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#2648058 07/20/12 10:26 AM
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Hi, I've been lurking here for awhile. Many sad stories, some I can relate to. I guess affairs are more common than I realized.

I work in a team of 6, I've been with the team about a year and a half, have known some of them longer than that, severals years with a couple of them, much more casually. Here's our basic demographics (4 men, 2 women):

M1 - 49, D
M2 - 50, M 30 years
M3 - 49, M 10 years (this is me, my 1st, her 3rd)
M4 - 40, D
W1 - 49, M 29 years
W2 - 34, D

We're a pretty open group, I was amazed immediately when I joined how openly this group is about personal lives. It's kind of refreshing, actually. Anyway, M4 & W2 are D because of infidelity (well, and other issues we all run into in our M's). BTW, I didn't say so above, but none of these people are M'd to each other, nor are they dating, although M4 & W2 are very close friends, attended D recovery classes together.

Anyway, to the point of my post: Last week, W1 just casually mentioned during one discussion that at age 24, she'd had a hysterectomy because of cervical cancer. Me and my big mouth, I reacted with "Wow, how did THAT happen?" Kind of a dumb thing to say, since I have a female friend who had been diagnosed with the same thing several years ago -- I learned a lot about it, then. Turns out that cervical cancer is pretty much caused ONLY by exposure to HPV (an STD). W1 and her H were HS sweethearts, M'd early and have two grown kids. She's never expressed any concern about the fidelity of her H, nor given any signs that she's ever had any extra-M SF. In fact, all the people in this group are either Catholic or Evangelical Christian and have expressed sympathy for what M4 & W2 went through in their process of discovering their WS's activities.

Here's my dilemma: Should I share what I know about cervical cancer & HPV's role? I don't know if W1 or her H had any other SF partners prior to M (or after!), but having M'd so young and having been HS sweethearts, I'm guessing that they probably didn't (and I'm not judging!). She seems happy and comfortable in her M. If I tell her, it may be the catalyst for breaking up their M. OTOH, I'd want to know if someone knew my W was or had cheated.

Is this just none of my big, fat business and I should just forget about it? I'm conflicted between thinking that and not wanting to possibly ruin her M & life, to thinking her H has already done that and she just doesn't know (and I'd want to know). I realize that I may get a diversity of opinions, and that's fine. I'm leaning toward not saying anything, but am interested to see points of view that I may not have considered.

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I'd let this one go.
She is now 49 years old.
She probably knows the score by now.

Who knows, maybe she was raped?
Don't go there.

Before I retired, I did 4-6 paps a day, 4-5 days a week, for nearly 30 years.
Trust me, there are private conversations during those intimate examinations that equal or better what is uttered in a confessional.

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JThom

Welcome to MARRIAGE BUILDERS

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Originally Posted By: JThom

In fact, all the people in this group are either Catholic or Evangelical Christian


Just for fun .... Do you know the long-ago "back story" about the role Catholic nuns played in the eventual discovery about HPV as the root cause of cervical cancer?

Click to reveal..

Some keen observer of statistics noted that there were so few Catholic nuns treated for cervical CA. Far, FAR below what their statistical average should be when compared to the non-nun population. However, there were a few nuns with cervical CA. Thusly the investigation began, with taking a very detailed history. Not every nun comes to the convent as a virgin. Some had been sexually active previously in one way or another. When looking at these previously sexually active nuns, they were the ONLY nuns who were ever diagnosed with cervical CA. And, not all previously sexually active nuns got cervical CA. However, the most important fact that came from this long ago obscure research was this ~~~> Nuns who had NO previous history of ANY sexual activity had virtually ZERO risk for cervical CA. Therefore, previous sexual activity is fundamental to an eventual diagnosis of cervical CA.
A stunning discovery, really.

This led to other research, and the eventual identity of the bad guy ~~~>the HPV. Thanks to the cooperation of nuns !!!!
Also, the younger the cervix (young teens) , the greater vulnerability for HPV causing cervical CA.

If a woman waits until she is older than 20 to experience sex, her ability to get rid of the virus is greater !

Wasn't this a fun detour?




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Chances are just as good that she got HPV before she married...and from other partners....if she wasn't a virgin when she married.

I wouldn't say anything...as Pepperband said, she probably already knows all about HPV...how you get it and the cervical cancer link.


Married 1976
Me:BS
Him:FWS
MB Weekend March 2003
2 S's: '77 & '80, 1 D: '82
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Hmmm, was hoping for more opinions, but it sounds like the two I got are in the direction I was leaning anyway.

Two things: 1) Pepperband, I neglected to say that when I asked "How did THAT happen" (the cervical CA), she replied "I don't know". Now, I've been M'd long enough to know that, when a woman says "I don't know" it doesn't necessarily mean she doesn't know. Often it means "I don't know [that I want to tell you]!" I think where I was coming from in considering telling her was that I was believing that she really didn't know. It was 25 years ago, and I don't think the HPV link was firmly established like it was, say, 5-10 years ago when my friend was diagnosed. But since you're in the profession, I'll take your word for it if you say she probably does know.

2) Trix, I disagree that "chances are good that she got HPV before she married". Every woman I know personally who contracted HPV before trying to get pregnant has been unable to get pregnant. This gal married @ 19 and had 2 kids before the hysterectomy @ 24. She married her HS sweetheart. But I guess it's possible. I'm just saying I don't think it's likely. It's more likely that she or her H strayed some time into the M (maybe he did when she was pregnant -- I hear that's very common).

I'd still be interested in hearing if anyone thinks that I SHOULD say something, but I'm becoming more disinclined.

Thanks for the replies!

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Oh, and Pepperband, thank you for the welcome and the backstory on the Nuns. I hadn't heard that before, but it seems very reasonable.

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Originally Posted By: JThom
Oh, and Pepperband, thank you for the welcome and the backstory on the Nuns. I hadn't heard that before, but it seems very reasonable.


Fun detour.
Useless information. But, so what? smile
*shrugs*

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Originally Posted By: JThom


I'd still be interested in hearing if anyone thinks that I SHOULD say something, but I'm becoming more disinclined.



JThom .... be careful where you "stick your nose" ... Just a word to the wise.
You may end up unintentionally looking like a donkey's backside.

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JThom, looking at the thread title, I came on here assuming you had knowledge of an A, and I was going to urge you to speak up.

But..... Don't!

You have knowledge of how the condition is caused, but so does her doctor. So does she by the way.

If someone gets an illness, they find out what may have caused it. This is a 50 year old woman. There's no way she needs to be spoonfed info about her own medical condition.

If you know about it because A FRIEND had the condition....obviously someone with the actual condition is going to be MORE informed.

And it isn't indicative of an A. Anything could have happened. Rape, Hs premarital sex, her premarital sex, Hs adultery (that she forgave) her own adultery.

Trust me she knows what caused the condition and how she got it. There's no way she wouldn't have been told on diagnosis. No way she wouldn't have researched it herself.

But I like your willingness to expose an A!


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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The thing that is sticking out to me here is not this woman's cervical cancer and the hows and why's of getting it, but rather that you are involved in this:

"We're a pretty open group, I was amazed immediately when I joined how openly this group is about personal lives. It's kind of refreshing, actually."

Having men and women who not only work closely together but are a 'tight group' sharing personal information about themselves is right at the top of the slippery slope to adultery. Since many of you are married (and not to each other) you really need to rethink how damaging this dynamic can be.

It is your responsibility to make sure NO other woman than your wife fills your needs, including the need for IC. And it sounds like these women do. And I am sure there are many wayward Catholics on this site that can tell you that due to their poor boundaries they cheated, and being Catholic did not stop them.

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That's pretty unnerving that you have such personal conversations with female coworkers. That is sure not considered professional behavior where I work.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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indiegirl, thank you for the perspective. You're right, I don't know of an A, don't know W1's H, never met him (although other team members have, they all seem to like him).

My friend that had the condition told me that the Dr's could tell her pretty closely when she was exposed by the growth pattern. Turned out, her H had been unfaithful for most of their 12-yr M. He D'd her to keep his hoochie girl...

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unwritten: That's an interesting perspective as well. I've never been involved in a group that knew each other's business quite like this. My involvement in the conversations has never been 1-on-1 except with M4 (which I would consider appropriate), but it seems like anything goes in the group discussions. I don't know how much is venting on their part, horsing around, or what, but especially M4 & W2 give each other a lot of "razz"...

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JThom,

Is your DW ok that you have these kind of conversations with women at work?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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MelodyLane: I think I was kind of unnerved a bit about it at first. Amazing what you can get used to. I'm probably the least involved (and usually last to jump into these group discussions).

I was actually quite surprised that W1 just "dropped" the info about her hysterectomy into the middle of a conversation I was having with M4.

Not professional? You'd probably find some who agree. Different strokes, I guess...

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Honestly, I can't imagine what would be professional about such a conversation. Having personal conversations with opposite sex coworkers is how affairs begin.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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BrainHurts: Yeah, DW is aware of the dynamic and the conversations, and this one in particular. You make it sound like these gals are pulling me aside and telling me stuff individually. It's not, it's during group discussions. I don't know how "intimate" I'd call the conversation. What many might consider intimate or private topics are often brought up. Sometimes in very humorous ways.

As for telling her, btw, I should probably go ahead and state that, with the advice so far being in the direction I was leaning anyway, I will not be telling her. You're right, she's 50, probably does (or should) know anyway, no need to poke my nose in (although I would still want to know if something like that were known about my W. But people usually don't want to get involved).

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MelodyLane: I guess I'll have to keep my guard up, then. No 1-on-1's with the women, got it...

Last edited by JThom; 07/20/12 03:32 PM.
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You could write a whole book with the stories of BS's on here whose WS cheated with a coworker. I could fill a couple pages myself.

It doesn't start like this. "Hey you have a nice rack." "Really, you have a great package. Wanna go to my car for lunch and get it on?"

It starts as a group lunch. As 'friendships.' It starts with general conversation that is not work related, and becomes ever increasingly more personal. She tells you she is having problems in her marriage, you relate with your own problems. Soon, you are getting a little flirty. Meanwhile, at home you are all of a sudden acutely aware that your spouse does NOT meet your needs. She's not the great wife you once thought, turns out! In fact, she's not really that good a wife at all. I wonder if my 'friend' is a good wife, I wonder if she better meets her H's needs...

And so on, and so forth. You have now entered...the fog.

As a married man, with proper boundaries, you need to protect yourself from this by not having any kind of personal relationship with female coworkers. If you are asked to have dinner or drinks after work, go golfing on the weekend, or whatever with this group, you should say no. Unless you invite your spouse and include her in the interactions.

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