Willing but not able. I'm not able, emotionally to respond respectfully to someone who treats me like this at this level. I literally cannot take it any longer.

I'm sorry, why would you plan B her? There's disrespect going in both directions. If your side of the street was clean, this plan might make sense, but it's not. Not even close. Do want to get her "attention" or do you want a good marriage?

I hear what you say...you don't even like her. I doubt she likes you. You have a textbook MB case. Eliminate LB COMPLETELY and FOREVER (not just for eight hours) and meet each other's emotional needs. Your accounts are deep in the red so it will take quite a bit of time. Your disdain for each other is a vicious cycle with no winners, certainly not your children. Someone needs to break the cycle. Why don't you do it? It's not easy...one SD or DJ and you're right back where you started.

Can you do this?

Dr. Harley's advice for a man who feels like that is antidepressants - you are feeling like the situation is hopeless, feeling like there are no solutions - that's the very definition of depression. That is what depression does: it makes it impossible for you to see solutions to your problems. Antidepressant medication helps to even out your emotional highs and lows to enable you to think rationally about what to do about your problem, because your emotions will sabotage you.

Dr. Harley cautions people to pick his Plan A or Plan B and to avoid what he calls "Plan C," which is not having a plan at all. Either show your wife the BEST of you so you can chip away at this problem by making the most love bank deposits possible (Plan A) (and use antidepressants to help with that!), or separate to protect both of you from further love bank withdrawals. What you are doing now is not working.

Now, you are saying a lot about how you "reached a limit" and are just "not able" to remain respectful, etc., and I am here to tell you that this is not factually true. It is a lie you tell yourself. As an abusive husband, I had to learn to quit telling myself this lie in order to learn how to stop the abuse: my demands, disrespect, and angry outbursts. I had to learn that it was always my choice whether to become angry, disrespectful, or demanding, or not. I had to learn that it was possible to abstain from these three behaviors NO MATTER WHAT MY WIFE DID TO ME. Even if she broke every Marriage Builders rule in the book, even if she was demanding, disrespectful, and angry towards me (she was), even if she had an affair (she did), I learned that it was possible at all times to not abuse her in response.

And wives of abusive (and formerly abusive) husbands are very testing. Dr. Harley has said that even when working with these women, knowing that they are risking all of their marital recovery and sometimes even risking their husbands going to jail or worse, he has a very, very hard time convincing them to not do things that are very testing to their husbands. But he has a LOT of success teaching the husbands to never be demanding, disrespectful, or angry no matter what the wife does. This is the only way marital recovery is possible for these situations. And it works!

If you persist in telling yourself that you can't do it, you really do need to see your doctor about prescribing antidepressants. My doctor prescribed lexapro. Dr. Harley often recommends wellbutrin. I felt I was going to break just going to my doctor and asking, but I'm so glad I did! I was only on them for about three months, and in that time we turned everything around and our marriage is great!

It would be better to separate from your wife than to "reach a limit" and be demanding, disrespectful, or angry toward her.

But it would be even better to learn how to not be demanding, disrespectful, or angry no matter what. This is something Dr. Harley has taught husbands how to do, and you can do it, too. This is the only chance your marriage has. If you do not get on board with eliminating these three behaviors NO MATTER WHAT, she certainly never will.

Fighting is a death knell to marriage. It is like nuclear war. Nobody wins.

This article describes the procedure that you need to follow to learn to eliminate your demands, disrespect, and anger:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8122_neg.html

Don't expect to find happiness after divorce without learning to eliminate these behaviors. It won't work and it will be even harder. You and your wife at least have your daughter in common to motivate you toward a common goal. First marriages are a lot easier to make work than later relationships. But they never work if somebody holds on to a "limit" after which they justify demands, disrespect, and anger.

BTW, I empathize with your wife being very upset at you if you presented the teacher's opinion as "right" and your wife's opinion as "wrong." The teacher is just a human being just like anybody else and is not really any kind of authority - you and your wife can probably make far better decisions about your daughter's education than the teacher can if you will take off the table all ideas that you are not both enthusiastic about.

There are lots of parenting and educational fads that have been in and out through the years. Having two parents brainstorm about possible ways to solve problems and work together to find a solution they are both enthusiastic about is the BEST possible way to correct for this!

Thanks all for the advice. I moved out to my parents. We had a discussion afterwards and decided to take a break and attempt to go see a therapist together, not solo. I believe in MB, I really do, but that doesn't mean it works in all situations at least at this moment in time. If you anyone can help me find a therapist that knows MB in my area, please send me a PM. I'm not able to follow the plan to a tee so I need help if I want to save this. Thanks guys. What a sad day.

Nope at this moment I literally cannot do it. She is beyond unreasonable, in fact if she was cheating I would not be surprised. Most unreasonable person I've ever met.

Sure I'll consider this. I'll take all the help I can get!

That was my conclusion at this time.

I'm sorry to hear that you aren't able to reign in your own Lovebusters. The idea isn't to sit there and take hers without a peep, but to be a good role model and bringing up "it bothers me when you speak to me like that" as a way to address her Lovebusters. Sarcasm is a bad idea no matter how long you feel you've been putting up with abuse. All we're saying is that there's no excuse for you behaving with Lovebusters in response because there are more successful (and dignified) ways of handling these situations.

As you sit there over at your parents, you could still do yourself good by reading Lovebusters and practice not making them. It's not her fault that you use sarcasm or any other LB, it's your own. You can still work on that. You are probably going to have to interact with her in the near future, so don't engage in Lovebusters with her in the present and future. For goodness' sake, don't be "pretend honest" by telling her she's unreasonable or any other disrespectful judgement like that.

Well, now that's done...What are your expectations before moving back in and working on your M? How do you intend to fill your role as husband and father while you are separated?

Markos is right, though. Dr. Harley specifically challanges men to completely eliminate any and all LB regardless of the LB our W's direct at us. IMO, It's likely their conditioned response to the way we have treated them over the years, and then we have the nerve to say WE'VE had enough? I'll admit, your W seems a little more challanging than my W, but I eventually gave up all AO and DJ. It wasn't easy but 300mg a day of Wellbutrin made all the difference. It changed the "can't" into "maybe". My personal work ethic turned the "maybe" into "can".

Contacting Steve. I don't believe any amount of MB will encourage my wife to change. She lives in an alternate universe, and that is me being objective about it entirely. I'll see what Steve has to say about all of this. My wife's not healthy and it is accelerating and the environment is horrific. I'll keep you posted.

DJ

DJ

DJ

The problem is not entirely your wife's. You've been here for over 2 years, and I see little improvement on your part.

This is the option I've chosen, but Steve might have a different view point.

My issue was that she entirely rejected what actually occurred. I have no problem finding a win/win for both of us, but it never gets that far because we spend time discussing whether or not something actually happen. It is so knee jerk I can't even describe it. When I'm respectful in my language, and she knows MB, I think it takes her back to a place that she hated being in. She hates MB. She does this with everything which is why I find it so hard to eliminate my lovebusters.

You're right Prisca, it is not entirely her fault, and I never said it was. I did improve for a long time, I'd go an entire month without a DJ but it never got me anywhere. I can't imagine being able to sustain it with this woman for any period of time without help from a third party.

appt is booked for tomorrow with Steve.

Don't spend time with her arguing about what actually occurred. Allow her to have her own opinion as to what actually occurred, even if it differs from yours. There is no need whatsoever to straighten her out about this.

My wife and I have different memories about events ALL THE TIME. We don't try to straighten each other out about it. We don't approach it as if one of us is right and the other one is wrong.

It is possible to learn to not love bust no matter what your wife does. It's essentially a required skill for having a good marriage.