Suzy knocked it out of the park.

Like... I... I don't even...


How do you follow THAT?


And you know what? I'm going to be a nutball here; I don't really blame KISS for not coming to get dirt kicked in his face.

Get. The. Coaching.

Your husband will NOT be treated that way by his accountability coach. He will NOT be treated that way by Dr. Harley.

Your marriage is on life-support, and this program is still the best option. Time to try a different administration route, as porcupine suppositories just don't seem to work that well with your husband...

From Kiss' thread


You're not wrong. I don't have any problem with the car going to his sister nor do I have problem with kiss driving to florida with her and visiting his parents.



Neither Kiss or I see each other as being "wrong". We both agreed to the car issue.

Kiss and I have enough issues to deal with in our marriage without this "clutter". Can we please drop the issue of the skankmobile and drive to Florida?

Rq - it is not "we" who are bringing it up. It's that person fighting your corner who is angry at kiss. I think this is one of your relatives.

Thanks, sugarcane. It's possible.

To respond, that quote was not about the car, but a more general comment about the dynamic that your respective posts reveal about your relationship.

Thanks for clarifying, Kerala. Kiss and I have a lot of work to do.

Is your H's lack of posting somehow tied in to how often this thread remains dormant?

Maybe posting here more regularly would make a difference, Dunno???? Just more of a curious observation.

HPB, it was locked until just over a month ago. I asked the mods to unlock it so I could post again as I thought the same thing. But I have been pretty active here since then. Been doing more reading than posting I guess

RQ, when is K getting home? What are you planning to celebrate the removal of the car?

Flight is getting in at 3. We have nothing panned as of yet, but he is off until Tuesday. A celebration is definitely in order

Flight got in around 3:30. We went out to dinner (just the 2 of us) and had great UA time together. I spoke to kiss about the Accountabilty program and how much I think it will benefit us and he agreed. Now, to just get the funds for it.

I'm hopeful that this will help us change behaviors and habits that withdraw love units.

Did you tell him we miss him - a lot?

The point is that while you are putting together the funds for the formal accountability program, he's abdicated the opportunity to use the "informal" program that is represented by his thread. (Look, I'm not trying to pick a fight by proxy, but facts are facts!)

I'd post this there, but if he's not even on MB reading, it will be of small purchase.

NG, I was just thinking that as well. I'm afraid that if we have to wait the month or so to purchase the program, then our bad habits will continue and escalate.


I did suggest to him that he listen to the MB program that was on this morning. I thought it was very informative and was a good reminder that we, as a husband and wife, show our love to each other "God commands us to". Dr. Harley aslo spoke about careers and those that don't allow adequate UA time. I'd like to re-listen to it as well as it still keeps cutting in and out on me when I am playing it. It is sooo frustrating. Anyway, I will suggest that he continue to post until we get registered into an official program.

Kiss and I got into quite a heated discussion the other night about our lack of SF. It kind of came out of nowhere to me as I thought I had been doing better at it. But he came at me with the question "Do you know how many times we have made love?" His answer doesn't matter. What mattered was that he was still unhappy with the frequency. I admit I AO'd big time. I was so hurt and felt criticized by something that I feel is beyond my control. Now he feels that he shouldn't have said anything, again! I apologized for my outburst. Kiss has every reason to complain. But it is in the way he does it. I feel like I am critized because he offers no solutions, no understanding or empathy, and turns down my ideas.

However (!) i understand the importance of SF to kiss, even though it is not to me. And I WANT to be willing to meet that need for him. I told him this and suggested that we call an MB coach, he says that WE need to work on this. I tell him that we could use advice but he tells me that he is not willing to do that. In fact, he told me that I should put more effort into our marriage and less into Marriagebuilders. I explained to him that I had been reading the articles about SF, and the threads, to find out how to fix this.

I believe that I need to feel emotionally connected to him, which many times I do not, but he says that he doesn't believe that is the case. I have trouble keeping skank out of our bedroom, but he tells me that he doesn't believe that is the reason as this has always been a problem with our marriage.

Have others had this problem with SF and what helped?

RQ, we didn't have the problem with SF post-A, but there were years in our marriage when I felt emotionally disconnected from my H, due his lack of affection for me and that's when I rarely felt like making love with him.

It was not a tit-for-tat, as in "if you're not going to be affectionate with me, I'm not going to make love with you, so there." Rather, it was his lack of care for me that caused me to feel withdrawn from him. I didn't want to feel used. I wanted to be loved and to FEEL loved. The care had to be shown throughout the day and the week, and it had to be outside of leading to SF. Because my H now meets this need as well as a couple of other key ENs of mine, SF is so much easier for me to meet for him, even though my drive (as for many women) is much lower than his.

And "skank in the bedroom," yeah, that's a tough one. I did struggle with that one for a long while after the A. I would be in the middle of a great time and suddenly visions of them together would invade and sometimes I couldn't continue. Sometimes I could continue but it was hard. Sometimes I told him of my imaginations, and sometimes I didn't. Either way, it was mind torture and it DOES make a difference. Now we're two plus years post D-Day, it's not really an issue anymore.

My H did an amazing job in recovery. He has basically turned himself into a new man. This new man shows his affection and care for me in a multitude of ways, and that has made all the difference in my willingness to make love with him. So bottom line, only you know what you need to begin to want to meet his needs. You convey it, and he needs to listen, not tell you that he doesn't believe this is the case.

Do you two have the Five Steps workbook? Marriage Builders made all the difference in our recovery.

Long way, this is exactly it. I am not intentionally with-holding. We do have the 5 steps workbook although we haven't used it. I know that Dr Harley has said in one of his articles that a woman needs to feel emotionally connected and have a prospect of enjoyment. While I don't know the exact number, many times I am just reaching the plateau stage and kiss is about done. It seems more trouble than it is worth for me.

The timing in SF is crucial for a woman. It took my H some time and practice before he learned to master his control so that I could enjoy a great time, too. Women generally take longer, as you know, and a good lover will pace himself accordingly.

My H had the habit of masturbation for a few years, and that habit created a reflex where he nearly always ejaculated way before I was halfway there--very very frustrating.

The prospect of enjoyment is crucial. We read a couple of good sex manuals some years ago, and that helped a lot. I think Harley's material on SF is really helpful. I listened to his audio CD for that chapter numerous times.

I recommend that you fill out the affection questionnaire first. That will let your H know exactly what he can do to meet your need for affection. Use the worksheet to create a list of acts your H can do for you on a daily basis.

If conversation is also one of your important ENs, fill that one out, too.

These two ENs, when met consistently and with plenty of UA time, will create an environment where you can fall in love with your H.

After filling out these two worksheets, fill out the SF worksheet, so you can see for yourself exactly where you are in this area. Then share it with your H.

The key reason we finally signed up for the Online Seminar is because we simply weren't filling out the worksheets and actively working the MB program. We needed the accountability and help. The worksheets do take some time and effort but the results are worth both.

The other key part of recovery is avoiding all love busters. You will have a hard time falling in love with your H if he is doing them. He will have a tough time showing you he cares if you do them.

RQ,

You two are fighting over SF and are trying to solve the fulfillment issue.

Can you take a step back and see that the inconsistent issue of Real UA time needs addressed before focusing in on just one particular EN.

Does Kiss view Porn? Does Kiss masturbate? His going out to the couch after you're asleep makes me think these are highly likely.

RQ your methods aren't working.
Neither are KISS methods.
Is The reason why is because you both have terrible taste in music?
Or is the reason because you both are not following dr Harley's guidelines?

How many hours are you two spending in UA time this week?
Have you both POJA how the time will be spent to you both enjoy it?
Watching television does not count

HPB, I completely agree with the UA time and told kiss that I believe we need to spend more time together and do things. Which is something that I can't control. For example, he doesn't even have his schedule right now, so I can't plan our UA time. I know he is off thursday and friday so we can meet for lunch on thursday and go out friday night.

As for as I know, he is not viewing porn. That was a problem in the past and is now one of his EP's. And, back, then, he would still view porn even though we had been intimate the night before so I don't believe he was viewing it because he was frustrated.