I would say I am in this state as well because when he does try to meet an EN now I reject him. Although I know its an EN. I am definitely in a state of withdrawal. How does one get out?

Have you read this?
How one spouse can lead the other into intimacy

So, you just feel like there's no affair. You haven't actually checked?

Warning you that 5 minutes a day will not work is not "condemning" you.

My understanding is that Dr H recommends that a couple focuses on the 4 intimate ENs, regardless of how each person prioritises the ENs from his list. He says that the 4 intimate ENs of affection, conversation, sexual fulfilment and recreational companionship are the fatest way to build romantic love.

You have to start somewhere. If you could manage dates that allow you to spend enjoyable time together, your H would soon emerge from withdrawal - as long as there is not an affair or some sort of addiction making romantic love impossible.

You mentioned golf. This sounds like an ideal recreational activity that would allow the two of you to be alone together doing something enjoyable and talking. Enjoyable RC and conversation would pave the way to affection and sexual fulfilment.

Just having dates again transforms a marriage. I can testify to this from personal experience. You must find a way to achieve dates. If you were not earning money until recently and you are earning it now, there must be money available for childcare.

Who looks after your children in the daytime? My childminder was willing to keep a child overnight for extra payment. This wasn't too taxing on her when the kids were at school all day, were picked up and spent the evening with her, were put to bed early and were taken to school next morning - but she even did this for little ones not yet at school.

If you have an existing carer for your kids, and you earn money, then this is the first place to look.

Checked what? I am positive there is no affair. I know I sound naive but I am positive. Other than he is having an affair with his nintendo, the tv and occassional internet porn like I said before. he never leaves home. and has no friends. He works and comes home thats it. why assume an affair?

You get out by booking a date that has an enjoyable activity at its core and you get out and do it. Once you are doing something enjoyable you do not have to try hard to "meet ENs"; some of this will come naturally from the activity. It is easier to talk when you're playing golf and discussing shots (or whatever golfers call them!), or when you've just seen a film, or if you go on a walk and take a book that identifies birds or flowers, or a GPS device that you can constantly fiddle with and discuss. Don't try and have deep conversations, and definitely do not try and solve problems in UA time. The time should be wholly devoted to pleasant things.

Here where I live (in London) we can walk on the routes of disused railways. It is absolutely fascinating to see railway stations turned into houses, and to actually walk the track where the sleepers have been lifted. We discuss the folly of transport planners who decided that some rail routes were not necessary, and closed down the lines in the 1960s. Unexpectedly we come across an alpaca farm - in Essex, to much amusement. We wonder if we will get shot at by farmers if we stray off the public footpath. The subjects that arise naturally on walks are endless.

You don't have to force yourselves to like each other or "talk" if you plan interesting UA out of the house - you just talk. It comes naturally. And then you come home, make some tea and sit together, and at bedtime you might just snuggle up a bit because you had a nice afternoon.

Hopeless,

you cannot possibly meet those 4 ENs in 5 minutes... I understand that setting up proper UA time requires some serious organising and effort at first, but it will pay off! It was seriously awkward to start dating my H again, but now these are the most enjoyable times a week.

Please read carefully what Dr Harley says about the amount of time you should spend daily:


This is from Basic Concepts - Policy of Undivided Attention

Yes we do not go on dates like we should be doing. We maybe go on a date once every other month for a few hours. We never had a date at all in the first 5years we had kids except for maybe one time. My husband also has the belief that the kids are priority and that we shoudl always be there for them and never take time for ourselves. I knew that wasnt true and now look where we are! he is coming around now though. Part of our problem is we have a special needs child so having someone watch the kids overnight is not always possible and we have to be very picky with who we have watch our kids because of our one with aspergers. Not everyone is so patient and understanding. KWIM?

We have no family to help either they all lie 1500 miles away. the kids will go to daycare so having them watch them overnight is not possible. unless we can find a sitter from the facility to stay overnight with them.

we used to golf together in the begining when we were dating but havent for about 12 years now. i used to like golfing too. so maybe we will try that one day. thanks.

yes I understand that 5 minutes is not enough. We dont even have 2 hours a day to spend together. By the time the kids are in bed there is about an hour or hour and half before I go to bed. so at most we could do about 10 hours a week. you know how pissed my H would be that he couldnt watch tv after the kids go to bed? haha!

seriously this is how bad it is. He even asked at our session today if he could set a timer for 5 minutes to be sure we didnt go over our assignment of 5 minutes. this is what I have to deal with people!

Okay hopeless- you make it sound like you and your husband absolutely hate each other as people.

Please bring him here so that others can speak to him as well.

There you go.

Childcare workers are not highly paid, in my experience, and some would appreciate some regular extra money. There might be one worker who is doing a qualification and stays in some evenings anyway, so studying at your place would be easy; or one who is a bit lonely in the evenings - or one who has debts to pay off.

Ask at your facility. If not a worker, there might be a parent with a similar special-needs child, just as desperate as you, who will enter into a deal for mutual, regular babysitting.

This is not a surprise since neither of you is in love with each other anymore. But time together is your key back to romantic love.

It might help to sit down with him on Sunday afternoon (each Sunday) and plan the weekly UA schedule ahead, just like Dr Harley has recommended (please read the link I posted). When both are contributing to the planning then it has a much higher possibility to actually HAVE the time you seem to be lacking so desperately.

What have you done to make sure that he is not having an affair?

he would be so pissed if I told him to come here and he saw what I have been writing about us and him. but I will try.

HE says he still loves me and is in love with me. he thinks just saying the words is enough. I can love anyone too and say those words but they dont mean anything without the actions behind them. he doesnt get that. so yes I believe he doesnt love me either.

i know he is not having an affair beause he is always at home unless he is at work. he has no friends and doesnt go anywhere. i hate to be mean and say this but his appearance doesnt drive women to come crawling all over him if you know what I mean. I have looked at his phone and emails and fb too. I am positive he isnt having an affair.

Love is verb. It requires action. Doing nothing .. or ignoring each other will not generate love. You must find things to DO together that you are both enthusiastic about in order to bring about the feelings of love again.

What did you guys do before you had kids? Think back to before you got together with your hubby. Think about some of the things that brought you guys together and helped you fall in love. I am sure you didnt just marry for the heck of it for something to do. There had to be some kind of connection or you wouldn't have dated .. or married.

MNG

Please listen to this clip on blaming.

Tell us what you think.
Radio clip on the blame game

So last night I tried talking to him about increasing our UA to the books standard and he got mad and said no we are only doing what the counselor said which was 5 minutes. I tried to explain to him how we needed more time to make this work. He doesnt understand the purpose of the 2-3 hours a day and thinks its just talking to each other which totally puts him off. He accused me of modifying what our counselor said to my own agenda. I told him I wanted to follow the book. We ended up having a huge fight over this.

I asked him last night if he loves me and he said yes. I asked him how do you know you love me and he said because I tell you all the time. I said love isnt just telling me its what you do to show me and how you feel. He said he feels his heart flutter when he is around me but he was just saying crap trying to be funny. I was not amused.

To tell you the truth we didnt do anythign before kids, we worked and that was about it. and before we were married we lived together for a year. We didnt do anything then either. Im not sure we should have been married. I think we did just because we thought it was the right things to do. The things we did the most together was go out to eat and watch tv, maybe went to a few movies and maybe went camping once or twice. Played a few rounds of golf but thats it. Pretty sad huh?

Your marriage will continue to decline if you both don't make an effort to get UA time together. Fifteen hours a week meeting the four most important emotional needs is essential to a good marriage. The 15 hours are supposed to be the most enjoyable hours of the week. The top four needs are generally Intimate Conversation, Affection, Sexual Fulfillment, and Recreational Companionship. Those four things are LOTS of fun. Nothing else we do compares in enjoyment to those 15 precious hours a week.

Our work lives need to be arranged our marriage, and not the other way around.

Having our UA time together for the last couple of years not only was crucial to our recovery after H's affair but if we had done this all along, our marriage would have been this good from the beginning. We are so sorry we often arranged our marriage around H's career and other things. We didn't put our marriage first.

There is hardly anything out there more fulfilling than a passionate romantic marriage. It's worth living in a small home, moving away, cutting back to one car, having a small wardrobe of clothes. It's priceless.

See if you can get your H to see this picture of your marriage potential:

He is affectionate with you throughout the day. You know he cares for you, because he shows it with little actions. He emails you from work; he calls you to let you know he's coming home; he kisses you before leaving for work and upon returning home.

In return, you are open to making love with your husband. He is free to ask you, knowing that you know of his love for you because he frequently shows it. Maybe you both get in bed and talk for a little while beforehand or afterward. It's relaxed, enjoyable, passionate.

Each week, you make plans for your time together. Sometimes it's a hike or a walk or a round of golf, sometimes it's dinner out, sometimes it's playing a board game or something like that.

Everything else is put on the back burner until the UA time is scheduled.

Time together meeting each other's needs without distraction is absolutely crucial. And five minutes a day will never cut it.