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Yes, just recently I spoke to both my daughter and her friends mother about not being able to pick her up our take her over to their house. Just recently? This incident happened 4 months ago. Does that mean you have been back to the neighborhood to do some transport until "just recently"?
Last edited by SusieQ; 09/08/13 02:12 PM.
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Yes, just recently I spoke to both my daughter and her friends mother about not being able to pick her up our take her over to their house. The other mother is fine with this in that she is usually the drive no matter what, she likes the control. So the answer is yes, your daughter continues going to the house of a friend that lives two door down from the OM. Every time your DD mentions this friend or goes to her house likely triggered your BH horribly. I am really REALLY surprised that this was allowed to continue. You are really going to have to revamp the way that you move forward in this recovery, 15years. I hope this is a real wake-up call and you are able to turn things around...
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Yes, just recently I spoke to both my daughter and her friends mother about not being able to pick her up our take her over to their house. The other mother is fine with this in that she is usually the drive no matter what, she likes the control. So the answer is yes, your daughter continues going to the house of a friend that lives two door down from the OM. Every time your DD mentions this friend or goes to her house likely triggered your BH horribly. I am really REALLY surprised that this was allowed to continue. You are really going to have to revamp the way that you move forward in this recovery, 15years. I hope this is a real wake-up call and you are able to turn things around... Susie, I am really getting tired of your assumptions on everything I say. First, I said I just recently had the conversation with the other mom, you overlooked the part in which I stated that she likes to be the one to drive. I just recently had a conversation with her because I don't see her very often and I wanted to verbalize myself why we could not transport our daughter. Sorry, I don't have the exact date for you so you can scrutinize that as well. In addition neither H or I are willing to stop our daughter from hanging out with a very dear friend. My H and I did POJA this and trigger or not, he does not want this friendship to end. Of course if we move away It will most likely die a natural death, but NEITHER of us are willing to kill it. I understand very clearly that I need to revamp my recovery and will take criticism on legit things that I need to improve on. Please however keep your direct assumptions and accusations to questions rather than jumping to your own truths without knowing all of the facts. Not everything is as black and white as it appears on this website.
Me (WS) Husband (BS)
DS - 15
DD -10
My D-day - 11/12/11
Today Me (BS) H (WS)
D-Day #2 01/14/12
I don't want to just survive my affair, I want to recover from it!
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Nothing is black in white any where.
People make choices and choose certain things over others.
You and H choose to provide continuation of a dear friendship for your child
over
protecting the family from triggers and potential further harm
So you did choose.
Sadly, affairs make no winning situations all around.
It is a shame people have affairs when it invites such sorrow and creates unavoidable losing situations.
Affairs destroy natural order.
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[
In addition neither H or I are willing to stop our daughter from hanging out with a very dear friend. My H and I did POJA this and trigger or not, he does not want this friendship to end. My dear, it is this type of thinking that has almost destroyed your marriage. You have just about completed the job and may yet be successful. The fact that you placed your daughter's friendship over the recovery of your marriage reflects the priority you have placed on recovery. Surely you can see that an intact marriage is much more important to your daughter than a friendship? Many things have come before the recovery of your marriage and that is why you find yourself in this terrible place. There are scads of posts, articles, books, radio shows about how important it may be to move away from the affair partner. You and your H are very aware of the triggers but have chosen to ignore them. I hope you stop doing that. Because if you don't, I predict this marriage is doomed.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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[My H and I did POJA this and trigger or not, he does not want this friendship to end.. This was a clear misapplication of the POJA. The POJA is not intended to be used to reach agreements that are harmful to your marriage. If my H and I "POJA" smoking cigarettes, it does not make smoking safe.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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I understand very clearly that I need to revamp my recovery and will take criticism on legit things that I need to improve on. Please however keep your direct assumptions and accusations to questions rather than jumping to your own truths without knowing all of the facts. Here are some facts from a BH/BS perspective on the dangers of sacrificial decision making and the pain of triggers; It hindered recovery that I allowed my wife to remain at her old job site after the A (OM was long gone, but the physical/geographical location on it's own was a trigger). 3 years later, I can not pass that store, or some other key areas close to it without having a trigger that causes a physical pang. I cannot hear the song that was the OM's ringtone, or any song with a similar sound in nature without having a trigger that causes a physical pang. I cannot drive by a mini-storage without experiencing a trigger that causes a physical pang. I cannot see my wife's former coworkers - it is estimated that they don't know, but I'm sure everybody in the 4 closest stores knows all about it - without feeling humiliated. Here's the deal; you allow this connection to be maintained because you don't want to face the horrible truth; that the affair has effects on EVERYBODY WHO LOVES YOU. Your husband is trying to be admirable in putting a stopper on that - but in the end, that decision has a cost; your husband's love. Is that cost worth it?
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Are you going to email Dr. Harley? Then you and your BH can be on the show together.
What do you think?
FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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If your husband leaves you, his future will STILL hold heartbreak for him. He will lose his marriage and his family and STILL have occasional run ins with the OM. Leaving you will not lessen his pain, it will INCREASE IT, because he will be adding the breakup of his marriage and his children's family.
Mel, being Mel, has anticipated EXACTLY the point I would have wanted to get through to your spouse, either publicly or privately. I saw you posted to MSS, and so you know I have HAMMERED this at him over and over. Like it or not, the best salve for the injuries suffered by a BS are those applied by the FWS. Game, set, match!
Now, I'm only halfway through the 20+ posts on your thread since I read this morning, so I might be back with more - but I do hope the marital history you have with your husband will give him the incentive to reach out for help before pulling the pin on the "dissolution" grenade!
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In addition neither H or I are willing to stop our daughter from hanging out with a very dear friend.
It is discouraging that with all the two of you have been through, you and he (presumably) would agree on such a marital-dangerous course of action, and you would post it here.
Okay, defend the following position in a debate:
RESOLVED: THAT A "DEAR FRIENDSHIP" BETWEEN 10-YEAR-OLD GIRLS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO THREATEN THE MARRIAGE OF THE PARENTS OF ONE OF THEM!
My well-reasoned counter-argument will consist of: ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR FRICKIN' MINDS?
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Once again he truly caught me by surprise. He keeps his feelings so bottled up that it is really hard to ever truly know how he is feeling. I am in such shock and a million different emotions are running through my mind. A part of me feels like he does this to hurt me. That because he is still so hurt that this is one way he knows he can truly "get me back" for what I did. Another part of me is angry because when he agreed to get back together "for real" last year he agreed to be open and honest with me about everything. To me that included telling me how he was feeling instead of bottling it up until he explodes and then want to run away. I am truly exhausted! I have done everything on my side to make our marriage the best it can be. I guess looking back now, I am realizing that for the past couple of months Mr. XVY has not seemed quite as committed. The part of me that really wanted this marriage to work was willing to look over those little things so we could hold onto our marriage.
I am just not sure where to go or what to do? Do I keep fighting? Is it a lost cause if he has given up? I just feel like he is choosing to be miserable and that with or without me he will be miserable. I know these are selfish thoughts but I just don't feel in my heart that his walking away from us is going to make the pain any easier.
Again, I know these are selfish thoughts and that if he really wants to leave, I need to let him go.
I just did not see this coming and am so shocked by it. Not really sure what to do. I keep thinking of Mike Still Smiling and his situation. I have not read his post in awhile but the last one I read he was contemplating leaving for the same reasons that Mr. XVY is.
I remember his post really bothered me. Maybe subconsciously I knew that Mr. was in the same place. Any advice, prayers, thoughts are more than welcome. Thanks for listening!!
Last edited by WalkinForward; 09/08/13 04:54 PM.
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Susie, I am really getting tired of your assumptions on everything I say. Seriously?? Please don't try to turn this around and make this about me "scrutinizing" and making "assumptions" about you. If you would stop being defensive, you would realize the very thing I have been hammering you about is something that has been extremely damaging to your recovery and needed to be discussed! I had to repeatedly ask about your DD continuing to go to a house two doors down from OM and in the end you still didn't really give a straight answer. First, I said I just recently had the conversation with the other mom, you overlooked the part in which I stated that she likes to be the one to drive. No, I didn't overlook it. The fact that the other mom likes to drive, that said condition existed when the broken NC took place, no? I think you stated this as a reason that you thought you were safe from having to travel into that neighborhood before. But in the end, you still had to go over there last minute. And the result? NC was broken. The answer was to CHANGE the conditions that existed = DD never going there again. I said it before and I'll say it again, I am shocked at what I am hearing on this thread, fifteen. You have been here a while and you geniunely seem devoted to keeping your M so I am not understanding the resistance to some pretty basic MB principles.
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Here is the thing. Your husband is not thinking strategically.
If your husband leaves you, his future will STILL hold heartbreak for him. He will lose his marriage and his family and STILL have occasional run ins with the OM. Leaving you will not lessen his pain, it will INCREASE IT, because he will be adding the breakup of his marriage and his children's family.
On the other hand, if you MOVE AWAY together, you will be removing the triggers altogether, eliminating the resentment. Once the triggers are removed, you will have a chance at replacing that resentment with a happy, romantic marriage. [if the present is happy, ones mind does not go to the past] His resentment will fade and he will have an intact marriage and family.
Divorcing you will not make him feel better, it will make him feel WORSE. Your husband is choosing a path that will lead to a life time of resentment and regret. It will also hurt his children and forever damage his relationship with them. If he follows my plan, he can alleviate that resentment and have a happy, content marriage and an intact family for his children.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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I'm sorry,shouldn't my H get some kind if say in whether is not this friend is a trigger? If he says that she is not a trigger at all as long as we don't have to go to the neighborhood then should I tell him that he is wrong and even though we have talked about it openly?
That's what I mean by black and white. No matter how detailed someone is on here, no one on this board can see the entire picture, the gray areas.
Me (WS) Husband (BS)
DS - 15
DD -10
My D-day - 11/12/11
Today Me (BS) H (WS)
D-Day #2 01/14/12
I don't want to just survive my affair, I want to recover from it!
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No. When the trigger became apparent, you the wayward tell your child the friendship is over and that you can't risk your incredibly fragile marriage over a HUGE trigger like this one.
then you suck it up and deal with her pain because it is a result of your terrible choices and that's the price to be paid.
you don't even include your betrayed spouse who SHOULD be able to count on you to make the tough choices needed to enforce your EPs.
pretty simple really.
Last edited by zibbles; 09/08/13 09:51 PM.
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I could also argue that by trying to POJA a huge trigger like this, you were really trying to side step the heartbreak of ending this friendship of your daughters. You didn't want to be alone in causing that pain and included your BH.
Not really fair and hints of the entitlement that causes wayward behavior in the first place if you ask me.
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how do you think he felt when you laid this responsibility at his feet?
honey, do you mind if our daughter hangs out two houses away from OM? she really, really loves her friend and the other mom can do all the driving so we never have to see him!
really?
that would be a love buster of epic proportion if it happened to me. you would rather NOT upset the apple cart than do whatever it takes to make him safe.
Last edited by zibbles; 09/08/13 09:53 PM.
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Once again he truly caught me by surprise. He keeps his feelings so bottled up that it is really hard to ever truly know how he is feeling. I am in such shock and a million different emotions are running through my mind. Wow, I say he keeps his feelings bottled up and you change my words to "I was will to overlook things". Up until last Tuesday I did not even realize that anything was wrong and it was not because I was off living in selfish land and not paying attention to my husband. Up until this past week we have been spending a lot of UA time together, had good conversation (yes some of it could have been more honest on both ends), had great sex, and I felt a real connection and I think he did too. I think seeing OM brought him back to square one and has made everything raw, and no I didn't just say "get over it" and never have. A part of me feels like he does this to hurt me. That because he is still so hurt that this is one way he knows he can truly "get me back" for what I did. Again, the perfect example of why this site is only black and white. There is so much behind the scene "gray area" that does not get seen and heard on this site. My H has openly admitted that he has tried to hurt me (not physically) to get back at me and ease his pain. I have also been lied to and cheated on by him. I completely understand that he is going to be sad, hurt, etc...but I also know from his own admission one of the things he does when he is hurt is tries to hurt me. Another part of me is angry because when he agreed to get back together "for real" last year he agreed to be open and honest with me about everything. To me that included telling me how he was feeling instead of bottling it up until he explodes and then want to run away. Please quit saying that I was pretending that everything was alright. And that I am a cruel heartless B**** that has not been following MB and trying to be open and honest with my H. I actually listen to Dr. H almost every day on the radio. Did you miss the part in this post in which I honestly say I am feeling like LBing and I didn't want to do it to my H so I came here? By the way, isn't Lbing directly bashing someone and assuming you know exactly what they are doing? Just wandering why I can be called an LBer for my words but your Lbing words are A Okay. I am sure there will be some justification for that one. I am truly exhausted! I have done everything on my side to make our marriage the best it can be. I guess looking back now, I am realizing that for the past couple of months Mr. XVY has not seemed quite as committed. The part of me that really wanted this marriage to work was willing to look over those little things so we could hold onto our marriage.
Yes, and I have seen his OW twice now and felt like my guts were ripped out, but I guess that doesn't count. The little things I have overlooked have been his own Lbing behavior. I have never and will never have zero empathy for his pain. Again, I did not say these things to his face. I was hurt and was talking out of my own pain, whether it was selfish or not. I came here to vent and be honest about how I was feeling. Because of this, I have been turned into a monster that has not protected her H an ANY way according to most of you. I realize that we should have moved and I have to reevaluate some of my actions. By God, is there no room for mistakes and learning? You people eat anyone who is not doing exactly what YOU want alive. I am just not sure where to go or what to do? Do I keep fighting? Is it a lost cause if he has given up? I just feel like he is choosing to be miserable and that with or without me he will be miserable. I know these are selfish thoughts but I just don't feel in my heart that his walking away from us is going to make the pain any easier. Three times I have openly admitted that the thoughts I posted were selfish. Yet you still choose to bash me for them. This is the last time I will ever come here and be honest with any of you. I am not walking away from MB because I have read and reread Dr. H's books and listen to him often. I have just started to feel that this has become a bashing board for some of you. A board to be ashamed, appalled, and literally Lovebust people. Have I been given some wonderful advice on here, yes and I will be ever thankful. This post however has really upset me and not because you have opened my eyes to my reality, because you have assumed mine.
Again, I know these are selfish thoughts and that if he really wants to leave, I need to let him go.
I just did not see this coming and am so shocked by it. Not really sure what to do. I keep thinking of Mike Still Smiling and his situation. I have not read his post in awhile but the last one I read he was contemplating leaving for the same reasons that Mr. XVY is.
I remember his post really bothered me. Maybe subconsciously I knew that Mr. was in the same place. Any advice, prayers, thoughts are more than welcome. Thanks for listening!!
My lack of care and dishonesty, wow! I just don't feel like responding to this. I have read lovebusters and am well aware of the many different ways in which someone can bust up another love. I know my fence still needs cleaning and always will. I have tried endlessly to talk to him, encourage him to get on meds, to talk about his feelings etc... All of these things however were not mentioned on here. All of these thing are moments in time shared by us that none of you could ever capture and understand. Sorry for being honest with the people I thought I could be. Sorry for not being perfect and continuing to make mistakes. I realize some of them may have destroyed my marriage but I will just have to try harder and keep cleaning.
Me (WS) Husband (BS)
DS - 15
DD -10
My D-day - 11/12/11
Today Me (BS) H (WS)
D-Day #2 01/14/12
I don't want to just survive my affair, I want to recover from it!
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how do you think he felt when you laid this responsibility at his feet?
honey, do you mind if our daughter hangs out two houses away from OM? she really, really loves her friend and the other mom can do all the driving so we never have to see him!
really?
that would be a love buster of epic proportion if it happened to me. you would rather NOT upset the apple cart than do whatever it takes to make him safe. Well since I was the one who said that I didn't think she should go over there anymore and my H said that he would not allow what I did affect our daughters friendship it actually went the other way around. Not sure if either way is right but just clarify the way the conversation actually went not the way that you guys are assuming that it went.
Me (WS) Husband (BS)
DS - 15
DD -10
My D-day - 11/12/11
Today Me (BS) H (WS)
D-Day #2 01/14/12
I don't want to just survive my affair, I want to recover from it!
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I'm sorry,shouldn't my H get some kind if say in whether is not this friend is a trigger? If he says that she is not a trigger at all as long as we don't have to go to the neighborhood then should I tell him that he is wrong and even though we have talked about it openly?
That's what I mean by black and white. No matter how detailed someone is on here, no one on this board can see the entire picture, the gray areas. As peers, no. Posters do not generally do gray areas. If you want advice on such gray areas, I would recommend writing the radio show. Why? Because posters defer to the mental health professional who founded this program.
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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