***EDIT***

This is a warning that no more non Harley material should be posted.

Small BIG Victory. Finally successful in reaching POSOM's mom. She didn't sound too happy and said she "certainly will" persuade POS to stop the A. Also stated she will "do what she can".

At least the seed is planted, hope it does something.

Only time for this right now, will follow up on previous posts later tonight. Just wanted to share.

Good. Hopefully she will call your wife and tell her she will never be welcomed by her sons family.
That is good.
Is your wife whoring around tonight?

No reaction from WW regarding POS Mom doing any persuading. I'm just hoping she hasn't gotten a hold of him yet, vs. not talking to him or ?.

Gave my WW the stick tonight, here's how it went down:

"I know your lying"
"about what?"
"Everything. I know your still having an affair. I know you want this (D), but me and DD don't. If you don't stop the A, we will get a D, we won't be friendly, we won't be doing things all together, we won't see each other, the last time I will see you will be in D court."
"Fine, that's what I want. So you'll sign the papers?"
"I said what I had to say" <left room>

About a minute later, she came out to living room and asks again "So you'll sign the papers?" Then something about how, since I'm fine with getting a D then I should be ready to sign the papers."

"I'm not going to talk about that with you. I said what I had to say. If you don't stop the A, we won't be doing things together, not birthdays, not holidays, nothing."

"That's fine, I don't want to see you anyway. Your and F'n idiot and you just don't get it (about getting D). I'll have DD 3 days and you'll have her 3days and we'll alternate the 4 day."

I asked her if her "ice cream was good?" (we had bought a box of Dove bar type ice creams tonight, and she had one before our talk). This distractor worked great and really threw her off. Reverse babble! I was happy I did this and it worked the way it did!

"Yeah, why did you do something to it?"
"Yeah, to a brand new box, that was unopened. No I didn't do anything to it."
"What the F does that matter?"
"Just curious if it was good, I was thinking about having one"
"Have one, that's why we got it"
"Anyway, who cares about the F'n Ice cream. So you'll sign the papers?" and the then some other Bovine S that I just ignored and/or can't remember.
She finally left and went to bed. Probably to text to that POS.

I probably missed a few things. Had the VAR going, and trying to put them in my pc, but I'm getting an error message and it's not copying. I'm freakin out, because I had our 1.5 hour talk from 2 Saturdays ago which was a calm talk about what happened, why we are where we are, and alot more. And I might not even be able to access it anymore. But her demeanor towards me was extremely hateful and pissed (of course). She has been super volatile lately and spewing hatred in short bursts. But tonights was pure evil and hatred.

So, I can't decide which hurts more, feeling raw hatred from the person I was supposed to spend the rest of my life with or knowing she is so lodged in the A with a person she's known for almost 2 months now.

Is this normal? Are they (WS) still recoverable when they are this far gone? Is this the kind of stuff I still should soldier through while attempting a valiant Plan A?

Best Plan A I can do right now is do external things like keep the house clean, take care of myself and DD, but I just don't see doing the flower thing or saying I Love you, etc. I mean she REALLY hates me right now. Not from any one thing specific, just in general. It almost seems like the things she is saying is stuff she's heard POS saying to her. I can hear it in the way she was saying things.

The hard part is I don't feel I ever did anything to earn such hatred. Always been EXTREMELY faithful. Being cheated on in my last M ingrained what was already inside me, which is to never make anyone feel this kind of pain. Never even had OS friends or even work with any. The she pulls all this, and I'm the one that's hated?!

OH, I also told her it was **edit" up to lie to her DD and leave us to go spend time with that POS.
She replied with something like "I'm just doing what I'll be doing later anyway, she'll be with you 3 nights, so she might as well get used to it now."

Only, it's been 5 straight days she's lied or didn't tell the whole story to go spend time with this POS.


Still would really like to hear opinions on the flyer handing out at POS work and thoughts on whether to put up signs in front of his house every day while he is at work for while and/or "protest" in front of his house. (Kind of don't want to do that since POS house is in the lower income type area (aka bad-ish part of town, and also may be kind of embarrassing for me?)

Got some lawyer names from my lawyer friend. Need to check them out.

• What am I looking for in a lawyer? Yes I know get an agressive one, but how can I tell that?
• What kind of questions do I ask regarding them and my marital situation?
• Arguments for/against having male or female lawyer on my side?
• Two referred are women, one is a fairly new lawyer and am told by lawyer friend she will be cheaper. Neither one of us is anywhere near a position to get the best money can buy kind of lawyer. Is it better to pay more for the veteran lawyer?
• What should I be asking for in terms of the D? (We rent a house, each of us has a car, household goods, etc. Don't see who gets what being much of an issue.)
• Will I be able to prevent that POS from being around my DD?
• Lawyers certainly aren't free, so lets say we start this D ball rolling, costs start incurring (I have no money), and I implement Plan B, and eventually the A fails or she snaps out of it, All the lawyer costs will still have to be paid?

She acts this way because you act as a mirror. She does not hate you, but what you reflect back at her. Remember this. It will help you in following the plans.

IMO it is too extreme and I can see things not working out in your favour.

I could see police / security getting involved at his work or your safety put at risk in his neighbourhood.

I think you need to read Art of War. Trying to invade OM's territory at this point is not a good strategy.


I have only popped in and out of your thread, so apologies if I have missed somthing. I will go back and catch up. Meanwhile, have you exposed to OM's workplace using the notable posts workplace exposure letter? And who else did you expose to on OM's side?

2l2l, I am glad you are showing a fighting spirt... just be careful you don't exhaust yourself in battle. Fight a strategic fight.

Can you explain further? I'm not geting what your are trying to say here.

The point is, you haven't done anything to earn this hatred. She has committed adultery, is abandoning the moral life she once led, and looking at you, she sees this. You remind her of what she is doing, of who she has become.

You continue to show her the life she can still choose to live... you show this by example. Your example confuses her. The easiest way waywards deal with the internal confusion is to spew venom at the betrayed for making her feel bad.

Caracal makes a good point about the cause of her anger toward you, 2L.

As long as she has decided to abandon any semblance of a moral/ethical life, your maintaining such a standard is a silent affront and rebuke to her own choice of action.

Smile through her tirades without responding in kind. She's wallowing in the sty of pig-shi+ she compiled, and would like nothing more than to drag the man wearing a clean suit in with her.

My wife would flip me off in the house. She used to wait until the kids couldn't see her do it. Then her hatred became so strong she couldn't control herself and she would tell me to go "f*** yourself and burn in f***** hell. I hope you do".
Then she would apologize a few minutes later. Then do it again.

I encourage you to Plan B.
Your wife is abusive. She teases you before she goes on dates and speaks degrading o you.
If in doubt email the Radio Show and ask Dr Harley. I seriously doubt he would encourage you to take that abuse for long.

You did a GREAT job of not engaging her. You told her she was lieing and then disengaged. That was real good. She will become more desperate in attempts to engage you so just always be on your toes.

As for the VAR you may be able to ask the manufacturer tech support for help

LOL. My wife told me she was going to "cover herself in condoms" and have sex with lots of men. I think she and your wife should meet; they could be real good friends.

As for the sign. Let me ask you: is the OM the problem? Or is it your wife's behavior.
A spouse of an alcoholic may hate the local bar that serves alcohol to the alcoholic. But where is the real issue?
I don't think picketing his apartment will help you maritally or legally

Meet with the attorney and you'll get a better idea of how well you'll be able to work with them.

Many include a clause in their papers that says that there are no overnight non-related opposite-sex visitors allowed in the home while the child is there.

Go for as much custody (percentage-wise) as you can. This impacts child support payments.

You should be seeking alimony as well.

Make sure you are keeping a journal/log of how often she leaves the house. You want to be able to show just how infrequent her encounters are with her own child.

HDW did that and it, eventually, worked in his favor.

The answer, in a tone that shows that you think she's absolutely freaking nuts, is

"You think I'd sign anything that you prepared? Not happening. Want some ice cream?"

Got some lawyer names from my lawyer friend. Need to check them out.
[list] What am I looking for in a lawyer? Yes I know get an agressive one, but how can I tell that? You can't. Lawyers are like any profession. You have good employees and bad employees.

[*] What kind of questions do I ask regarding them and my marital situation? The questions I would ask is how you can legally get her out of the house. (Plan B). Also tell the lawyer you will be requesting a Guardian ad Litem (GAL) and custody evaluation.

[*]Arguments for/against having male or female lawyer on my side? I don't think it matter. Courts operate on rule of law. Not the mans hairstyle or women's legs.

[*]Two referred are women, one is a fairly new lawyer and am told by lawyer friend she will be cheaper. Neither one of us is anywhere near a position to get the best money can buy kind of lawyer. Is it better to pay more for the veteran lawyer? Again experience doesn't mean they are good at their job.

[*]What should I be asking for in terms of the D? (We rent a house, each of us has a car, household goods, etc. Don't see who gets what being much of an issue.). The only thing you need to care about is custody. Your wife is spiraling downwards with her self destructive behaviors and you need to protect your child.

[*]Will I be able to prevent that POS from being around my DD? Possibly in the short term. However it is unlikely you can long term barring some evidence that he poses a potential threat.

[*]Lawyers certainly aren't free, so lets say we start this D ball rolling, costs start incurring (I have no money), and I implement Plan B, and eventually the A fails or she snaps out of it, All the lawyer costs will still have to be paid? Yes of course. Court costs are also paid. If you want to you can use Divorce as Plan B. people get divorced and remarried all the time. And remember even if the affair dies she would need to agree to extraordinary precautions and recovery. She may never agree to that.

I think you misunderstood this aspect of the original post. She was not asking how her a** looked, she was only asking what I thought about her shoes or lipstick color. I took it as, why does it matter if what I think since you're not wearing it/them for me?

Anyway,

Ultimately, I don't want a D, so why would I file for one? Is it necessary to enact Plan B? There's so many major decisions that need to be made such as do I or don't I go to work. If I do, how will I get there, do I pull my DD out of her 3days, 3hrs pre-school to put her in daycare? We can't even afford the pre-school. Is there someone or agency that I can go to that gives guidance on stuff like this? All these major, potentially life-long effect decisions to make and I can barely decide if I should eat or not.

Well, yes and no. Regardless, I was under the impression that whatever I can do to cause turmoil in their adulterous A I should. I want to ruin this guy as much and as bad as I legally can. One of these days I'm going to figure out which bar they are at and report him for drunk driving. Any other tips on ruining someone?

When I talked to POS's mom, I didn't have my letter in front of me and likely missed some key points. I did state they work together, are having an A, trying to save M, we have a (almost) 4yo DD and trying to save her future as well. Please do what you can to persuade POS to stop the A.

I also failed to give her any of my contact info and had called under *67 in case she was avoiding calls from my number.

My question is, should I follow up with anything. Do I contact her again to see if she was able to talk to him and what he had to say. Do I just not contact her again? OR ?