Hubby has routines that he cycles through when he's not getting his way: sweet talk; tantrums (used rarely, but effectively in the past); deflecting; and "poor ME." I admit that my husband gets his way almost always because I don't like any of these routines. I am a peacekeeper, not a war-maker. But the inequities in our marital relationship have taken a toll. I'm opening my eyes and seeing things that were previously swept under the rug and left there for years.


He now tells me that I'm not meeting his need for companionship (i.e., one of the causes for his attachment to OW). He wants to spend more time with me. I agree. But I'm not the one dishing his plate so full that there isn't any room for me. When he invites me to spend time with him, he is vague about the details and no definitive plans are made.

This last week, our town hosted a one-week fair/carnival. We stated that we should probably attend one evening during that week. Thursday evening he came home from work and said, "are you ready to go?" Oh, I didn't realize we were going that night, so naturally I want to get ready to out with my hubby.

It takes about an hour for me to do the things a woman likes to do to look nice on a "date" with her man. But he didn't give me time to get ready because he started telling me all the reasons why we shouldn't go. It's so hot out; he doesn't know where OW is and he's afraid we might run into her at the carnival, that might be awkward for us, etc. etc. etc. This was sounding like a very unattractive adventure for us.

Then hubby told me his "friend" J is stopping by with his little girl. J is taking his dear daughter to the carnival and had an extra ticket. Next thing, J is in our driveway and coming in the house and his little girl played with our cat. Since I'm not ready yet, and it would be so miserable for me to go to the carnival, he would just ride along J. He manipulated the situation, and we did not spend the time together that he is always telling me that he would LOVE to spend with me. (Of course, I was suspicious that he had a date with OW.)

A similar situation occurred on Sunday and our tentative date did not happen. He was later bitten by a wasp and wasn't feeling good. He went to bed early. Later that evening my brother and sister invited me over to my brother's house so we could discuss a family matter related to an asset we own as tenants in common. It got late, and my niece showed up when she got off work at 12:30 AM. I visited with her a bit and stated it was very late and I wanted to get home, but my niece (whom I love and adore) asked me so very sweetly, "Oh Auntie, I want you to stay and visit longer! I never get a chance to visit with you anymore!" Of course I stayed! We put on another pot of coffee and chatted away about her kids and their silly antics. I was having a nice visit with my family.

When I left my brother's house and climbed in my vehicle, my hubby drove by me--at high speed. Oh! He was apparently angry because I stayed so late at my brother's house visiting and he was showing his anger!

When I arrived home, he was in the shower. (Why is he in the shower in the wee hours of the morning?) Then he emerged, stomped around and got himself dressed. Then he proceeded to yell at me that I had time to sit and visit with my family, but I didn't have any time to spend with HIM! Huh? He started slamming the book I ordered, HNHN, on the table over and over again screaming at me, "HIS NEEDS, HIS NEEDS!!! not just HER needs! you _____(bad word)." He screamed at me that he wanted a divorce because he couldn't take this anymore. He took a coffee cup and slammed it to the floor and it broke into a thousand pieces.

He went from his temper tantrum to his poor me routine. Amazingly, however, I was not a puddle of emotion. I was scared, of course, but I was not letting this outburst to have the effect he wanted. I saw it all for what it was--manipulation.

I explained to him that I don't do these things to him; I don't throw temper tantrums; I don't call him obscene names. It's not appropriate for him to do these things. This outburst was not about me spending time with my family or me NOT spending time with him. This was deflection. We could have a good marriage and I will meet all of his needs, but he must get OW out of our lives for good. I reminded him, however, that he refused to write the "no contact" letter that I needed for reassurance that he was serious about saving our marriage.

He explained to me that he didn't want to cause OW any trouble or have all of her friends think she is having an affair with a married man. I explained to him that his "no contact" letter would be sent to her. I would not "publish" the "no contact" letter to her facebook friends. I explained, the fact that HER feelings were more important to him than MY feelings spoke volumes to me.

We have not had peace since that happened. He's still trying to manipulate me with his bad behavior. He also deactivated his facebook account. I reactivated his account because I was keeping track of his social connections. If OW sends him a private message, I want to know. He changed his password and deactivated his account again, and I simply got a security number to reactivate and that caused another temper tantrum this morning. I believe he's trying to hide something from me by deactivating his account and I need truth and honesty.

He called me from work and screamed at me and told me to leave his FB account alone! He wants it deactivated forever! Because he was screaming at me, I hung up.

A while later, he was walking in the house yelling, "Yes! That's right! I own my business so I can come home during the day." He screamed at me about hanging up on him and then he left angry.

Like a stupid teenage driver, he apparently drove in a hot-headed manner and got into an accident. He called me to tell me. Oh? Is that my fault too? Good-bye.

He called me later, sounding like a very scared child--fearful that he will be arrested for reckless driving. I told him that I could not protect him from suffering the consequences of his unacceptable behavior. If he was truly driving crazy on a busy street and endangering other people's lives, then he must deal with the consequences! He's now triggering his "poor me" routine.

He called my brother a little while ago and wants to have a talk with my brother. Hubby told my brother that he needs help because he's an emotional wreck, and he doesn't know how to make me believe that his relationship with OW is over. My brother hasn't decided whether he will accept hubby's invitation for a talk, but if he does, he will tell my hubby the same things that I told him. He needs to end all contact with OW for life and commit to a solid plan to recover the marriage.

Right now, as much as I love my husband, I don't know if I want this marriage to continue. His behavior has been unacceptable to the nth degree. I don't know if he's capable of making the changes necessary to get control of his anger and to stop manipulating. I'm running on almost no sleep here!

I am also mindful that these things paint him in a very unattractive light. I want to concentrate on the good man that he usually is and all the good things that he does for me.

Kiddo, you are rapidly passing through "Plan-B-ville", and moving into, "TRO-town".

You need a lawyer. You need to tell her everything that you just told us.

We will not be pleased to read soon that he lost just a little more control and assaulted you, so do this for us, okay?

This is all typical garden variety wayward behaviour. It is great that you recognize it as manipulative but it will start to cause stress related health issues if you continue to just Plan A it.

Your WH can easily prove himself by taking a poly. Why won't he take a poly? That is a very easy solution.

Have you hired a PI?

Are you going to take any of our advice or just continue with Plan A until you have a nervous breakdown?

I am happy to see that you have your eyes open to this type of behavior, and are not allowing your WH to manipulate you with it or making excuses for it anymore.

But I am sorry to hear that your life is turned upside down.

Are you using snooping techniques to find out the truth about this A? I know you don't want to post them, for fear your WH will see what you are doing.

What part of the 'stick' of Plan A are you doing? What are you doing to run off this OW? What are you doing to protect your marital assets?

Are you preparing for a good Plan B?

You cannot stay in this situation much longer, it is very abusive and damaging to you.

You are right, the fact that your H is fighting you tooth and nail about a NC letter, polygraph, etc. IS telling, it is telling you that he has a SSL with this woman and he is afraid that the roof is about to blow off of his secret life with OW.

Thank you all.

I have found good PI firm that can start work on a moment's notice. It's expensive, so I want to start the expenditure clock ticking at a time when I believe the efforts will be most fruitful. He wants to go to an out-of-state trade show soon, and I believe he is using that for an excuse to spend time with OW. That's when I want PI firm to start work. Through my own detective work, I have tracked down the address of the place where I believe the OW is staying.

I believe I have a very good handle on where he is at all times. My family members lend support and drive by his business often to report whether his vehicle is there. I don't know, but I'm thinking his "gaslighting" episodes are related to the fact that he knows he is being monitored and he's not free to live his second second life.

When he manipulated the situation so he could go to the fair/carnival without me, I suspected that he was meeting OW for a date. I prepared myself with camera to drive up to the residence where I believe she is staying and to park down the street to see for myself if hubby was on date with OW. My plan was foiled when hubby arrived home sooner than expected.

I need help to develop Plan B.

My situation is that I live in boom town with extreme housing shortage. My hubby and I bought our current house at just the right time--before prices skyrocketed. Our house payment is very reasonable so I want to stay in my house.

His parents live about a half block from me. He can easily stay with them.

Given our situation, do I just get a court order and have him removed from our home, or do I start with a letter outlining what he needs to do? Not sure, given my circumstances, how to properly develop and implement a Plan B. I also need to consider that I could possibly trigger an explosion if Plan B is not implemented carefully. I don't want my husband driving his truck into a bridge. He's on the edge right now and has made sorrowful comments like that while doing his "poor me" thing.

I have read so much, but my brain isn't working now.

With respect to our finances, our house is in both of our names; our vehicles are in his name; his business and business accounts are in his name; and I have personal assets in my name that are not entirely liquid at this point. I have one asset that I can cash in, but it will take 4 to 6 weeks for the paperwork to be processed and to get a check in my hand. I personally have ownership interests in oil wells and there is litigation pending concerning lease contracts. Thus, I have chosen to have my royalties placed in suspension until litigation is settled or goes to trial in a couple of months. My husband has substantial income from his business. Short term, I may need financial assistance from hubby; long-term I believe I will be okay.

Ulimately, however, I want to be with my husband. My goal is for us to be together so I want my Plan B designed to give that goal the best possible chance of being realized.

Okay Deb, glad to hear you starting to thrash a plan out.

I'm not a vet, but they will correct me if I am wrong.

Step one is getting your evidence. This will help you if you need Plan B. How soon is the trade show? You really shouldn't be Plan A'ing for much longer. If this show is weeks off, how about arranging a night for you to visit family. Give WH a few days notice so he can make plans with OW. Set up VAR's in the house, his car, GPS in his car, even get the PI on the job for that night so you don't get involved in any confrontations.

Once you have your evidence, I would re-expose. At this stage WH seems to be minimising the A. Spinning his own story, they become the masters of spin. With evidence you take this away from him, and show his selfishness for what it is. Especially given he is using your marital funds for his skank.

Then enter Plan B. Its good you are starting to think about getting your ducks in a row. Plan B needs to be well-thought out.

Oh Deb, I remember this time post D Day. The confusion and trying to get to grips with our new reality is devestating. Combined with our poor bodies showing our distress... sleep, appetite and behaviour are usually effected. Please make sure you take care of yourself.

Damn right you stay in the house. Plan B is about offering your WH a map with directions to find his way back to you and the life he had with you. Whilst you get on with your life with peace and begin healing. So DON'T move out. He is the one committing adultery, and a consequence of that may be getting evicted.

Make sure you don't give any warning about Plan B. WH should not know and have time to prepare. Don't let your adversaries know you have a battle plan.

Most Plan B'ers on here that I have read have simply packed WH's things, sat them outside or had a relative collect them, and changed the locks, no Court Order needed. Ensure WH has the Plan B letter, which outlines what he has to do to earn recovery. This also acts as protection should WH contact solicitors or police about being locked out. This letter shows you are simply protecting yourself and setting boundaries.

Where WH goes is not your concern as hard as this is. I know it takes time to try to detach, but you need the tough love approach and let the consequences rain down on WH. I am glad you see his "poor me" routine as pure manipulation. You are not responsible for his actions, only your own. And actually Deb, you want exposure and Plan B to help WH hit rock bottom. It is only when a wayward hits rock bottom that they pay attention to what is actually in that Plan B letter and see this as the way to climb back up.

Speak with a solicitor before entering Plan B. Make sure you have your ducks in a row and have protected yourself financially as best you can. Also ensure you are getting copies of all finances, etc.

Having a plan, particularly with finances, will help the effectiveness of your Plan B.

Because you do not want your marital funds to be financing WH with OW in a "love nest" , buying her a car and taking her on a cruise somewhere.

Instead, you want him to be down at the bank, trying to organise a line of credit. OW may not be so impressed when WH's finances become threatened.

Also you have this?

How To Plan B Properly

Deb,

I see you have read up about gaslighting and recognize that is what your husband is doing.

Definitely get ready for Plan B. Don't dilly-dally too long about it. It sounds as if now is the perfect time for Plan B.

AM

I would confirm the location of OW's apartment and, with evidence in hand, speak to an attorney about your options. Get your financials in order and then Plan B--possibly filing for a divorce at the same time.

It likely doesn't matter whose name the accounts or vehicles are in--it's all marital property, but confirm with an attorney.

Deb. How long are you going to wait to try and get that picture of the two of them together? I agree that you need to try...but unless they are in a compromising position...WH will just explain it away with some wayward babble.

I think you have enough evidence to demand that WH commit to NC for life, write a NC letter, and take a poly. That is what it will take to keep YOU interested in reconciling. I would put it in a pre-plan B letter format that spells out clearly what you expect from him and also shows your willingness to work on the M once he agrees. Get your Plan B ducks in a row.

Get to work on protecting your finances. Keep up the excellent PI work you are doing. You never know when or where you will find something but don't let your finances be squandered at the same time.

Could the trade show be a cruise?

Stay strong. You are a smart woman and you can do this.
(((hugs)))

I have been sleeping maybe 2 or 3 hours at a time and then waking up in a sweaty mess. Then I'm up for hours and hours and can't get back to sleep.

My husband wanted to have a talk with me yesterday morning. I could tell that he was as emotionally and physically exhausted as me. He begged me to end this "madness" and to work on our marriage. I listened to him, but remained skeptical.

I feel like he is just using his "manipulation magic" to convince me to revert to his loving wife with her head in the sand so he can continue with his secret life. He admitted, in his warped thinking, that he believed he could juggle his life so he could have both me and OW. And, of course he was successful in his juggling act because the nature of his work gave him a million reasons for being absent from our home.

Hubby also stated that HE feels betrayed and used by OW because OW was on a cruise with HER former boyfriend. Hard for me to sympathize with his heartache over OW, and I'm not convinced that she's on a cruise. (After all, why would hubby inform me that he was concerned about running into OW at the carnival if she was truly on a cruise with her former boyfriend?) So what now? Is hubby telling me that I am his consolation prize? Hubby may have lost OW, but at least he still has me kind of thing? Thanks a lot, dear hubby!

According to hubby, OW told him that she was going on cruise with her former boyfriend, not because she had romantic feeling for former boyfriend, but because the cruise was already paid for. If true that OW told him this, it seems that skanky OW is trying to keep my hubby on her hook. But, I don't hold anything that hubby says as having any credibility.

I asked my hubby if he was in love with OW and he said he didn't know. He also said his affair with OW began in December 2011 (which, if true, explains the many months of hubby stressing me out with his unhappiness). It just boggles my mind to think about all the time hubby was spending with OW when he was lying to me about his activities.

He told me that he has self-esteem issues, and when he first saw me, he thought I was one of the most beautiful, classiest women he had ever seen. He didn't think he would ever have a chance to be with someone like me. And he thinks, if I had not been vulnerable when we first met because my father had just died, etc., that I would never have looked twice at him. (I can hear violins playing in the background!)

Poor hubby, allegedly never feeling "good enough" to be with me that he was forced to seek out illicit relationship with skanky woman to make himself feel better.

I don't believe the things he told me during our conversation, but I was careful not to argue with him and I did not point out any inconsistencies in his story.

At least he's not throwing tantrums at this moment (I believe he wore himself out emotionally with his own gaslighting), and I finally got some sleep!!!!

During our conversation, he said he wanted to spend time with me. He was setting aside this coming Sunday to spend with me and we would do whatever I wanted to do. After I woke up from my long slumber, hubby asked me if it would be okay to go out on Saturday evening instead so he could go to an out-of-town auction with his Dad on Sunday. So predictable!

I have my eyes wide open and don't believe that hubby's affair with OW is over.

We have peace right now so that I can "Plan A" a little longer while PI gathers evidence to establish affair is still ongoing. In meantime, I need to continue putting my ducks in order to formulate and establish an effective "Plan B."

Deb,

You are right. This is not even close to being over. Stay with the plan. Sounds as if you did a good Plan A job - avoiding lovebusting.

Check out where he really is on Sunday.

AM

If he is at a point of saying he is done with OW, why not ask him for a NCletter, polygraph, and EPs?

He has already refused to write an NC letter. He is not done with ow. He wants both his wife and skanky ow.

AM

ok, Deb, I am getting very alarmed here because we are now DAYS into this and you still have not taken any steps to bust him. WHY NOT? Instead you are making long posts about his fogbabble.

This is a waste of time and a distraction from taking necessary steps. You need to spy on your husband, get the goods and end this drama. Hire the PI and get the goods. Then expose the affair. Posting his drama will not resolve this sitution. He is still in touch with the OW, probably going by her house every day, and you need to flush this out.

Do you have a GPS on his car? If not, go buy a zoombak and put it on his car TODAY: http://www.zoombak.com/store-locator/us/

Hire the PI and get him following your husband NOW. There is nothing to wait for. Please stop posting his fogbabble. It will not help your marriage.

Deb, is the PI actually working NOW? And do you have a GPS on your husbands vehicle?

Another thing that concerns me is why would your husband remove his facebook page and state his concern that you would expose to the OW's facebook page unless he is reading here? He is reading here, isn't he?

That would explain his anxiety right now. He is in withdrawal because he is reading here about the PI?

It is certainly possible he is reading here. Deb told H about the MB website a couple of weeks ago. I don't think she told him about her thread, but it would be easy enough to find, if he were looking.

AM