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I wonder if she wonders what the **** happend to weepy spouse and who is the new guy. I worry a little that she thinks "new me" is "yea we get to go camping with OM and the kids" guy. If she thinks THAT she will be in for the rudest awakening and the crush of her Hollywood dream bc that will turn into a reality nightmare.

I will think of a nice gift and search for the right card. I will try to fill the LB as often as possible without smothering her. I also will get the PI on the OM and FB. I need to figure a timeline in asking her about the OM and our marriage.
Hmmmm???

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Originally Posted by loveherafaad
I wonder if she wonders what the **** happend to weepy spouse and who is the new guy. I worry a little that she thinks "new me" is "yea we get to go camping with OM and the kids" guy. If she thinks THAT she will be in for the rudest awakening and the crush of her Hollywood dream bc that will turn into a reality nightmare.

I will think of a nice gift and search for the right card. I will try to fill the LB as often as possible without smothering her. I also will get the PI on the OM and FB. I need to figure a timeline in asking her about the OM and our marriage.
Hmmmm???
You're kidding about the camping, correct?

Is this something she has talked to you about? Are you prepared for a fantastic Plan A comeback?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Here's a good clip of Dr. Harley talking about Plan A and Plan B.

1st Segment talking about Plan A an Plan B

Tell us what you think.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Yes kidding. The camping was from HDW post that the WS has ideas that BH and OM+WS will someday be friends and hang out.

WS did tell me about 2-3 weeks ago that she hopes we can still have family dinners sometime and hang out with the kids. I told her then that:

"You think I live in a fantasy world that "love conquers all" and something I say or do will have you love me again and come back. Well THAT is your fantasy world and Hollywood BS. THAT does not happen and will NEVER happen if you divorce me. You divorce me and when our kids graduate high school there are 2 side to the auditorium. When they get married there are 2 sides to the church and they will NOT put us at the same table together and I will NEVER hang out with OM or ANYONE you are seeing!"

RESULTS: Tears and anger. If she does divorce she should get used to it BUT for now I am James Bond filling the LB and 10 emotional needs!

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Yes working on a fantastic Plan A that will blow her mind BUT I think (please advise thoughts) that I need to give her time(how much it's only been since Monday morning) to respond to my Monday converstion with her after the letter delivery in which I told her:

We can make this work. The path is narrow and difficult and friends we have that are there at the end are our friends and the ones who arent there never were. You let me know what you need, alone time, family time, us time. I am here for you.

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Yes working on a fantastic Plan A that will blow her mind BUT I think (please advise thoughts) that I need to give her time(how much it's only been since Monday morning) to respond to my Monday converstion with her after the letter delivery in which I told her:

We can make this work. The path is narrow and difficult and friends we have that are there at the end are our friends and the ones who arent there never were. You let me know what you need, alone time, family time, us time. I am here for you.

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The 180 Plan is NOT an MB approved plan, so I wouldn't give it any thought.

Also, while in Plan A, you don't do relationship talk. You CAN and WILL tell her things that won't be happening in the future, ie, no camping trips as a family, but then you will move onto something else. And you don't bring up your relationship, you only act off of what she has said. Don't ever use any of the LBs and you'll be fine. Again, while in Plan A, you ASSUME there is contact. Until there is a NCL, you assume that the A is full on. After the NCL, you will verify NC.

Waywards are liars. Do you really believe that if you ask your WW, "Have you spoken to OM", that she will be honest with you about if she has or not? If you do, I have a bridge for sale, wanna buy it?

What are your WW's top ENs? How will you be attempting to meet them today? What specifically are you going to do? And what LBs have you been guilty of committing in the past that you are now working on not committing and how? Anything you do while in Plan A should be things that you would do as a good husband. Things you will be willing to continue to do, in the future, should the affair end, and your WW decide to end contact for life with OM.


BW(Me)aka Scotty:37
DSx2: 10,12
DDAY2(PA)Nov27/09
Plan B Dec18/09
Personal R in works
Scotty's THING laugh
Newly Betrayed click here


Praying for walls and doors. Thanx MM

“Surviving is important. Thriving is elegant.”
? Maya Angelou

PROGRESS NOT PERFECTION

THANK YOU
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Scotland -

My past errors was not giving her as much emotional and physical attention as she deserved (I was off doing my own thing). I was also a financial screw up. I changed and I can tell by what she says that she did not think I would change the financial screw up part so hard and fast like I did. Still owe but SO much more reponsible and open with finances to her. Asking the right ?s talking to her about our financial situation etc. I KNOW she has "Oh S**t" moments where she knows she messed up having the A. She is on the emotional roller coaster and has the best "game face" ever so she is a difficult read espc with the Om in the pic. I know she feels very guilty of the affair. She tries to justify it by saying "I moved out" but I refuse to budge and say "You and I will never see eye to eye on this. Separation is NOT a divorce. Separation is a time to reflect on your marraige and see if you want it to work". She tries to justift diff things to me.

EX: Last week I asked her about the divorce papers (she keeps putting them off and I ALWAYS tell her I DO NOT want them). She said "I am trying to help you. If I divorce you you dont have the health insurance that I pay for and you cant afford it. I went to my HR and asked how much health insurance was ($80). When I say her later I asked her how much my HI was and she aid about $200. So I said I checked on the $ of my HI and its $80. She paused for about 4 seconds and the only reply was "Well its s**tty health insurance!". Anything to avoid the divorce but not breaking things off with OM.

I am having a PI confirm the OM is still in the pic so I have confirmation (I still assume that the A is still on as per the advice here). She is dropping our daughter off this morning so I want to see what she says, her attitude etc. Since I told her that I'm here and To LMK what she needs "alone time, family time, us time" I feel I need to give her space (She says that was the prob immediately after spearation but I know OM was the big problem). I'm in the give her space (listening to her), deposit coins in LB and as far as emotional needs here are things I think she needs/wants at this stage - listening to her attentively, proving I have changed my errors from the past (all financial NO adultry on my part), give her space.

If my PI finds OM is at her place this weekend I will breach the problem and def tell her that as long as he is in the pic it is devastating to our marraige and family and closing the window faster to save our marriage. She is always so poker faced (WORSE on the phone) that I would have to do this FTF.

Scotland - when you say "And what LBs have you been guilty of committing in the past that you are now working on not committing and how?". What do you mean by LBs? (I'm new and the abbreviations are somewhat alien I usse LB for Love bank.

Thanks

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Here you go. Acronyms and Abbreviations

LB= Love Busters

Also in Plan A do not talk about D. If she tries to bring it up say " I don't talk D I talk Marriage"

Also here The Most Important Emotional Needs


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Re: addressing the issue of OM still in contact -

It's useful for you to know the tactical situation, but wagging your finger in her face saying, "Unless you leave him entirely we have no future" is not a pristine Plan A. There is no reason to tell her she's still seeing him; she knows that. Why give away your intelligence?

Better to bear it in mind as you execute Plan A actions. Continue to ask her to join as a family at casual (NO EXPECTATIONS!) events. Child's birthday coming up? Arrange to take the family to dinner, making a large show of being the gracious host. Compliment her on her dress, hairdo, make-up, shoes - whatever most gets her happy.

You message is consistent (and constant): This family/marital paradise is yours, WW, if you return to our union, free from OM. Left unsaid, but suggested by your other actions is: If you go with him, from my direction all you will find is dessicated ruin, desert, and waste.

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I just caught up on your thread and I want to add what I know regarding swingers.

Although the very act of swinging seems to the general populace to be a free for all, it really isn't and there are a lot of 'rules' in regards to what is acceptable.

For most swingers I know, for someone's H to have an A 'on the side' with a woman would NOT be acceptable.

For the record, I do not know this because I have been involved in swinging! I live in a neighborhood FULL of swinging couples, and have been around it for years. About 2 yrs ago I finally told someone 'please do not speak of these activities when in my presence, I do not support it and will NEVER support it and think its disgusting.' Or something like that. Now, nobody talks to us, boo hoo...but before that people used to talk freely in front of me.

Anyway. I remember one of my neighbors whose H went on a trip stating that she told him he better not cheat on her. I was thinking, um, you already let him have sex with random women whats the diff??? But there is a huge diff, between 'sharing' and just going rogue, which is seen as a no no. Could be different for every couple but in the community as a whole its not acceptable.

Also, my swinging neighbors have lives outside of swinging where they do not EVER speak of it. It is very secretive. I highly doubt their families, workplaces, or regular friends know.

My point is, you blow off exposure to the OM's side because he is supposedly a swinger. But even if that is the case, you could still make a major impact by exposing. In fact, since it will open up his entire sex life to the magnifying glass and as I stated a lot of swingers live way underground, it might even be ADDED pressure for him to stop seeing your W.


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Originally Posted by loveherafaad
Since I told her that I'm here and To LMK what she needs "alone time, family time, us time" I feel I need to give her space (She says that was the prob immediately after spearation but I know OM was the big problem). .............

What do you mean by LBs? (I'm new and the abbreviations are somewhat alien I usse LB for Love bank.

Thanks


love busters - which are angry outbursts, selfish demands (neediness and weepiness often come off as a demand) and annoying habits (any habits she has complained about pre-A)

Dont give her space! Your real wife didnt ask for this - the alien did.

Waywards only want space for their affair so you want to disrupt those opportunities as much as possible. Dont push yourself on her, but just nudge that 'space' in your direction as much as possible.

Show up unexpectedely, with a helpful and friendly attitude frequently but leave if she asks. Always offer to do something nice for her or with her, but be amenable if she wants you to go.

Of course you will text her (disrupt her) an hour or so after you leave!


If she needs a day of 'space' or you have the kids, do as you did the other day sending her texts and pics of you and kids. that would really mess with A time.

or send flowers.

Get creative.


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Thansk for tha advice. She was cold and distant when dropping our daughter off this morning (fine with the kids soso at best with me). My son called her right after she left wondering what she was doing for lunch. She didnt know yet. He hung up wo our daughter talking. I text WS and asid "K wants to talk to you". WS called K talked for a min then I got on the phone. Said we Calvin asked about lunch and lmk. She said she has been on the phone with a horrible client constantly calling and not listening. I asked what happened and intently listened, offered advice (similar problem at my work) and told her I'm here if she needs me to blow of steam or whatever. She seemed to shift (venting about the client to me probably helped). I offered to bring lunch so we could eat together and she wouldnt have to take time out of her day to get lunch and to lmk what she wanted to do. Closed by telling her to have a good day at work and she told me to have a nice day.

PHEW! This takes SO much effort to be cool when alot of times I get no positive feedback from her. I keep in mind what I want but at this stage have to reinforce that "My Steph" is worth all of this. Her mom comes this weekend so I will see what happens. Will probaby tell her my son and I will cook the usual breakfast (he is a great helper) and offer for her to join us. Its a sure sign if she sayd no them the OM is there. frown

Thanks again to all

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Yeah you have to become a great actor to Plan A.

Originally Posted by loveherafaad
"My Steph" is worth all of this.


That's so very sweet, but Plan A is first and foremost for you and for the children. Your Steph is probably lovely, but when the Affair addiction began to tug and change her into an alien, she could have become honest and asked for help. There was time to do that. She could have told you to help her with that encroaching danger, but she followed it instead because it was fun for her. Remember that.

I miss my husband's strong points and the things I loved about him, but I never forget that he chose his weaker side.

In six months time you may be in Plan B and that time will fly by. When that time arrives you will want to know you did the best you could.

So do your best, for you and your piece of mind.


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Found an excellent thread by Pepperband

This is the Plan A question.......Who the Heck Are you?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Thanks Indie and BH. I think I will print the link to read before seeing or talking to her as motivation for my time on the "stage in the theatre".

Indie - Did you EVER get any positive feedback from your H when you were plan A? When did you decide to Plan B? Is it not time dependant so much as "how much can you take before breaking"? I have told WS before (in doormat me) that I need poisitive feedback to give her space. It helps encourage me. I would still like the positive FB but will have to feel her our and be that understanding husband to see if things at work or personal life are frustrating and she needs help, what do you need, do you want to talk be left alone?

Thanks

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Have you seen this?
What To Do With An Unfaithful Wife #1

There are 5 letters in the series so read them all.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted by loveherafaad
Indie - Did you EVER get any positive feedback from your H when you were plan A? When did you decide to Plan B? Is it not time dependant so much as "how much can you take before breaking"? I have told WS before (in doormat me) that I need poisitive feedback to give her space. It helps encourage me. I would still like the positive FB but will have to feel her our and be that understanding husband to see if things at work or personal life are frustrating and she needs help, what do you need, do you want to talk be left alone?


Um a woman's Plan A is very different to a man's Plan A because men find it off putting to be pursued.

I did get positive feedback. He liked being admired very much, (and it was difficult for me to find honest things to admire)he lapped up affection and his attempts to pretend he didnt like my sheer nighties were pitiful!

But ultimately he knew I would require hard work from him in recovery and while he was happy to take cake in Plan A, that's where it ended. I entered Plan B happier in the knowledge I had given it my all.

Oh he was also horribly hostile at times to throw me off my game and make me needier. That's a common wayward trick.

Men also plan A for longer than women. Six months for men, three weeks for women (It's the differences in the way genders want to be pursued, also women get sick and have breakdowns if they stick it out, men seem tougher in that way)

All genders are told to 'Plan A without expectations' That means you can't ask her for feedback.

I like to think of Plan A as a company giving away a free trial of its product. You can't ask for payment and it better taste good.

But it's ok to say you will one day expect payment (commitment, your needs met too) if they want the delights from your Plan A to last forever.

Some waywards happily pay up. Others freeload on the freebie time period and then move on.

Last edited by indiegirl; 07/11/12 10:36 AM.

What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Have you caught her pretending she doesn't like your attentions yet?

It's a creepy thing they do. They feel guilty for betraying the OP.

You want her to feel guilty. whenever she is looking uncomfortable and guilty, push more temptation on her.

Guilt makes people justify. It is easy to justify 'I like my husband's attention' because there is nothing wrong with it!


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Have not caught her pretending she does not like my attention. No eye rolls or huffs etc. Texts are always emotionless so i don't read into them. Personal contact and phone conversations are easier to read. I know she feels guilty. She may not have so much contact with him lately OR likes the change in me. DK. I will still try to get my PI friend working this weekend. I know she will NOT have OM over when she has my son bc he will dime her out. I nicely asked him about his weekend. "Who went to the movies" "Did anyone come see your mom (mentioned friends etc.) He said no. He can't lie about that and she knows. I have them this weekend and her mom is in town so we will see. She said she may want the kids sat so he will def be out of the pic sat. I did offer to take WS, MIL and the kids out to dinner friday but with MIL poor plannig she said don't rely on it bc she has no idea when MIL will be in town OR what MIL is doing.

Called her again to talk about our daughter. Ligitimate ?s. WE talked and joked around (our sense of humor together is well known by everyone and one of our best assets together). I text her about her mom coming fo rthe legendary crepes breakfast that happens everytime her mom is in town and asked her if she would like to join us. She merely replied that don't count onher mom being there for that (refering to our earlier conversation and the truth that her mom is a VERY poor planner). I did not take it as offensive. i text her mom to see if she was coming Sunday for the breakfast I always offer. Now waiting for a reply. When talking with WS I did tell her that seh and I were always great when we planned things together (the truth and positive memories
) so I will wait and see the reults. We could not do lunch together but I will wait awhile and offer again. My rotating shift allows me to bring lunch to her office with the kids. I read the letters and will reread them at work tonight. Thanks everyone.

I def like the "justify husbands attention". I will work on that and make deposits into the love bank!

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