Bnmt, I believe we heard you on the radio last week. Dr. Harley's advice to you was to "let her go," right? And to continue working on yourself. He spent a lot of time encouraging you to do this.

Is it true that you were trying to get sole custody of your children? I hope not. This is a typical abuser's strategy to get revenge on a wife for leaving him. Dr. Harley encouraged you to pursue a fair, legal divorce: not let her walk all over you, but I daresay not walking all over your W either.

I hope you follow Dr. Harley's expert advice.

Hoch, we'd love to help you through this too. You'll find plenty of support here if you'd like to have it. I am leaving an abusive marriage and have benefited greatly from the support I've received here.

Please consider starting your own thread?

I explained to my attorney that I wanted shared parenting. She said this was the best way to go about it. Ask for everything and meet in the middle.

That's pretty aggressive. Your attorney might do better telling you what the law states, and where your appointed judge typically leans, rather than pushing your wife into greater fear and anger with those scare tactics. I'm glad your goal is shared parenting.

You may want to check out Sbt's thread "Exposure Used Against You" for a tutorial on divorce when abuse is involved. His wife is going for full custody of the children and he is refusing to leave the house - it's a painful unfolding of events, and I can't help but believe that it's partly driven by Sbt's continued desire to control everything.

I respect your decision to leave the house when your wife asked you to. That says a LOT about your willingness to grow, and it will pay off! It's encouraging to see your continued efforts, posting on the forum, contacting the Harleys, etc. I have high hopes for your family - keep it up!

Thank you, I'll have another talk with my attorney. I've told her several times now that I don't want this to be ugly. I'vefollowed her lead on most things just because I've no idea what I'm doing.

I really do just want more time with my kids at this point. I miss them. What happens between my wife and I is her decision, not mine.

My advice on the legal issues is to follow the advice of your attorney.
The attorney is the professional in court.
The fact is you have legal rights as a parent. Irregardless of your relationship with your wife you have these parental rights.

I would not sign them away easily and I disagree with the previous advice. she shows a bias against men in general. The fact is poster Sbt, whom she references, is married to a drunkard woman and he hasn't moved out because he is trying to protect his children. That is not unhealthy "controlling"

Let the attorney do her job.

As they say, "Let go and let God"

After reading your wife's post I think you should enter into plan B after divorce.

I also suggest you ask your attorney about asking the court to appoint a Guardian ad litem (GAL) for the children.

Hoch- what about the texts to your 16 yr old during school hours? Any truth to that? I think you should look away from bnmt while you are in this separation. You seem to be very angry and if it is true that you are reviewing every detail that has led to this separation I daresay you are not a happy camper. Bitterness and anger are a heavy burden to bear. Look away. Let it go.

I never suggested they be signed away easily. I suggested that his attorney should tell him what the law states: which is typically shared custody (unless there are very extenuating circumstances - which would lean more in his wife's favor at this point anyway!). If he pursues aggressive legal manuevers, he could end up in trial like Sbt did, with everything he does scrutinized under the "abuse and control" lens. Not a pretty scenario.

Bnmt, Dr. Harley said "don't lay down and give her everything" on the radio. Great advice. But he did NOT say, "go at her with guns blazing" either. In my opinion, threatening to take away a (good) mom's children is more on the 'guns blazing' side than on the 'lay down' side.

Actually, he has accused her of drinking - which is entirely different. Sbt has accused his wife of a lot of things but has admitted in his thread to his own scary, abusive actions. He has also been encouraged by many posters to go into Plan B, and move out - which he's refused to do. Sbt's wife will likely receive full custody because of a three-day trial detailing his abuse of both his wife and their children. I'd rather not see Bnmt suffer like that.

As to this:

I DEFINITELY have a bias against abuse and control, not against men. Unfortunately the abusers in my life have all been men, but that's just the way it happened. Am I less trusting now? Yep. Can I smell abuse and control a mile away now? You bet. But that's wisdom, not bias.

I'm not trying to control anything. All I want is to be a bigger part of my childrens life. I've failed many ways as a father and as a husband, It's my wifes choice if I ever get to make it up to her, but I do have some say when it comes to my children and making things up to them, for now anyway. Zhamila, I appreciate evryones advice on here, but please don't judge too quick. Some people just lost their way for awhile, for whatever reason. It's a shame the people we love had to suffer because of it. It doesn't mean that people can't change and make up for what they've done if given the chance. Even if making up for it means walking away and letting people deal with their own demons.

Can anyone tell me the odds of actually saving my marriage are at this point?

Research shows that many women return to their (abusive) relationships at a fairly high rate. I sit in a survivors group every week, and all of us - to a woman - would love to be reunited with our husbands if they would make the deep changes needed to treat us with the love and respect every marriage needs. In fact, one of the women said tonight (she's been divorced for 3 years and her husband threw their son down the stairs in the past year) that she is tempted to go back to him but probably shouldn't. Another has to pull out pictures of her injuries and bruises to remind herself not to go back.

If you continue working on overcoming the controlling habits that drove your wife away, and keep treating your wife with respect, I think you have a good chance. Didn't Dr. Harley say you have a better chance than anyone on earth, because you're the father of her children? (can't remember if that was you) But it could take a long time of proving that you are a safe, caring husband and father. Your marriage didn't fall apart overnight, and it won't be fixed overnight. It could take years of determined progress, if you're willing.

All that said, she may not take you back, even if you make great strides. Maybe the pain of what she's been through has already been too much, I don't know. But even if she doesn't return, you can become a better person by conquering the issues that brought you to this place.

The fact that you are even here, and reaching out to the Harleys, and reading books, etc says a TON about your character. I personally think you have a shot.

Thank you Zhamila, I hope you're right. I hope she gets a chance to enjoy the changes I've been working on. Good luck to you and your struggles.

Well, just went through another of the kids birthdays. Now we're getting ready for Easter. The girls are going with me to my parents about 4 hrs away and our son wanted to stay here with his mom.I hate splitting them up for the holidays. I actually just hate holidays now. Our "normal" is gone.

Thanks bnmt. Rooting for you and your marriage.

I was reading some other posts on here. I really hope I didn't make my W feel as bad as some of the women on here. But after reading them I do have a glimpse of what I put my wife through. I'm glad she put a stop to it before it escalated into some of these storys.

Not that I didn't always have some controlling tendencies, but how does a man let it get so far out of control? How does he become so selfish and self absorbed that he doesn't see the damage his words and actions are causing? Oh my wife tried to tell me. On more than one occasion. I just became blind to everyone's needs except my own. I wasn't like this before, so how does it happen? After we found out my daughter was being molested, when my family needed me the most, I went the opposite direction. I turned into a raging a$$. I absolutely love and adore my wife and kids, so how does a man let this happen to himself? How does he become so immune to the feelings of the people he loves the most? I know there are some pretty wise people on here, I hope someone can give me some insight on this one.

Wow. Great questions.

There's been some good research done on the issue of power and control in relationships - you might start by getting your hands on it. A couple of helpful authors for me have been Paul Kivel, Lundy Bancroft and Patricia Evans. The literature seems to agree that abuse and control (or that 'self-centeredness' you mentioned) is taught to men from boyhood. Everything from the media portraying women as objects, to encouraging men to stuff everything down (i.e. "take it like a man"), and to look to women as the sole givers of emotional care. There is also an attitude of entitlement passed along - sort of an 'I deserve X, Y and Z and if I don't get it I am justified in my anger' thing.

There may also be resources in your community - you might call a local battered women's shelter and see what classes or groups they have available for people wanting to learn about it. Or you could google The Duluth Project or the Power and Control Wheel and see what comes up - those resources help explain the dynamics.

I hope Markos will post here: he has been there and overcome, and understands it all from the guy's perspective.

Your questions are great. Keep going.

This is in the past, we can't change the past only the present. You were overcome by fear and emotion at an incredibly traumatic time. Let it go and be a different person now.

Dr Harley has thought about this as well. This is a quote from the 'Basic Concept Love Busters'.



Please, let us know if Dr Harley's quote helps you work your way through your own thoughtlessness. It sure helped me !!!

Me too.