Filing for a divorce is partly psychological. For her. It shows her that you won't tolerate this BS and that you're going to go for full custody and alimony should it come down to it. She needs to know you're not messing around.

Borrow the money if you have to. Put it on a credit card. You need to play hard ball.

I Would also be telling her she needs to pony up for daycare since you need to be looking for a job.

Part of what complicates your situation is that you are completely dependent on her financially. Did you say that she has all the money in her bank account in her name???

You've got to find a way to get a kick a$$ lawyer. Your dependency on her is part of what's making you so vulnerable here.

These other guys had work and money and were able to leverage their positions with more confidence. How can you get on better footing. NOW.

This is mostly what I was counting on. I feel it's the next best thing to kicking her out (which would be PB no?).

But I can't seem to grasp the concept of doing carrot and stick of PA (or mostly stick since she won't stop) when MB says to do Plan A for up to 6 months or so while "competing" with POS and waiting for A to die a natural death, and also filing for D at the same time, and all the while doing the carrot portion?

There's a farmers market close to her work, and I have to be down there anyway near lunch time. I was thinking of going early to get these flowers they sell there for $5 (a huge bunch of flowers for $5, its a great deal) and maybe attaching a note or card to them saying "I love you!" and dropping them off at her work, asking the desk to have her come down to get them. Keep in mind she's been getting ANGRY and frustrated that I'm "trying" and having hope for our M. Is this a good move? Changes to plan? Don't do at all?

Oh, and yes, I'm 100% dependent on her financially. When my DD was born, the economy tanked, and my small business was involved in housing and building, and we all know how that market has been going the last 4 years (in the US), so I shut down my business to SAHD. She makes fairly good money and most importantly has medical insurance. This is why I feel I can't further expose her at work. If she loses her job and medical, there's no where for us to go and no insurance. I can't subject my DD to that. So Yeah, I think it's a big factor that is different than most here (being financially dependent on WW). I was looking for night and weekend work, but someone mentioned it might be better to just stay at home. But we are barely scraping by with the money we make now, and now have the added cost of DD's preschool. I think regardlesss I need to start getting an income.

Reading on effects of SAHDs, one thing I read was that even though the arrangement is generally agreed upon between spouses, mentally, it can be a detrimental factor that the male who is historically considered to be the bread winner, is no longer providing for the family financially. FWIW.

Yes, and no. Filing for divorce is to protect yourself. Divorce has multiple stages and it will be a while until it's too late to stop it.

I don't believe she yet understands that she's about to live a life of kids every other weekend and alimony/child support docking half of her take-home pay. Getting served divorce papers will make it a reality.

I'm in the same situation--D is already filed and final. Plan A still works. If the other person's in love with you, D doesn't really matter that much. If the other person isn't in love with you, being legally married doesn't make things any better.

The goal of Plan A is to create the conditions that let your spouse fall in love with you.

That's a great idea. Gifts/notes/flowers will meet your W's need for affection.

Receiving anger/frustration at you meeting her needs is normal. Unless it's a need that requires her consent (e.g. affectionate touching), don't read too much into the anger. I was told back when the affair was going that my notes were meaningless. But she kept every single one of them.

Hmm.

Plan A is eliminating love busters while being the kind of guy that she'd want to be married to. It also means that you are not a doormat and will (without angry outburts, etc.) show her what will happen if the adultery continues. In your case, you told her that you'd divorce if it continues. I just don't think she really gets that yet which turns it back to you to emphasize in some form or another.

Plan A sucks, plain and simple, when you're getting stepped on at the same time. That's why there's a time limit to it.


Yes to the flowers.


Understood, but (you knew there was a but) there is COBRA and Medicaid if you really get down on your luck. Besides, no one said that the consequences of adultery were going to be pleasant.


Maybe to an extent, but there are plenty of SAHM's that are in the same position and rely on the court system to force the wayward to provide financial support.



...and the cost of booze and bar food that your WW is racking up every evening. Don't forget that added expense.

It seems she's pretty well committed to getting a D. Just found more papers with her trying to figure out costs, what days for custody, more of who gets what, things that will need name change, DD's costs, WW costs, fixed and varialbe /mo costs.

Is she too far "gone" for me not to go file D? I don't see Plan A saving this M before she tries to file in what appears to be a fairly mutual D, but doesn't take into consideration anything about spousal support, child support and whatever else I may be entitled to. Looks like she is trying to keep it amicable, probably mostly to keep this out of the hands of attorneys.

Filing for divorce is part of the stick of plan A. You file first. You've got to do this to get the upper hand in the divorce. You can pace the divorce if you file first.

It's part of the stick!! So she can see how hard this is going to be. Splitting up the family!!

I would look for work and get your DD to daycare. This is for your stability no matter the outcome and it's also part of filling her love bank because you now know that she's been stressed about carrying the financial load.

Beg, borrow or steal and get the best attorney you can.

Some say don't get a job so you can get better spousal support. I'm not a legal expert but that looks risky to me. Plus you know she wants help carrying the burden. Tell her tonight that you're going to start looking for work and she needs to prepare for your daughter to be in daycare.

ITA with what zibbles said. Find the best bulldog you can afford--ask around with divorced people you may know who lost a chunk in their divorce, and ask who their ex's lawyer was, that sort of thing.

Do not get a night job
I would not even seek a day job.
She can pay child support and you can get public assistance

I respectfully disagree with the above post.
Yes, there are SAHM's on here who get support and muddle through these situations.

I hate to say it but the courts might not be as sympathetic to you as a dad. It sucks and I totally give you props for being a SAHD but in our current society, it's easy for your wife and her lawyer to paint you as lazy or entitled for not working over the last few years.

It would be different if your child was an infant but she's almost four. I think you're going to have a harder time garnering sympathy from divorce court.

PLUS you need to get your footing. No matter what! Get a divorce lawyer ASAP. You've got to be the one to file first, otherwise you risk your WW doing a hatchet job on you that you will never forget and have a very hard time recovering from.

2l2l, you can still Plan A whilst preparing for Plan D.

I tend to agree with other posters... this would actually be best for you, DD and a chance to recover your marriage.

Right now, you need to take action to show some stick. Words are not enough. Child support, custody disputes, property settlement and all of the realities of D... Ain't fogland wonderful

I was listening to MB radio on the way in to work this morning. Dr Harley responded to a letter which was very similar to your situation.

He discussed the 'contrast effect'. He said that the WW's conversations with the OM is most likely about problems with her M. The OM is meeting her emotional needs and thinks she is in love with the OM. She is comparing her H to the OM with every interaction.

The reason she thinks she is in love with the OM is that he is meeting her EN�s while the H is not.

He encouraged the H to figure out exactly what the WW wants. He said to try to figure out what the key factors to her are. He said that most likely there were many complaints through the years which were never resolved. What were the LB�s that the H did which the WW didn�t like.

If the H was able to figure out his WW�s key emotional needs and how the OM is meeting them, he encouraged the H to START doing exactly that immediately. Stop committing the LB�s.

He encouraged the H to try to give it 1 year before doing anything drastic like D or Plan B.

Many people on this board have had very difficult experiences and see things through their eyes. I encourage everyone posting on this board to leave their personal baggage to the side while advising those in need here.

Dr. Harley did not tell this person to D or go to plan b as some of you have encouraged 2L2L to do. The stories were almost identical. Please listen to today�s segment.

20,
His wife is going to file divorce.
It is just a matter of time who gets to the courthouse first.
In his case he has a child that he cares for and he needs to strategize for custody.

His wife taunts him about going out. He is on the verge of just having an open marriage if he doesn't stand his ground.

If he can wether out the storm for a year then fine. But she's proactively seeking divorce information and is asking him to sign divorce papers. At this point his wife would not be the best choice for custodial parent.

The exposure to OM mom may be help slay this affair. If it lasts too much longer she will become a barfly and then he has a whole new problem to deal with

When I confirmed the A was ongoing a few weeks ago, I told MIL the reason I knew was I had put a recorder in the car. So last night WW demands I remove it from the car, she wants to see it, it's an invasion of privacy and later texted me that someone who does that has no honor. That's a good one, a WW criticizing a BH's honor!

She tried to tell me that I need to stay somehwere else until I produce it. . I just ignored and did not engage. I know not to leave and I have a legal right to stay in my home.

Now I don't want to show/tell her what I used, and haven't so far, but how should I diffuse this line of questioning should it come up again?

Got flowers, put 'em in a vase I brought from home and left them at the security desk downstairs @ her work. Texted her she had something there. In a note I wrote "I love you more than you could ever know. I hope these brighten your day"

There was a bbq for her work at the other building which happens to be directly accross the street from my DD's preschool. There was a long line for it, so I texted my W and told her if she was planning to go, the line is long. This was at about 11:55a. My DD wanted to walk, so we walked a few blocks, returned to the car and drove home. At 12:30 my WW texts back and said "Thank u! They are pretty. yeah line long , but in good company" . The last part really gets me. The BS side of me automatically thinks she is referring to POSOM and trying to mess with me. Though she could've been with co-workers. The other thing is taht she knows DD has been wanting to visit her after work, and WW ended up comig to literally across the street from DD pickup, but never once mentioned seeing her or us.

Well now you know not to tell your MIL anything about intelligence gathering.
The only people you can trust with intel gathering is this anonymous forum and an attorney

Oh I do want to stress something.
In Ohio you can only record when you are present.
Check into your state law. Ask an attorney.
Don't break the law with recording or spyware

Some posters have a lot of experience with spying.
I never spied. I had a recorder on me at all times but I didn't spy. My personal attitude is that I'm not a police detective and my wife could stop the affair or I was divorcing. But certainly spy by all legal means.

Ok, I've asked this twice, but never got an answer, so I'll post just this question here in hopes to get an answer.

? Good or Bad Idea? Can or should a WW in an active A read SAA? Probably by me leaving the book out where she can see it vs. "hey read this!"

FWIW - I can only tell you that my W read SAA while there was still communication with the OM -- meaning, she was still in the fog. Looking back, I realize how little must've sunk in.

I feel it was only AFTER exposure, when we counselled with SH and then re-read SAA that it began to have any meaning.

You can leave the book out where she can see it.
I got a nice plaque of the 10 commandments that I hung on the living room wall for my kids. Obviously 1 of the commandments is thou shalt not commit adultery.
I think that irritated her.

...thou shalt not commit adultery. I think that irritated her.

Priceless! How was she with the other nine? I mean, there's coveting, and bearing false witness.....

Well I don't want to disrupt his thread but she had already quit going to church and was trying to justify it.
She justified the adultery by saying that I had already filed for divorce anyway and the marriage was over