Thanks for minimizing all of the work I did those first 8 or 9 years. [sarcasm]It feels so good to be told all you ever did was fill out a Q and post on a forum. [/sarcasm]

Thanks for minimizing all of the work I did those first 8 or 9 years. [sarcasm]It feels so good to be told all you ever did was fill out a Q and post on a forum. [/sarcasm]

I am sorry if I overstated it, but did you ever sign up for Marriage Builders counseling? Even go to the MB weekend seminar? All I see you did was fill out a questionaire and chat on a chat forum. That is not using the program - as you can see.

It doesn't take 8 or 9 years to transform a marriage. Those of us who have transformed our marriages using this program did it in 1 to 2 years. Here you are 9 years later no better off than when you arrived. That is because you have no used this program.

When someone has the same problem year after year, I know I am speaking to someone who is not looking for solutions.

In fact, I made several posts on this thread a few years ago that could have made the difference between success and failure. Did you follow any of that advice?

POST MADE ON 1-17-11, DID YOU FOLLOW THIS ADVICE?

Been on Marriage Builders for 10 years and never read a single book. I rest my case.

Do you own any of Dr. Harley's books?

MrA, have you looked into taking any antidepressant medication. In the rare cases I've heard of where Dr. Harley has coached a husband to stay in a marriage with a traumatic situation (ongoing, active affair on the part of the wife), he has directed the husband to get antidepressant medication from a doctor to help him get through it.

If you are seriously planning to live in a bad marriage for 8 years, at a minimum, you should get some antidepressant medication.

If there's a truck about to hit you in the road, would you prefer that we make you feel good about it, or would you prefer that we warn you you are standing in the wrong spot?

It looks like you've made only minimal investments in learning Marriage Builders, and you've assumed that it is interchangeable with other programs and that you can mix and match the methods here with suggestions from those other programs. You don't have to have professional counseling to learn and implement Marriage Builders, but ignoring the free materials (website and radio program), ignoring the books, and not getting into any of the professional options does not sound like using Marriage Builders, to me.

I'm sorry if that statement makes you feel bad. A bank overdraft statement always makes me feel bad, you know? I am going to ask my bank not to send me overdraft statements any more, so I can feel good while making financial mistakes.

Actually, if you've read the entire site, but never listened to the radio show, there is an enormous amount of material that shows up in the radio show that you are probably unaware of. Including a lot of material on marriages where the husband is motivated and the wife is not. I can think of tons of things I've heard on the radio show and not seen covered, or barely seen covered, on this website. One good example would be Type A and Type B resentment; I don't think Dr. Harley has an article about that.

I found where Dr. H talks about the two different types of resentment, but not type A and B.

Following POJA whe you're very incompatible

Wow. I didn't think that was on here!

Nice.

Sure thing. Make the assumption because I haven't read the books and followed the exercises recommended in there that I've done nothing in my marriage that employs the principles of the Harleys. Disregard the thousands of posts I've read that have directly quoted the books (ahem many of them your posts MelodyLane).

I don't own the book and have not checked out the books from the library ergo I'm an MB moron. Nice assumption. You talk in generality based on a few facts.

Melody most of your suggestions involve me trying to implement specific rules with a partner that isn't interested in implementing this plan. Up until a couple of years ago I have done my part to follow what is taught here. I upped our UA time without making it an official announcement. I know the rules surrounding POJA and have done what I could to implement those. Fortunately her and I have done well to avoid independent behavior so some parts of that were easy to implement. Other parts more difficult as she doesn't participate in the plan and therefore hasn't agreed to its policy so a mutual agreement can be difficult. I know how to read my wife and did a very good job of eliminating all LBs. blah blah blah I could go on and on yet I hate that I have to defend my understanding of the main MB policies.

Not that it's a true barometer but she said she was happy and satisfied whenever I asked how she thought we were doing.

Your disregard of the 5 love languages book IMHO is a bit off the mark. It was an excellent book that described in much similarity the same principals as the most important Emotional Needs. It just had a more generalized categorization of the needs but it went into great detail and real life examples of those concepts and I suspect it is very similar if not identical to the Drs HNHN book. It is a great book and helped me understand a lot of how her and I could/should operate. I liked it so much I bought the 5 Love Languages for Children and it has been an integral part in understanding the extreme differences in each of my kids and how I could build a loving relationship with each one of them.


We both read the book then did the EN Q. She liked it because I implemented a change. But after that that was it. To this day she even refers to it as that stupid question/answer thingy. sigh.

Enough of me trying to defend what I've done and what I understand.

I haven't tried the professional services and the things they'd suggest. And at this particular point in our relationship you're going to have a tough time convincing me to do it now. I'm sure there are some terms and concepts I've missed not reading the books ...so I can be always be more educated while my wife gets everything she wants while I expend all my energy just to get some crumbs.

I am not saying the program doesn't work. I'm not even saying I completely committed to it. I will say I took a pretty damn big stab at it given my circumstances and if you truly knew everything I tried that one would consider MB principals you'd avoid comments like "I rest my case.".

Again I question why I came back to post. I must be a masochist and enjoy people telling me all the energy I've spent and pain I've suffered the last 10 years were a joke and that I'm nothing more than a poser.

Heck I probably don't belong on this site anymore anyways as one of the things that have turned me off is her drinking. It's gotten excessive and there's a chance there's some dependency issues. I spoke to her about it and she dialed it back. But now this week she's back at it ... I suspect to send me a message. You withdraw I stop doing what you want.

markos: I have the MB radio app installed on my Droid and have listened on average about 2 to 3 hours each month the last 5 or 6 months. Unfortunately I've been withdrawn that whole time and the program hasn't motivated me. Also I am local to their radio station and have listened over the air waves several times a couple of years ago. I haven't heard the terms Type A and Type B resentment so it's obvious I don't know it all. Thanks for the suggestion.

Since it doesn't seem to have fixed your marriage, why would you say that it is a great book?

I personally found that book very lacking, long before coming here. It was very long on telling me what not to do and very short on telling me what to do. I give it credit for getting across the basic concept that what means care for one person may not mean care for the other. But if I remember right it doesn't have any suggestions for what to do when your spouse isn't interested in providing care for you, which makes it useless for the reluctant spouse scenario.




This makes no sense whatsoever. I guess if you are bent on convincing yourself that one program is the same as another so that you can tell yourself you did everything you could, then it might make sense to say it.

I've never been to Italy. I assume it is very similar if not identical to China. I'm going to go to Dallas, TX, which is probably similar to both of them, and then I'll know what it's like to go to Italy and China.

Will she go to AA?

What about AlAnon for you?

MrA, you sound miserable and combative. You are shooting at the rescue helicopters.

If you want to survive the next 8 years, I really think antidepressant medication would be a good idea.

Convincing us you are right won't help your situation. Even if you are right. You might win the debate with us, and still have an unhappy life.

I would like to do what I personally can to help you get to a point of happiness in life, but I'm not sure if it would do any good because you seem to fight with everyone who offers you advice, or at bare minimum, you ignore their suggestions. You sound like you are convinced you have nothing to learn and that nobody understands your situation because it is different, and that there is nothing out there that could help you and we just need to understand that.

I see no point in arguing that with you.

Have you told your wife that you are only planning to stay until the kids are grown?

[
Five Love Languages doesn't have a plan to transform your marriage; Marriage Builders DOES. 5LL focuses on "communication" which is cute and winsome but is a distraction from creating romantic love in the marriage. It won't help a bad marriage because there is no PLAN to do so. Even the best communicators will end up divorced if they are not in love. The fact that you don't know the difference demonstrates your lack of understanding of this program. Not to mention the fact that it hasn't helped your own marriage.

Anyone who has been through the program and has transformed their marriage will tell you a) there is huge difference and b) you can't learn this program by reading articles and posts on this forum. For example, up until the past 2 years, the MB program wasn't even presented on the EN forum. It was little more than a chat forum where personal opinions reigned supreme and the program was cherry picked at best. The vast majority of posters were in bad marriages themselves and knew nothing about the program. Instead of applying the program to their own marriages, they made endless and volumnous posts about specific conflicts.


You don't own a single book and by your own admission don't even care to save your marriage. That is why you have the same problem today you did when you arrived almost 10 years ago.


In other words, you never availed yourself of the professional services on this site to help persuade your wife. AS you can see, this program doesn't work without 2 committed parties. Most of the couples who go through the MB program have one reluctant spouse. The Harleys are able to sell them on the program. I would think after almost 10 years you might accept that your own methods have been unsuccessful and get some professional help.

His goal is to maintain the status quo. A person who has the same problems after 10 years is not seeking solutions.

MrA, that really explains a lot, the drinking, and I understand the reluctance to share it. It explains why she used to be so dead-set on putting time with the horse ahead of family time on the weekends, because they can both escape mechanisms. You've read the articles on an alcoholic marriage, right, you know no matter how much UA time you get and how in love with you she becomes it's not going to make her more willing to shift from the Renter mindset "how little can I do to get him off my back today" to Buyer mode, "what can I do to make us both happy." No wonder you're out of steam. Al-anon has been a great help to me getting my serenity back, and helping my kids learn tools to live with the situation. You had tried it before, right, did it click with you?

(((hugs)))

I went a couple of years ago but that was when I wanted to know if I could help my SIL because my BIL is an alcoholic. I only went to 4 sessions. Got a lot out of it. But stopped as I realized this was going to a long journey and what I'd get would be minimal. I also hoped it would spur on my SIL to attend in a chapter close to her city.

Now? Because my wife is drinking? Hmmm. Not sure I would.