful because they will hold her accountable.

To Alis - Yes, I did know my wife for 9 years. I went to visit her country seven times. And prior to that we spent almost a year together here in my country. I'm not sure that constitutes getting to know someone well, but it's not like we met and just got married. We also had her tested recently and she was negative for all the STD's. Thank God also not pregnant.

Also, regarding booting her out of the house. What really happened is that I made her go back to her home country. Not permanently, but to visit her family and because I couldn't stand the thought of her continuing to have her affair. So yes, she could be carrying it on by e-mail and phone and I don't know, but at least I know there's nothing physical until she gets back at the end of June.

I am going to go for full exposure; I'm going to read up all about it on that 'exposure 101', and then as suggested, do it all in one day. Currently my plan is as follows:
- Expose this to all her family and friends, anyone who will listen. It doesn't matter if they already know. I am going to tell my side of the story. I am going to tell them exactly what she did, and that I want this to end and if she is willing to work on our marriage then so will I.
- Expose this guy, her 'third affair'. He's a grad student, some lowly teacher assistant at the university. I'm a physician and clinical faculty at that same university. I am going to ruin his life. I am going to expose everything to his supervisors, to his collegues. I have his facebook and he has 260+ 'acquantences'. I don't say friends, because who could be friends with such an A$$. So I am going to reveal it to every single one of those facebook 'acquantences' also. And I wish I could find out his relatives, or at least his parents. I'd like to give them a call and expose it to them too, but all those 'reverse white page' lookups don't work.

In any case, I am going to get my plan together and then do it all in 1-2 days. Thank you everyone for listening to my case; I'm sure you hear something similar over and over again. Thank you for your advice; I'll keep you posted on how it goes.


BH: 35
WW: 28
No children. Married 4 years.
D-Day (month?): Apr, 2010. Jan, 2012. May, 2012.
Plan A: Not sure; since marriage counseling began Jan 2012?
Plan B: 6/23/2012
No contact letter: 7/5/2012
Currently in recovery, and thankful to everyone here.
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jah, I agree you should expose her affairs wide and far. The more people who know, the more people to hold her accountable.

However, unless she is willing to make radical changes in her lifestyle to prevent more cheating, you are facing a life of holy hell. You will live a death of a thousand cuts on a long slow road to divorce. It won't be too long before you grow to hate her if there is much more of this.

Your wife is not marriage material in the first place and you have made a terrible choice for the mother of your children. I hope she can change, but I would strongly suggest you don't have children with her. It is not fair to drag innocent children into this nightmare of a marriage. '

And be sure and tell your own family, especially your parents, so they can support you.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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There are some people for whom marriage should not be an option and it sounds like she is one of them. You took the vows seriously, she did not. Sometimes it's better to cut your losses rather than invite the burglar back in to take some more.

If you're adamant that you want to try and save this marriage, you have your work cut out for you. I would expose to family, friends, workplaces, etc. of all three APs, it doesn't matter if the A has ended, they all need to know. And you don't know for a fact that they didn't have GFs when they were w/your wife.


Enacting life's lessons into positive change... .
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Originally Posted By: jah
But sometimes I think that I should just cut loose now. We have no kids. We have no house, our careers are just starting, we are still young (I'm mid 30's, she is late 20's). Maybe we should divorce?


I think you should follow your instincts on this one. 3 As in 3 years of M? GET OUT AS FAST AS YOU CAN.

FWIW, it's quite likely that she was fooling around on you even before you were M'd. It's unlikely that she waited until a ring was on her finger before fooling around. Have you ever raised that question with her?


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Get a polygraph from her, it's the only way you'll get the complete truth. And post your polygraph questions here beforehand so we can see if there's anything important being left out.

You can't move forward w/o all truth out in the open.


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Jah

I am sorry you are here, but file and walk away. There are too many good women out there, you deserve to be someones first choice, not the fourth or however many POSOM'S she has.


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jah Offline OP
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I have now read 8-10 people who have suggested just cutting loose for 'plan D' as you call it. Many of them involve opinions involving kids, as in it is easier now since kids are not involved.

Well, unfortunately I just cannot bring myself to do it. Yes, I know it has been three affairs in three years, but I am not sure if I have worked on our marriage the right way. Things like exposure, going through the 'marriage builders' guidelines, insisting on 100% transparency. I am going to make strict requirements as suggested like:
1. end all contact with the OM for life
2. no more nights apart or going out without each other - create a healthy, integrated lifestyle
3. complete transparency - cell phone passwords, etc
4. no more opposite sex friendships
5. complete honesty about her affair<s> passing a polygraph
6. commit to the Marriage Builders program for recovery as outlined in the book Surviving an Affair.

If she doesn't agree or despite this, it happens again, at that point I will go to plan D.

But that last part - pass a polygraph? Really? I wouldn't know where to begin with finding one or how to arrange for one. I also don't know what questions to ask. "Were you cheating on me before we got married?" "How many times did you have sex, and with which guy?" "Are any of the guys married?"

I don't know what else; is this a common theme? Is there another topic out there about polygraphs?


BH: 35
WW: 28
No children. Married 4 years.
D-Day (month?): Apr, 2010. Jan, 2012. May, 2012.
Plan A: Not sure; since marriage counseling began Jan 2012?
Plan B: 6/23/2012
No contact letter: 7/5/2012
Currently in recovery, and thankful to everyone here.
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I would cut your losses and call it quits. Three affairs during what should be the newlywed years is a giant redflag Be glad you don't have children with this woman.

Sorry for your heartache.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Originally Posted By: black_raven
I would cut your losses and call it quits. Three affairs during what should be the newlywed years is a giant redflag Be glad you don't have children with this woman.

Sorry for your heartache.

Agree completely. As said above, sorry for the pain you are going through right now. You deserve better and there is better out there. Cut your losses pal. This isn't worth the effort you would have to put into it and from what I can see her "efforts" would be nothing more than window dressing. She's a serial cheater. You can't fix that, and shouldn't even make an attempt after only 3 years of marriage.

God Bless


Every man I meet is in some way my superior; and in that I can learn of him.

-Ralph Waldo Emerson


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Please listen to these radio clips of a BH finding out his WW was having an affair the whole 10 years of their marriage. They also have no children together.
Radio Clip on a 10 year affair during their marriage
Segment #2
Segment #3


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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since you're keeping score, i'm going to add my voice. yes, i agree with the others that you should divorce. your WW has failed the wife test; totally wiped out.

however, if you feel you cannot file for D yet, there's another very important thing you need to know. you cannot recover a marriage when one person, *especially* the BS, is doing all the work! unless your wife commits to the marriage and does the work, you've only got another three long, empty, cheating years ahead of you. you've tried this already and gotten your heart broken again and again and again.

if you don't have the opportunity to expose the men, you still MUST expose your wife - to everyone: family, friends, colleagues. she is a dangerous, loose woman, and will need all hands on deck to keep her accountable.

don't waste your youth. find another young woman who will be loving and faithful, and be glad you had the opportunity to meet her before you ended up in an even bigger, longer mess that soured your love for a woman and involved innocent children in a broken home with a wayward mother.

i am very sorry for your heartbreak and pain. but you are in the right place, whether you try to recover the marriage or not. the healing you will find here for yourself will help you greatly.


fBW 49
xWH 55
DD 22
DDay 6/07
D 8/15
Letting Go
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Jah,

I don't know what country you are in, but if you're in the US setting up a polygraph is quite simple. If you want to recover this marriage, this is absolutely necessary. Are you sure it was only three affairs? I only knew about one affair before I demanded the poly. Then I found out about the other five OMs, the OW, and the three EAs. Get the poly.

It's fine that you're not ready to divorce yet...just understand that unless she makes radical changes to her behavior, these affairs will continue. You CANNNOT change her behavior though, only she can. Are you willing to put in the excruciatingly painful work that needs to be done in order to TRY and save a marriage that was never good from the start? I'm not saying it can't be done, if you BOTH follow the plan...but it's going to be a long, tough road.

Wether you decide to plan D or not, you need to expose...so I'm glad you are looking into that. Don't let her off easy by just walking away quietly.


Me: BH
XW: Promises83
DS5
Married 10 years, first for both of us
D-Day: 27 Oct 11 trickle truth-ed until all 8 OMs were discovered
D Final: 16 Aug 2013
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Originally Posted By: AJoseJake
Wether you decide to plan D or not, you need to expose...so I'm glad you are looking into that. Don't let her off easy by just walking away quietly.

Exactly. Jah, the best action you can make is to expose her A's to all of your family and friends. This way you keep your options open. It gives you time to make up your mind and think logically about your situation and what is best for YOU. Whether your recover your marriage or divorce, exposing gives you the support you will need.


Me (BW): 35
Married 1999 with no kids, DDay July 2011, OC born September 2012, Divorce final November 2012.

WXH (Gollum) is corrupted by his A, and now forever bound to it.

Plan B has set me free.

"Mourn the man he was. Know the man he is."
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Thank you for all your advice.

BrainHurts - I listened to the radioclip. I'm not exactly sure how that relates to me, unless you are suggesting that 10 years down the line I might still be deceived, and that I should get out now. It also mentioned about 'getting to know my wife better than I have ever.' I guess that is good advice, but I think at this stage I am not even thinking about that. I'm still debating on if I should give this marriage another shot.

There are still alot of people here advising me not to try, telling me to just give it up. I'm glad there are a few of you that also tell me that there is a chance, although you are honest in saying it will be a very long and tough road with no promises. I understand that, but that's what I'm willing to do if she is willing to make the changes also.

I have started the process of exposure. I went on facebook of the OM (my first acronym!). My first step was to save all his 262 'friends' onto my hard drive as a webpage file. I have started to send messages to his contacts; I have prioritized it with his family first, then workmates, then current friends. I don't want to send it to them all since I have heard that people get banned or locked out if you send to many at once.

In any case, I started sending it to his family, and within 12 hours, he actually shut down and closed his facebook account! So thank goodness I saved all those contacts to my hard drive. It will not do him any good since I still have them. So I still send out messages in small groups, and hope to be done within 2-3 days.

My wife was furious of course. He called her, that coward, probably begging her to keep me from ruining his life. She in turned called me and said that she has been thinking carefully about our marriage, and wants to work on it. But that she does not want me to continue with this 'exposure'.

I almost laughed in her face. She wants to work on our marriage just to protect this [censored]? I told her that no, it would not stop. That I am going to expose him, and her, to everyone. I have not felt so empowered before, it was such a great feeling! I told her that I had e-mailed her a list of non-negotiable conditions before I even consider working on our marriage. I told her to look them over, think carefully, and let me know if she would accept them. Otherwise, I wanted a divorce. She kept begging me over and over, giving reason after reason not to expose, and at one point I just hung up on her.

I will continue with my exposure of this OM. I am also drafting a letter to her family (it's hard because they don't speak English), so exposure will be a little more difficult. But once I have a friend to translate it for me, that is going out also.

I will keep you posted on how it goes. I still am not sure if working on our marriage will still be possible or not, and I guess only time will tell. But regardless on which way it goes, I hope I get get some advice and support from you all to help me through this.

I sincerely thank you for listening to my long rants.

P.S. Still not getting that polygraph thing. Three people now say it's 'essential'. Anybody know of a forum topic with more details, as in what I need to ask and what is the exact purpose?


BH: 35
WW: 28
No children. Married 4 years.
D-Day (month?): Apr, 2010. Jan, 2012. May, 2012.
Plan A: Not sure; since marriage counseling began Jan 2012?
Plan B: 6/23/2012
No contact letter: 7/5/2012
Currently in recovery, and thankful to everyone here.
Joined: Oct 2011
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Good job, Jah.

The reason people are telling you to get a polygraph is because your wife is a serial cheater and lied to you about being in love with another man on your wedding day. She has lied about this, she is certainly lying about other things. It is for your own sake to learn what is true and what is not, so that you can make a proper decision. You may decide if she is telling the truth, to go ahead with trying to recover. You may decide, if she is still lying, to choose to divorce. The polygraph is for YOUR own knowledge because she cannot be trusted to tell the truth.

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jah, you are doing AWESOME. Great job on the exposure to OM#1. I would suggest getting files on ALL your OM's and your wife friend/family list asap as she has been tipped off to this exposure and will likely try to contact any other OM's with a warning, or do damage control herself. It will take you awhile but I would suggest you keep plugging away at it today and get it done to everyone in one fell swoop.

Also, I can't remember if you have discussed Extraordinary Precautions on your thread, these are the expectations you are setting that she will need to follow in order to stay married to you. (PS LOVE the backbone here, this is exactly how you need to present it) There are many samples/examples of EP's on this forum and people can help you with this if you post yours, help you fine tune it to make sure you include everything that is going to help you create rock solid boundaries in your M, and also give advice on specific ones to your sitch. With your WW's track record, she needs very specific boundaries and a very narrow path.

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Good job on exposure.

Did you also hear from the clip on Dr. H telling the BH that he and his wife need to have a life that is completely together? Where they need to be together always? That's why they were in a RV and traveling. That his WW neeeded to stop everything that allowed her to have a secret second life.

Do you think you can accomplish this?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Well done, Jah! I too felt that same sense of empowerment. Looking back, I can't ever remember why I was so hesitant to expose. What is so wrong with telling people the truth?

Be prepared for the second guessing though...it came for me within two days of exposure. Just remember that any consequences that these people face are because of THEIR actions, not exposure. Never give up your exposure list. Never waver. Regardless of wether you choose divorce or recovery, you will know that you made the right decision for you. That's what following the plan is all about. You're doing awesome. Keep it up.


Me: BH
XW: Promises83
DS5
Married 10 years, first for both of us
D-Day: 27 Oct 11 trickle truth-ed until all 8 OMs were discovered
D Final: 16 Aug 2013
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 185
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Thanks again everyone for all the support. It does help

AJoseJake - I am not second guessing my decision to expose yet, but it was really, really hard to do that initially. I think I am one of those 'non-conflict' personality types, so this is a pretty big deal for me.

BrainHurts - I'm not sure if I could do that, live in an RV. The problem is that I am a physician . . . so I'm going to try an look for a position that doesn't have overnight calls. Unless my wife sleeps with me at the hospital.

Unwritten - Not sure Extrordinary Precautions you are talking about, but here is the list of my conditions. Also the facebook message I sent out:

These are my non-negotiable conditions IF you want to work on our marriage:
1. End all contact with the xxx for life. This involves writing a no contact letter stating you do not want to see him again.
2. I will expose everything that you have done to me to my friends, your friends, my family, your family. I will tell them that despite this, I want to work on our marriage and if I someday forgive you, I expect them to forgive you also.
3. I will expose everything that has happened to xxx's workmates, family, friends. Everyone. I will tell them that despite what you have done, I still want to work on my marriage. I will ask them to use whatever influence they have to try and prevent him from affecting our marriage further.
4. No more nights apart or going out without each other.
5. Complete transparency - cell phone passwords, etc. You give me access to everything.
4. No more opposite sex friendships
5. Complete honesty about your affair<s>
6. Commit to the Marriage Builders program for recovery as outlined in the book Surviving an Affair.

Facebook Message:
Dear friend/family of xxx xxx:
It grieves me to write this letter but I believe you should know the kind of person he really is. xxx has been having an affair with my wife. If you have any influence on xxx, please do what you can to get him to stop. I want to stay married, but the affair must end. I also hope that knowing this will help you to protect yourself and/or your significant other from him.

I would be happy to provide the evidence to anyone who asks.

Thank you, xxx


BH: 35
WW: 28
No children. Married 4 years.
D-Day (month?): Apr, 2010. Jan, 2012. May, 2012.
Plan A: Not sure; since marriage counseling began Jan 2012?
Plan B: 6/23/2012
No contact letter: 7/5/2012
Currently in recovery, and thankful to everyone here.
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 20,272
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Sorry for the confusion. I wasn't saying about living in a RV, but making your lives so intergrated that she can't have a second secret life.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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