Yes, like I said Plan Unwritten. I considered Plan Indie too. Tumultuous relationships in H's family. I assumed they'd blame me. That my dad would beat him into a new shape. I thought our friends and my family would see me as a victim and foolish to fight for us. That my female friends would be supportive.



I was guessing too. Listening to fear just as you are. I was totally wrong. My female friends had been lying to me as they knew and needed to be Plan B'd. H's Dad was wayward and needed to be Plan B'd. The rest of his family was monumentally supportive and so glad I was being honest with them. My dad was impressed at how tough I was being. Everyone said exposure was brave, clever and was flushing out so many secrets and fake friends.

I could never have guessed. But Dr H knew.

Plus even if I had been totally right, it isn't OK to lie to people. Or to treat your recovery like a dirty secret.

And exposure is not for ending an affair, so I'm not sure why you think that. It can do, but it's main purpose is to set a firm foundation for an honest, open and supported recovery.

But 20yr has just told you. He gave you a really good tip. He says that asking for sex to be instigated and then turning it down is probably confusing.

So just accept the constructive criticism instead of talking about how straightforward you have been for the last 15 years.

No one cares. 20yrs was talking about your last post, not the last 15 years.

No one on this forum is keeping a big 'how much I admire Unwritten' scoreboard so you don't have to impress us with past points from over 15 years.

Just take the tip on board.

Sorry to contadict, but Dr. H has said many times on the radio program (most recently yesterday) that the main reason for exposure is to expedite an end to the affair. The second reason is to gain support for the BS. So, there is reason for exposure even if recovery is hopeless. Also in some cases, total exposure to everyone is not necessary, if it doesn't serve to either end the affair or support the BS.

Yes it is one of the best ways to end an A. But that is not it's sole purpose. It ends the A because it sets the scene for a good recovery. The couple have support.

Saving the marriage is now not just possible but what their supporters are urging and insisting upon. And one of the key reasons for exposure is that this support 'gives the BS the stamina to hold out for recovery'

Unwritten's stamina is constantly flagging and she talks about a D or throwing in the towel a lot. Its hardly surprising given the secret, stressful nature of their recovery.

Her family does not know. Keeping that secret would be a major strain for anybody. He has not told his family - actually not ONE person in his life. That will cause major resentment for Unwritten as she watches that consequence get skipped and no one but her is holding him accountable.

Telling the planet is not necessary of course. Estranged friends etc. But telling close family members is. People who are there for them as a family as 'great grandparents' do not deserve to be lied to. If they react badly, its because its bad news and there is some blame to be doled out here. If they are unsupportive, that's their call, but let's not 'guess' that's what they are going to do. That's a DJ.

He hasn't told ONE person in his life? Why not? Shame, over honesty that's why not. That's unrepentant.

Unwritten hasn't exposed and put the plan in place because of the same bog-standard reason most people don't do it. Misplaced shame on herself and fear of what the WS will think if it affects his relationships.

Her own EAs have to be exposed too, of course. Which I think is where the fear is creeping in re being blamed.

Sorry Indie. We are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. Like I said, I spent much time weighing the pros and cons of exposure at this point, and the benefits do not weigh more than the added strain it would put on our volatile situation right now. I won't deny that's Plan Unwritten.

I DID expose to all of my closest friends, (and one of H's). But you are right that I did not expose to our families, and don't plan to.

I do disagree with you that I am 'lying' to my family. There are many things about my life, my health, etc. that they don't know, and I don't think they need to know. It is my choice what parts of my life I bring them into, not my duty. And the same is true for them. So how am I lying to them to not tell them about the struggles in my marriage? I just don't see it that way.

I have heard this too. I have also heard Dr H say that he recommends exposure, even for past affairs. So, guess I just made a choice. In this case, I do not feel that exposure would serve either of these purposes, it would only cause more havoc for us.

Yes H not telling anyone has been a source of resentment for me. Along with about a bajillion other things. The resentment I am putting down and walking away from, for recovery.

I won't deny I am a 'ya but...' kinda girl, lol.

But in reference to this post. There have been a handful of people jumping in the last day or so that I do not believe followed previous discussions about SF. I got the impression that 20 Years thinks that the source of our SF issues lies with the fact that I am sending completely mixed signals. I was not trying to get some score on a score board, just trying to point out that this is not the 'source' of the problem, but rather one of the recent results of my attempts to get to the source. Ya know?

I have NO idea how anyone would have admiration for me on this board. With all the dirty laundry I air. Saying that I have been a willing participant yet been rejected for sex for 15 yrs is NOT something I would assume to be admired for.

I asked Dr. H. on the private forum about some kind of exposure in our case. D-Day for us happened a couple of weeks after we moved overseas. I had no one, no phone, no internet at that time, so the only person in the world I had to tell was our chaplain, so I could get some help and support. Once we had Internet at our house, I also told my one very good friend back home, because I knew she and her H would pray for us and keep it to themselves.

H sent a no contact letter to skank OW a week later and that was that. We jumped into MB right away. So no one else knew at that time of the devastation. Dr. H. advised me that at some point we should tell our grown daughter and son-in-law, so they would understand the danger to their own marriage. He told me the purpose of exposure is to shed light on an egregious act in order to hopefully end the A and to garner support for the BS.

Since the A had ended and we were in recovery, there was now no need for exposure, except as we saw fit for the circumstance.

At this time, we have not yet told our daughter; we live far away and believe we need to find the "right time" to do so. We will certainly do so at some point.

If H had not worked very hard on recovery with me and if I had left him because of that, then I would expose to family and close friends the reason for the separation. But at this point, per Dr. H. we have not exposed. Our recovery is going well. H is fully on board, and greatly helps.

I didn't say that the source of your SF issue lies with the fact he may be getting mixed signals. You said that.
What I said was is that he might be 'generally' confused as to what you want or expect. I am just going off what you have posted.

Again, we are EASILY confused. He might think he is in a lose, lose situation and can never win.

The point I am trying to make is that it appears you are putting things under a microscope analyzing every single tiny dynamic every day which is occurring�picking him apart (DJ? Maybe...maybe)

You are going to kill yourself doing this. It appears that if he doesn�t do exactly what you want, exactly the way you want it you are critical of him (maybe not to his face but at least on this board). This might be directly or indirectly. It could be consciously or subconsciously.

Point is we men like to keep things simple. SIMPLE! Yes, EN�s are critical. I get that. It sounds like he is making some effort. Maybe not enough. Maybe not in EXACTLY the right way for you but he is trying. You said so yourself. You are going in the right direction.

I really think if you back off a little, have FUN day in and day out, take off the pressure of expectations things will get better. If he didn�t love you and want this to work, why would he still be there with you?

Defending yourself with us will do no good. I am just going off what you are posting and if I am was your husband and you conduct yourself with him the way you do here, you would be pushing me away.

Ease up. Have some fun. Relax. Enjoy life.

Have to work today so no time to MB. My husband and I thank each other for any little thing that we appreciate. It helps a lot. There is not resentment if a one thank you is missed because so many are given.

Admiration is definitely important to both of you right now. If your husband opens the cover of SAA you should tell him you appreciate it. Don't ask him how many chapters he read or what he is going to implement before you decide whether what he did is worthy of appreciation.

He should come home every day and look for what you did during the day and thank you. If your house is generally clean so he cannot see a mess is gone he might have to give you a general thank you for keeping the house straight. Alternatively, if there is a pile of dishes in the sink instead of complaining he should look at the dishes notice what you made the kids for lunch and thank you for making the kids lunch. And then start washing the dishes in hopes of getting a loving thank you with a kiss from you.

Saying "thank you" is simple and powerful. And essential to meet your admiration needs.

20YearHistory, wonderful posts.

That's my understanding too. Not billboard ads - but close people need to know. I am not sure what people are waiting for though. What did Dr H tell you to wait for?

I'm just saying that everyone gets bashed with 2x4s on their thread. I do, you do, it's why were here.

So how are you putting it right? Resentment over a lack of exposure can't be swept under the rug. You have to use the MB tools. Exposure is there specifically to dissipate this type of resentment.

If you plan to do Plan Unwritten and not the MB plan, just let me know so I can wish you luck with that.

Your H not telling a soul and you being resentful about that is not MB.

I would also like to hear about what happened with the DS itinery.

I didn't make it clear that Dr. H. did not advise me to wait. He just said we should tell her. He knew we lived far away from our family and didn't address the "when" of telling, but only that she should know, so they would understand the importance of protecting their own marriage, especially since they have four children and are therefore even more at risk of not meeting each others ENs without great effort.

We considered telling her when we came for our visit last year, but then an entire year would have passed during which there would have been little opportunity to mend that relationship.

So at the moment, this particular exposure is on hold until we have a good opportunity. But my H is fully into recovery, so for me there is no feeling any longer that he "got away" with something terribly egregious; he has done some very hard work for recovery. That makes a big difference.

I am sure he is confused. Because I am confused. I don't even know what I'm doing.


YES. I am putting everything under a microscope. My clothes. My weight. My PA. The amount of time I spend working out every day. Every sexual thing I say or do. Every sexual interaction we have. Am I dressing the way he desires? Is my PA up to standard? Am i putting enough effort into my workouts? Am I being too aggressive, too demanding? Am I being too confusing? I am, in fact, picking MYSELF apart far more than I am picking my H apart.


I don't even know what fun is anymore. Especially in regards to SF. It used to be fun, carefree, awesomeness to me. Now it is just one big complicated headache. SF in association with H has turned into one big complicated mess, at the end of which I feel like I am an epic fail, one way or the other.

I never said he didn't love me, or 'want' this to work. But wanting is not action.



I am pushing him away. Physically and mentally pushing him away. It isn't what I want to do. I just don't know how to fix this anymore. I AM jumping through hoops and now because of that I am confusing him and taking things too seriously. This IS serious to me. He brought up SF last night and I started to cry. I DON'T CRY. Why I am getting so damn emotional about something that used to be so GOOD. Sex, used to be GOOD. Now it is just one big ball of things that make me want to cry. I am turning him down, because I don't even WANT to have sex with him right now. All it does is make me feel confused, and bad, and all things not good.


You are 100% right 20 Years. I am way overboard on over analyzing this. I have been trying everything, overanalyzing everything, trying to make this better. And in doing so, I have just made myself a basket case. Chalk this up as one more thing that is unattractive about me. I have done MORE damage than was there in the first place.

Meanwhile, H has done nothing. Am I being too hard on him for that? That everything he has agreed to do on his end to fix this has been just completely ignored?

I have some great days, great weeks, where I am happy and excited about recovery, and looking for the good in everything. But for me, I have major crashes from that. Related to lack of UA time? or some kind of LBing on H's part? IDK, I just crash. I come down from the high and I just crash and want to say F it, I'm done. Clearly, that's where I am this week.

Resentment over everything has to be walked away from, to recover. Whether that is resentment over the many facts surrounding the affair or resentment over the fact that he didn't expose himself to a bunch of people. If I thought he should now and needed that to move on in recovery, then I would make that a requirement. But I don't. That's my choice.

When we do the online program with a coach, or counsel with SH, I will ask him his opinion on this. I have NOT gotten the same message you are sending Indie from Dr H, so forgive me if you think I am not listening to you, I am going by what I have understood Dr H to say.

I have never heard Dr H say that exposure is there specifically to dissipate resentment.

If you feel that the my unwillingness to do a further exposure of our infidelities is so rebelliouis on my part you want to stop posting to me, well, I will miss you my friend. Because I value your opinions very, very highly. But on this topic, I do not agree.

Unwritten, girl, I think you are burnt out. I went back to your first post and I am amazed that you have lasted this long. Yes, I think you are getting so overwhelmed and thinking (analyzing) too much.
I would suggest that you and your hubby take a nice week long vacation if possible as you both need to regroup and refocus and if you are still not any further from where you were on your first post
Then I would consider filing those papers. Dr. Harley has said that if your marriage has not improved in 2 years then chances are they won't. It's almost the end of the summer...

Hugs
~RQ

So to sum up, he told you to do it and you haven't gotten around to it. So not doing it was not his advice at all.