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she's reading through SAA. she hates when people write in the margins of books. She showed me her copy. She wrote a note to me on the open fly page, and has noted the crap out of the first few chapters. when she's done she plans to write another note on the back fly and give it to me. she's studying right now curled up in a chair with a pencil in her hand. I was so excited when she showed me. she said before she believes it's possible for us to be together and happy. I'm waiting on her decision right now.


BH Me 34
WW 29
DS 7, DD 5
Multiple EAs 2006-2011
PA 1 OM1 2/2012; D-Day1 3/14/2012; NC 4/1/2012; broke NC 05/2012
PA 2 ONS OW1 7/11/12
PA 3 OM2 1/06/2013; D-Day2 1/14/2013
Divorcing 1/22 Plan A 1/23
Worthless attempt at Trickle Exposure
Multiple PAs OW2,3,&4 since 1/27/2013
WW moved out 3/5/2013
Temp Custody of DS and DD 3/21/13
WW moved back D-Day 3 9/1/13
NC/FR 9/3/13
WW moved out 9/17/13
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Will she come here to post?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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I am certainly going to ask her. I have told her that there are those who understand and can help us through the process. I have to prepare her though for some harsh criticism. Generally when she receives constructive criticism; she shuts down or bolts. Hopefully she receives a fair reception.


BH Me 34
WW 29
DS 7, DD 5
Multiple EAs 2006-2011
PA 1 OM1 2/2012; D-Day1 3/14/2012; NC 4/1/2012; broke NC 05/2012
PA 2 ONS OW1 7/11/12
PA 3 OM2 1/06/2013; D-Day2 1/14/2013
Divorcing 1/22 Plan A 1/23
Worthless attempt at Trickle Exposure
Multiple PAs OW2,3,&4 since 1/27/2013
WW moved out 3/5/2013
Temp Custody of DS and DD 3/21/13
WW moved back D-Day 3 9/1/13
NC/FR 9/3/13
WW moved out 9/17/13
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Posts: 20,272
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Originally Posted By: mijunleigh
I am certainly going to ask her. I have told her that there are those who understand and can help us through the process. I have to prepare her though for some harsh criticism. Generally when she receives constructive criticism; she shuts down or bolts. Hopefully she receives a fair reception.

She will receive support. If she comes on here as a foggy wayward she will receive some good constructive criticism. If she comes on here to learn MB and is willing to put actions to her lessons then she will do really well.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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mijunleigh, happy to have stopped by and seen this wonderful turn of events. Seems your ww is really giving it a shot. Good luck!


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I think I have pushed her too fast and too hard. She says she feels unsafe around me. She knows I will protect her from the outside world, but she doesn't feel safe around me. She doesn't want me to touch her and has no feelings of attraction or love whatsoever. She wants no intimacy at all, but we often flirt and until a few days ago were physically close and even intimate a couple times. I often give her foot and back rubs because she works on her feet, it's something I do to show care for her. She just assumes that I'm always trying to go for more. We've had that problem in the past, but most of her hesitation is due to the loss of affection towards me I'm sure. It's been gone a long time according to her.

She brought up the topic of divorce yesterday based on my thinking that we needed it in order to get a fresh start. I told her this when she first came back because that's where I was at the time. I have changed and wanted to stay married since she has been home and I've been caring for her. She has done some good things for me fulfilling my needs and I have been trying to make my home a place for us "our home".

I have brought up the topic of her coming on here, and I want for us to fill out the EN questionnaire again. I'm hoping to find out what her tops are and how I can start working on them. I'm going off of what I knew her needs to be before she left and I'm sure they have changed a bit after being with POSOM and many of the new experiences she has had. Should I continue with the divorce and go for the clean slate, or should I try to buy time? If buying time is the best how can I get it? I'd love to see her post, finish reading SAA, fill out the EN forms and give me a few weeks to work on meeting them before we say it's done.

This almost sucks as much as when she was gone. At least then I didn't have to live with the flip flop in my head so much.


BH Me 34
WW 29
DS 7, DD 5
Multiple EAs 2006-2011
PA 1 OM1 2/2012; D-Day1 3/14/2012; NC 4/1/2012; broke NC 05/2012
PA 2 ONS OW1 7/11/12
PA 3 OM2 1/06/2013; D-Day2 1/14/2013
Divorcing 1/22 Plan A 1/23
Worthless attempt at Trickle Exposure
Multiple PAs OW2,3,&4 since 1/27/2013
WW moved out 3/5/2013
Temp Custody of DS and DD 3/21/13
WW moved back D-Day 3 9/1/13
NC/FR 9/3/13
WW moved out 9/17/13
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Since you have temp custody I would ask your lawyer what your odds are of getting full custody if you proceed with divorce now

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Originally Posted By: mijunleigh
I think I have pushed her too fast and too hard. She says she feels unsafe around me. She knows I will protect her from the outside world, but she doesn't feel safe around me. She doesn't want me to touch her and has no feelings of attraction or love whatsoever. She wants no intimacy at all, but we often flirt and until a few days ago were physically close and even intimate a couple times. I often give her foot and back rubs because she works on her feet, it's something I do to show care for her. She just assumes that I'm always trying to go for more. We've had that problem in the past, but most of her hesitation is due to the loss of affection towards me I'm sure. It's been gone a long time according to her.

She brought up the topic of divorce yesterday based on my thinking that we needed it in order to get a fresh start. I told her this when she first came back because that's where I was at the time. I have changed and wanted to stay married since she has been home and I've been caring for her. She has done some good things for me fulfilling my needs and I have been trying to make my home a place for us "our home".

I have brought up the topic of her coming on here, and I want for us to fill out the EN questionnaire again. I'm hoping to find out what her tops are and how I can start working on them. I'm going off of what I knew her needs to be before she left and I'm sure they have changed a bit after being with POSOM and many of the new experiences she has had. Should I continue with the divorce and go for the clean slate, or should I try to buy time? If buying time is the best how can I get it? I'd love to see her post, finish reading SAA, fill out the EN forms and give me a few weeks to work on meeting them before we say it's done.

This almost sucks as much as when she was gone. At least then I didn't have to live with the flip flop in my head so much.


It sounds very much like the affair is still on. Sorry frown

Did she ever send a NC letter and change all of the ways that she had contact with the OM (email, phone number, close social networking?)


Ddays 2007 and 2011
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Quote:
NC 9/3/13


This is the thing: You need to almost assume the affair is still on until you can verify that it isn't.


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I see that a NC letter was sent. Was it the one fashioned after the one in SAA aside from the $$ information?


Ddays 2007 and 2011
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Divorced July 2012
2 kids
How to Plan B Correctly
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She sent the NC letter before I gave the OK, but we drafted it together and in similar spirit to the NC letter in SAA.

I have a security camera in the home and have verified all locations she has been. She closed all her online accounts, changed her cell number, but left 1 email address open ostensibly to take care of a water and electric bill at the love shack.

She has been honest about all her communications and whereabouts. She even told me about an email she received the other day. She didn't reveal the content, but I'm sure it was a plea to get her back and apparently she fell right into the trap. I never should have allowed the email to remain open, I wanted her to mail the check. She just broke no contact to go and give him the money for the water bill on a long break from work. His dealer's car was there. I feel like an utter fool, and I can't remember how to deal with this in a MB way.


BH Me 34
WW 29
DS 7, DD 5
Multiple EAs 2006-2011
PA 1 OM1 2/2012; D-Day1 3/14/2012; NC 4/1/2012; broke NC 05/2012
PA 2 ONS OW1 7/11/12
PA 3 OM2 1/06/2013; D-Day2 1/14/2013
Divorcing 1/22 Plan A 1/23
Worthless attempt at Trickle Exposure
Multiple PAs OW2,3,&4 since 1/27/2013
WW moved out 3/5/2013
Temp Custody of DS and DD 3/21/13
WW moved back D-Day 3 9/1/13
NC/FR 9/3/13
WW moved out 9/17/13
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Posts: 7,448
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Originally Posted By: mijunleigh
but left 1 email address open


Quote:
She even told me about an email she received the other day. She didn't reveal the content, but I'm sure it was a plea to get her back and apparently she fell right into the trap.


Quote:
She just broke no contact to go and give him the money for the water bill on a long break from work. His dealer's car was there.


She won't put down the crackpipe. This all should have been taken care of before you allowed her back into the home....


Ddays 2007 and 2011
Plan B 6/21/11
Divorced July 2012
2 kids
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Originally Posted By: mijunleigh
But I do agree that by remaining in the marriage weakens my legal stance. For the protection of myself and my children I do feel I need to complete the divorce proceedings and pick up from there.


Is this still your plan?

I would have her move out until she is willing to completely commit to NC, and she probably shouldn't have access to the internet unless you are sitting right there next to her.

Time to raise the bar. By the looks of your signature line, this woman has put you and your children through hell and the plan you are following now, it is just going to continue.


Ddays 2007 and 2011
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2 kids
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So she met him after Sept 3?

Absolutely proceed with divorce. Instruct your atty that you want full custody of your children;

in the interim you should remain in plan a until you are able to force her out of the house ;during this time you should also have a voice recorder on you at all times (do not let her know about it keep it a secret but many cheating wives have been known to falsely accused her husbands of abuse and have been thrown out of the house do not allow yourself to be placed into this situation)

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Originally Posted By: mijunleigh
She sent the NC letter before I gave the OK, but we drafted it together and in similar spirit to the NC letter in SAA.

I have a security camera in the home and have verified all locations she has been. She closed all her online accounts, changed her cell number, but left 1 email address open ostensibly to take care of a water and electric bill at the love shack.

She has been honest about all her communications and whereabouts. She even told me about an email she received the other day. She didn't reveal the content, but I'm sure it was a plea to get her back and apparently she fell right into the trap. I never should have allowed the email to remain open, I wanted her to mail the check. She just broke no contact to go and give him the money for the water bill on a long break from work. His dealer's car was there. I feel like an utter fool, and I can't remember how to deal with this in a MB way.


The MB way to deal with this scenario in plan a is to figure is to vigorously oppose the affair while simultaneously attempting to meet the cheating spouse's emotional needs ;
so in in this particular case for reestablished contact with the affair partner should be exposed: an exposure email should be sent to family and friends stating "dear family and friends as you may know of my wife has been carrying on an ongoing affair with with this man, she recently committed to working on our marriage but I have learned that they have re-established contact and are continuing the affair; if you have any influence with her please persuade her to end her affair and to work on saving our family"

during this time you need to ensure that you are committing no love busting behavior

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Thanks JK. I've had the VAR on hand. I really hate to go through with the D but i guess i really do have to. She only did it today a few minutes before i posted. Unfortunately the guy lives 3 blocks from me and 1 block from her employer. she said she stopped by tk give the POSOM the money she owed him. Said she felt better about leaving him because she now doesnt have to worry so much that she ruined his life. I almost choked holding in that response. Some things waywards say about give me a coronary! I really cant afford to move, i have no savings and no hope of finding a rent/living situation like i have now. I think i do need to get her out, hopefully to her parents; otherwiss she's gonna end up in some bad situation or another. I'm really scared for her. I just wish she cared enough to give my opinions some thought beyond instant rejection.


BH Me 34
WW 29
DS 7, DD 5
Multiple EAs 2006-2011
PA 1 OM1 2/2012; D-Day1 3/14/2012; NC 4/1/2012; broke NC 05/2012
PA 2 ONS OW1 7/11/12
PA 3 OM2 1/06/2013; D-Day2 1/14/2013
Divorcing 1/22 Plan A 1/23
Worthless attempt at Trickle Exposure
Multiple PAs OW2,3,&4 since 1/27/2013
WW moved out 3/5/2013
Temp Custody of DS and DD 3/21/13
WW moved back D-Day 3 9/1/13
NC/FR 9/3/13
WW moved out 9/17/13
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,448
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Originally Posted By: mijunleigh
Thanks JK. I've had the VAR on hand. I really hate to go through with the D but i guess i really do have to. She only did it today a few minutes before i posted. Unfortunately the guy lives 3 blocks from me and 1 block from her employer. she said she stopped by tk give the POSOM the money she owed him. Said she felt better about leaving him because she now doesnt have to worry so much that she ruined his life. I almost choked holding in that response. Some things waywards say about give me a coronary! I really cant afford to move, i have no savings and no hope of finding a rent/living situation like i have now. I think i do need to get her out, hopefully to her parents; otherwiss she's gonna end up in some bad situation or another. I'm really scared for her. I just wish she cared enough to give my opinions some thought beyond instant rejection.



As long as the OM is a couple of blocks away, R really isn't going to be possible.

Even if you were to move away and end THIS affair, because your WW is a serial cheater, you realize that you would need even more EPs? ALL opportunity for an affair would need to be eliminated. That means that you spend all free time together. Your WW probably shouldn't do things like errands and shopping without you and probably shouldn't have open access to the internet.


Ddays 2007 and 2011
Plan B 6/21/11
Divorced July 2012
2 kids
How to Plan B Correctly
Parallel Parenting in Plan B
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Originally Posted By: mijunleigh
She just broke no contact to go and give him the money for the water bill on a long break from work. His dealer's car was there.


Did she take your children with her?


Ddays 2007 and 2011
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Is she still living with you?! I would ask her to leave after this latest transgression. I know you will be worried about her living situation but that isn't your problem. She should of thought of that before she broke NC.

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Sorry for the novel. Been a looong day.

Well we had a melt-down. And she moved out. This morning my DD said to WW something to the effect of "Daddy said you would stay if we gave Mommy lots of hugs and cuddles." Needless to say WW melted down and said I was using the kids as weapons against her. I did inform her that Family Commitment was my secret weapon nobody but a BS has it. I would never manipulate my children. Here it is if you would like to see it unfold: (she had gone to a blood donation center)

Quote:
WW: Apparently I'm not supposed to drink coffee before I come in. my pulse was too high. frown 9:51 AM
Me: Aww. I'm sorry. They gonna let you wait? 9:52 AM
WW: I did. It stayed at 103. So I have to wait til tomorrow. 9:53 AM
Me: Dang. 9:53 AM
WW: Yep. 9:53 AM
WW: Plus the comment about you telling the kids to make me stay. That didn't help. 9:54 AM
WW: I will always be their mom. 9:56 AM
WW: They know that 9:56 AM
Me: yes I wanted to talk to you about that, but everybody had to leave. in my defense it wasn't said to them exactly that way. 9:56 AM
Me: they do know that and I always tell them that. 9:56 AM
WW: Then what did you say to them 9:57 AM
Me: i asked them if they liked having mommy stay with us, and I said we need to be sure to give her extra hugs and cuddles and loves while she's here. 9:57 AM
Me: I guess they heard it the other way. That you would leave if they didn't. I was trying to express to them that we need to make it as nice and happy for you as possible at home without giving the impression that they needed to try and keep you there. 9:59 AM
Me: but I also don't want them to have the impression that you're there to stay because I really don't know if that's gonna happen. I don't want them to get hurt if you choose to move out. 10:00 AM
Me: last week I expected you were back and would stay, now I am back in flux and don't know where things will end up. That's why I said we should just remove divorce from the table. It gives us a chance and forces US to commit to something together. After divorce, we're just roommates and can come and go as we please. 10:04 AM
WW: (1/4) I'm not staying. You are hurting them and hurting me and I'm so done. Give me a divorce so I can have a life without you. You said you wouldn't use them 10:05 AM
WW: (2/4) against me and then you are sayoing they are your secret weapon. Its over BS. I'm sorry. You are a stranger to me. I can't do this. I'm literally 10:05 AM
WW: (3/4) beating my head against a brick wall with you. Its your way or the highway. You told me not to pretend I'm happy. Well I'm not. I don't know who you are 10:05 AM
WW: (4/4) anymore. For a few days I thought I did. But you proved me wrong daily. 10:05 AM


I came home from work early and she was taking a shower. I typed up an AO/ultimatum letter:

Quote:
I'm sorry in advance for this but I think you need to hear it. Maybe you've thought of some of this yourself, but you haven't voiced it to me. Much of it is stuff I've already said before.

You're right I want this my way or no way. Our kids need both parents. Whole. You're broken and personally I can't heal until you are whole again. I have too much invested in you and our kids, I just can't bear to see you this way. 2 weeks ago I was okay. I was mostly over you and had moved on. I had a plan for my life and the divorce was almost done. But then you opened up to someone finally, and it was me. Your self-esteem is shot, you've acted recklessly with the drugs and sex. You've become mean and cruel and cold and are nothing like the woman I know you really are. Not just to me, but the kids too. For a week and a half you were there, but now this alien is back again. You've turned away and shut out all the good people who are willing to support you; surrounded yourself with other shattered soulds, and I'm basically the only one who's willing to give you a chance. Yes everyone is pretty much through with your crap.

You need help and I can give it, I'm asking for a leap of faith for our kids sakes. You can have a divorce, but not until you're well. It may suck being married to me but you don't have a way to support yourself right now, you can't afford the Dr and counselors and the meds as well as pay your bills and take care of all your other obligations you would incur to be by yourself. Even if I were to give you all the money I have in my retirement in a divorce. It would be gone in no time. Sorry for saying this, but I can't help but think you'd spend it all on drugs and alchohol or shopping therapy or God knows what else. You'd lose a bunch of it to taxes and setting yourself up in an apartment. Sure you could stay with a friend, but honestly your friends now aren't any good. (No offense to those at XXXX, I'm sure there are 1 or 2 good apples there, but you said it yourself they are all smokers.) Or maybe you'd go back to POSOM. I'm sorry to say this but with his anger issues and erratic personality, it's only a matter of time before he hits you in anger. Sure he'd probably be drunk or stoned when it happened and blame it on that.

I want you to stay here and live with me and the kids. You will be my roommate. We will get the bunk bed from your parents and set up the bedroom to your liking. We'll put in storage, and clean it and paint it and whatever else you need as soon as we can. We'll make it your space. So long as I sleep there and keep my clothes there. Sleeping on the couch is really a pain in the ass for both of us and really not fair. I will go with you to the Drs and hold you accountable. I don't believe and neither does anyone else believe that you have told the Drs everything. They can't help unless you're honest. I don't know if you're bi-polar, but I do know you need help with the depression. Our kids deserve to wake up every day knowing that their mother will be there. Right now I don't know how long that will be.

I don't want to have sex with you, I don't want to touch you. I want you to help me find a way to make you comfortable here. And I will do my best to make sure you are. If I had the resources we would move where you could have your own room. Far away from all this, but we can't. We'll have to deal with what we have.


Her response:

Quote:
no


WW then began sorting all of her clothes to pull out what was no longer worn or outright trash. We continued to talk and it came out that she was seriously considering going back to POSOM. I sent a message to MIL and she called. After the conversation WW came back inside in tears. She asked if I would take away the kids if she went back to POSOM. I said Yes I would have to.

I got to the root of the issue. She feels that one of the times we were intimate, just after she arrived, bordered on assault. We have had issues with limits in the past and this event coupled with that past have caused her to loath being in my presence. She and I did get intimate a couple of times after that so I didn't feel so bad about crossing her line even though I knew we shouldn't have engaged in the first place. I should have been attempting to help her through withdrawal and not fill my or her need for SF. I feel awful knowing how she perceives the encounter. Though the only times we have had issues with the limits are when she imposes them because she feels not so friendly towards me. It's terribly confusing. I've often accused her of using sex as a weapon. She is now out of the house.

MIL is encouraging her to take care of herself and stand on her own two feet. Without a gentleman friend for the time being, hopefully she stays away from POSOM. MIL and I both agree that if WW is to bring another man into her life it should be well after WW is stable and he should be someone who fits into the picture. I would rather it end up being me in the end. I suppose we'll see. WW maintains that while I may dislike him POSOM is still a good person. Oh and she never viewed him as an AP. Looks like it's going to be Plan D for me sooner rather than later. I'll still Plan A her whenever I get the chance. Hopefully she stays away from POSOM.


BH Me 34
WW 29
DS 7, DD 5
Multiple EAs 2006-2011
PA 1 OM1 2/2012; D-Day1 3/14/2012; NC 4/1/2012; broke NC 05/2012
PA 2 ONS OW1 7/11/12
PA 3 OM2 1/06/2013; D-Day2 1/14/2013
Divorcing 1/22 Plan A 1/23
Worthless attempt at Trickle Exposure
Multiple PAs OW2,3,&4 since 1/27/2013
WW moved out 3/5/2013
Temp Custody of DS and DD 3/21/13
WW moved back D-Day 3 9/1/13
NC/FR 9/3/13
WW moved out 9/17/13
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