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I don't even belong in recovery, and I certainly don't have the right to be counseling anyone else on these forums. You are one of the best posters on these forums, supplying solid Harley-based advice with wisdom and care. Don't you dare leave! And you don't have to give a crap or be impressed by H's signing up to the online programme - today. Just let him get on with it and let the coaches do their job with him. You might feel different tomorrow or the day after.  Agreed!!
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FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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Sending thoughts and prayers your way, UW! So sorry you have had to bite and scratch for every ounce of "betterment" as that's not the way it should be, you're right. And no - it shouldn't be that way EVEN IF the BS is driving the bus! I admit to doing my share of driving, esp. in the beginning, but it was with the knowledge that H had the maps in the passenger seat and was there with the water and snacks to participate. There IS a difference.
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oh unwritten, i'm so, so sorry.
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I just want to thank everyone for all of your help over the last year. I have been here almost a year, almost every day, if not posting at least reading and learning. Although I still could have done a lot to lead the process of recovery, and I certainly was not perfect, I did put a lot of thought and effort into learning how to be a better wife and how to have a better marriage. I did try very hard to walk away from the mountain of resentment. Your efforts have been heroic. But that cannot happen if the mountain is being added to, which it has been.  You are 100% correct. In continued neglect and lack of care. Things are 'better' in the fact that they couldn't get much worse, but I have some great marriages to compare to here on this board, and I know THIS marriage will never be one of these. Sorry ....... Bottom line is, perhaps some BS's can be the driver of recovery. I have found that I cannot. I have added resentment because I have been expected to drive, expected to lead. Expected to FIX THIS, while the man who neglected me for a decade and had sex with a skank in a hotel room, just comes along for the ride. Your efforts have been heroic and honorable. His effort? Not so much. If I sit him down in a chair and put a pencil in his hand, will he fill out a questionairre here or there? Sure. But that does NOT equal hat in hand, and it does not equal care. It eventually develops into a parent-child dynamic. Not good for the love bank. It does not make me feel loved, or cared for or protected. And it certainly does not make me feel SAFE. In fact, I can't even remember what any of those things feel like anymore, my entire marriage has been riddled with the opposite. You gave it your all. And some more after that. Thank you for all of your help, and for all of your care. I feel like some of you have cared more about my marriage than my H has. We still care for you. You are still a MB success story. Never doubt that. I cannot lead this process anymore. I cannot even attempt to lead, it leaves me feeling ever increasingly resentful and uncared for to do so. It is what it is. TODAY H signs up for the accountability program. After 2 1/2 yrs of asking him to do so, and him being unenthusiastic about it because (fill in the blank with any number of lame excuses). TODAY he signs up, without talking to me, without POJAing it. That mountain of resentment? Hello ! Once again, trying to use this program to manipulate me in a frenzy of damage control. Until probably yesterday I would have jumped on the opportunity, been impressed with this method. Today, it seems absolutely worthless. Stick a fork in you? Are you done? How can we assist YOU?
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Hey dummy! Yeah, Mr UNwritten, I'm talking to you.
Don't you know your wife needs to know you will fight for her?
Laziness is not so attractive.
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Unwritten, I hope all is well for you. I thought of you when I heard this. Radio Clip of a Wife Wanting SF More than her Husband
FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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thanks, brainy.
i sure do miss unwritten. i hope she's handling things ok.
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thanks, brainy.
i sure do miss unwritten. i hope she's handling things ok. I know, me too.
FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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Wow thanks BH and Letty! Its so warming to know you are thinking of me.
I am still hanging out, keeping up on some stories and just trying to stay positive as much as possible.
We are doing the online program. Well, what I mean by that is we have PAID FOR the online program. Shockingly, it seems to be an effort in damage control by Mr. Unwritten... So far we haven't gotten past lesson 1, even though we have done it a couple times before.
In Mr UW's defense, we have been really busy. And when he does try and work on 'homework' I am less than enthusiastic about it. It all just gives me a bad taste in my mouth.
I'm not just playing martyr and refusing to drive. I simply have ZERO energy to do so. I don't even have the right attitude riding in the back seat most of the time. At this point I am entirely checked out mentally. Don't think about the A's really ever. I don't even care about them anymore. Not mad. Not in incredible pain from it all. Just kindof going through the motions. Mr UW doesn't even seem to notice that, maybe my calmness has him feeling safe, as if I am happy and over it all.
So not MB. Def not what I want in a marriage. I don't even know what I want in a marriage anymore, can't really even envision it being good. Having that marriage now seems like way more work than its worth. I have ZERO energy left to work towards that. I don't really care if I meet his needs or not. I don't really even care if he meets mine.
I read MSS's thread whenever he posts. I also feel like I am just going through the motions, in a state of acceptance more or less. Its not about the A's anymore. Its not about one particular issue. Its just one big fat failure, and I know I can change it if I really, really wanted to. I can't seem to want to.
Its been awhile since I even thought about my feelings about this, much less wrote them down. Kinda scary.
What's my PLAN. I don't really have one. Have I ever had one? I am not unhappy. In many ways I have a cushy life. I don't have a desire to end it just to be IN LURVE with someone again. I'm not mad at Mr UW anymore, so I don't really want to leave him to spite him. I don't have the energy or care to leave. But do I have the energy to make this the best relationship possible? NOPE. Don't have that either.
And now, you know, why I never, ever post anymore! Because I am not living a good marriage. I am not a success story. I am not even a personal success story. Maybe I am an example of where a good strong withdrawal can get you. Every relationship needs one person to fight, unfortunately, ours no longer has one person. Ours has nobody fighting, nobody who seems to care whether we are happily married or just, married.
Thank you BH for the article on SF. I have given up trying to get that need met, and am not about to do backflips anymore.
Anyway don't want to open up my thread or anything, I really appreciate you guys thinking about me. I'm still here, just have to figure out my own life before I advise anyone else on theirs. Just trying to put one foot in front of the other and stay positive.
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Hey unwritten! Thanks for the honest update. I often wonder how you are doing.
Do you know its harder to have a bad marriage than a good marriage? You say you have ZERO energy, but it takes much more energy to maintain a bad marriage than a good one.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Emotional withdrawal and mental exhaustion is criteria for clinical depression.
Have you been checked out by your healthcare provider?
I'm not concerned about your marriage.
I am concerned about YOU !!!
Edit to add:
This is vital because this mental depression effects your physical well-being. Your immune system in particular.
See your physician.
Your health is at risk.
Last edited by Pepperband; 05/21/13 10:02 AM.
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Hey unwritten! Thanks for the honest update. I often wonder how you are doing.
Do you know its harder to have a bad marriage than a good marriage? You say you have ZERO energy, but it takes much more energy to maintain a bad marriage than a good one. Thanks ML. The way I see it, spending 15-25 hours of UA time, constantly worrying about all the ways I am NOT meeting needs that I should be, cleaning my azz off, P90Xing... shopping... dressing up...primping...getting my nails done...cooking dinners, reading books, doing homework, always worrying about is it enough, or why he this or why he that...is just a LOT of work. Whereas just not caring about all that, is no work. No hours in a day. So that is not the way I see it. It is difficult enough to get time in and put the effort in when there is a payout. When there is not, it is next to impossible to stay motivated.
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Emotional withdrawal and mental exhaustion is criteria for clinical depression.
Have you been checked out by your healthcare provider?
I'm not concerned about your marriage.
I am concerned about YOU !!!
Edit to add:
This is vital because this mental depression effects your physical well-being. Your immune system in particular.
See your physician.
Your health is at risk. I don't feel depressed. I feel pretty calm and content. I don't have the major anger anymore, I don't feel the resentment. The emotional rollercoaster was a thousand times more damaging than emotional withdrawal. Like bipolar disorder, the highs were so high but the lows are so low. If anything else, I at least no longer have that. Just a calm somewhere in the middle.
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I listened to this clip. It was rather annoying. Joyce is spot on and I applaud her for defending women who just have a high need for SF on a physical/biological level. It is so common for people, when they hear of a woman with a high need for SF, to assume this is really a high need for affection, emotional intimacy, etc. That might be the case some of the time, but it certainly isn't all of the time. I am an exception to this. It is frustrating to hear Dr H jump on that bandwagon. I do think in our sitch Mr UW is in it more for the affection and emotional intimacy, and I am in it more for the physical aspect.
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Hey unwritten! Thanks for the honest update. I often wonder how you are doing.
Do you know its harder to have a bad marriage than a good marriage? You say you have ZERO energy, but it takes much more energy to maintain a bad marriage than a good one. Thanks ML. The way I see it, spending 15-25 hours of UA time, constantly worrying about all the ways I am NOT meeting needs that I should be, cleaning my azz off, P90Xing... shopping... dressing up...primping...getting my nails done...cooking dinners, reading books, doing homework, always worrying about is it enough, or why he this or why he that...is just a LOT of work. Whereas just not caring about all that, is no work. No hours in a day. So that is not the way I see it. It is difficult enough to get time in and put the effort in when there is a payout. When there is not, it is next to impossible to stay motivated. You make it sound like DRUDGERY to have a romantic relationship and it is nothing of the sort. I don't do half of those things and I have a romantic, passionate relationship. Was it too much work to dress up when you were dating? See, I love dressing up for our dates. I LOVE working out. I LOVE getting my nails done. And I have a full time job. It is a lot like quitting smoking. At first it is hard to create a new habit, but once you make the adjustment it is wonderful.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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I listened to this clip. It was rather annoying. Joyce is spot on and I applaud her for defending women who just have a high need for SF on a physical/biological level. It is so common for people, when they hear of a woman with a high need for SF, to assume this is really a high need for affection, emotional intimacy, etc. That might be the case some of the time, but it certainly isn't all of the time. I am an exception to this. It is frustrating to hear Dr H jump on that bandwagon. I do think in our sitch Mr UW is in it more for the affection and emotional intimacy, and I am in it more for the physical aspect. It's like that in our relationship - DH says I have the mentality of a 14 year old boy. The general attitude that women need romance drives me a little batty. I'm not big on romance.
Me: 30
Him: 39
Together 5 years
Married the very best man in the world 04/06/2013 after being common law for too long. I'm a lucky woman.
7 Cats - Viscount Ashley of Leftfield, Pawkie Petunia, The Timinator, Leo the Lionheart, Fruit Snack, Cloud, and Barret
And our very lucky pony, Starbucks
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a few thoughts...
hello, uw, it's nice to see you, though i'm sorry for the current state of your M.
i, too, felt dr h was still behind the times in that clip on SF. he is so certain that women only want SF for affection, but he is not a woman! while i certainly appreciate affection, i want SF because i physically want SF, period. all that guff about "you don't need to have an orgasm every time, just being together and enjoying that closeness..." hogwash! my entire life i've felt that was a load of crap. anyhow, enough on that.
i do see UW's point - when she was putting out all that effort to meet mr uw's ENs, she wasn't getting anything back from him, so why bother? she can continue getting nothing back when she does as she likes. this is exactly what has driven her into this state of withdrawal - uw, would you say that is right? i don't want to put words in your mouth. while a BS can drive the bus, after so long without response, you just want to stop in the middle of the road and walk away, i imagine. i cannot, however, imagine how much it must suck to be willing to continue the M, put in the effort towards recovery, and have the WS not meet you anywhere along the halfwayish area.
uw, you do realise, i'm sure, that this means your only option, really, is to separate? eventually one of you is going to turn elsewhere for en meeting. i know that preparing to separate, or preparing for an eventual separation, takes energy that you maybe don't have right now (and i agree that you should definitely see your doctor), but i would hate for you to be blindsided by mr uw announcing that he is leaving.
lastly, i'd like to echo ML - i still believe this marriage can be saved. you are both still living in the home together. this can still be turned around.
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i, too, felt dr h was still behind the times in that clip on SF. he is so certain that women only want SF for affection, but he is not a woman! while i certainly appreciate affection, i want SF because i physically want SF, period. all that guff about "you don't need to have an orgasm every time, just being together and enjoying that closeness..." hogwash! my entire life i've felt that was a load of crap. anyhow, enough on that. I hate to tell you this, but you are in the minority. Dr. Harley is spot on. MOST women feel the way he describes. Just because you happen to fall high on the bell curve does not make his statements "hogwash" or a "load of crap."
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The general attitude that women need romance drives me a little batty. I'm not big on romance. This is what happens when a husband never gets on board with the marriage. The wife goes into withdrawal, and no longer cares about the romance.
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