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Even if your wife had sent "just a text" on Easter day, that is still contact. But she didn't just send a text, she talked with him.

Dr. Harley has stated that it is "not surprising" that many waywards continue contact after promising NC. It shows that they have not yet gotten the enormity of the situation.

My H wrote a NC letter and then called and left a message warning her about exposure because he felt so bad about "hurting her".

Did your wife cancel the divorce as promised?

WD, when my H (finally) truly went NC, he took off work so that we could be together 24/7 until we got all EPs firm. Dr. Harley often recommends a vacation at this time. If you two could go on that vacation to Florida right now, that would be ideal (once she truly goes NC).

Don't talk with her about "responsibility". It won't even absorb. Right now, even if true NC, she will still be in a fog for a while. You need to continue focusing on meeting her needs as much as she will allow it. EVEN while setting up EPs that will safeguard your marriage.

With my H, it literally took us being together 24/7 for about three weeks, before he even popped his head out of the fog long enough to start talking with me about the things that HE was doing to protect us. Prior to that, it was all about MY being so mean as to take away his cake. Right now WD, you're going to be dealing with an addict for a while yet. Be kind (no LB'ers). Be steadfast in your love. Meet her ENs.

Things are different with a Wwife though, so please take my words with a grain of salt and listen to the vet husbands who have been through this.


DDays - six months of them
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We never knew that it could be this good! smile
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WD, you know that your W is Not the exception. She did Everything according to theWW Script, to the Extreme, plus still following the script regarding being in contact with that POSOM.

Can you get her to accept the Online Personal Course and/or coaching with Steve Harley?

Are the two of you still reading SAA together?

The NC Letter and compliance with following through are and Absolute necessity. No short cuts on that one at all.

I don't know enough on how to advise you on how to draw that line in the sand to ensure that it gets done properly, except for to say how you can actually empathize with her feelings of withdrawal and you still are her support to get through it together, but it MUST be done if there is any chance to recover and flourish.

No matter how good you are at making LB Deposits, they will all be for naught if she continues to be in contact in any way, shape or form.

This will actually be more emotionally taxing on you than breaking up the affair fantasy was. Dig in and stay the course.

LTL

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Take some emergency personal time off and the two of you go away someplace. That will make the time pass easier.

If your W has the guts to back up what she originally told you when she thought she wanted to reconcile, then maybe She should place a Temporary Restraining Order against the POSOM.

Did He contact Her on Easter, or did She initiate that phone call.

LTL

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You have lots of support on this forum, so keep updating and asking questions.

The no LBs are still a huge factor, so keep up the great work.

My experience is that a WS does consider EPs and discussions of the MB program to be an LB while still in the fog. (It is like telling a reluctant child to eat their veggies, they don't like it and they stomp their feet and pout. However, you know it is the best thing for them and done out of love. It requires the right balance of insistence and patience.)


D-Day 1 - May 4, 2012

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WD, I would first exchange your phones so the OM can't call her. That avenue needs to be shut off completely. Will she end her affair today?

Secondly, I would frame the EPs as a voluntary step to protect you from further harm. The affair has been the most painful thing in your life and these are the steps that will make you feel safe. State it to her that way.

Keep this on the front burner until you are safe.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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WD ~ even after a year of my A being over, my H and I are still working to ensure that our EP's remain in place. There is NO room for error with this, there are no "second chances" for me, which is why having them in the first place is SO important.
How can you begin to recover when she can't even end contact? As a FWW, I can tell you, she has to WANT to end it, she has to WANT to recover, she has to WANT to rebuild your marriage, until she comes out of her fog, until the steps to prevent any future affair are in place, she's not going to want to. as you've been told already waywards lie! We will do anything to keep "our cake and eat it", your allowing her to do this.


FWW, 36

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I am sorry to hear there is still contact. You know what to do as you are given good advice. Remember to keep your cool (which you have done) and follow the MB plan.

add: I have heard Dr. Harley say a vacation where its just you and her is a good idea to "prime the pump". It also ensures NC as you will be with her 24/7. LTL was dead on with that suggestion.

Last edited by TranquilDark; 04/22/14 11:42 AM.
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WD.

Take some time off with your W NOW! And go away, try to find a romantic secluded place for a few days. Do whatever it takes. Vacation, FMLA, SL whatever is necessary. Avoid LB (easier said than done). Ask your W to exchange phones while away, if OM tries to contact her, just erase msg, vm or whatever. Stay by her side the entire time. Talk about your future together. If she wants to talk about the A, let her but do not initiate.
The next few days are going to be critical. She is still in the fog.
She doesn't understand the enormity of her actions yet. It will take time.

You have been doing a fabulous job. Happy for you.


Sacrifice is at the heart of repentance. Without deeds, your apology is worthless.
Bryan Davis, Liberator

I am the WH of FooledMeTwice.
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wd,

this is very typical as well, this is the part where she thinks she has done her part and you should just trust her, tell her you can't until the requirements are put into place and you feel safe enough to trust her again at some point..
Tell her you don't want a relationship like you had where there wasn't transparency or a commitment to meet the others needs.
NC for life or you can't begin this is step one, they all fight this part because they have to go through withdrawal still, seeing that she still lied to you should tell you she isn't' there yet


BW 56
WH 57
Married 25 years, live together for 2, dated 2 years before that.....
DS 23, DS 25
D-Day Nov 23/09
NC Mar 1/10
Working on Recovery
Grateful for finding Marriage Builders
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Ditto on the vacation. Dr. Harley recommends it, and it is a great way to keep her away from the other man.

The EP's are non-negotiable. You see, you are simply not safe unless she agrees to them. When my wife and returned, she was reluctant to do some of them. I had to tell her everything was off until she agreed. She came around when I held her accountable.

My situation was different than yours. We were divorced and had been apart for over a year, and she had hit rock bottom.

But in order for your marriage to recover, she must do the EPs. There is no way around it.

Again, do a get-away. Might help her get further out of the fog.

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WD - your WW is still in the affair. She has not completed your requirements for recovery. What were your requirements? If the affair is still ongoing your are either in Plan A or Plan B. Which plan are you in?

Originally Posted By: wifedivorcing
...it's over the top and her life is going to be controlled and looked at by a microscope.

Of course she will say this. FOGBABBLE. "How else can I continue to get my fix of POSOM"

Originally Posted By: wifedivorcing
...there was a 27min phone call to OM on Easter day. I asked her on Easter if there was any contact and she said just a text happy Easter it said.

Don't ask question when you know the answer. You can't demand honesty. She is still wayward.

Originally Posted By: wifedivorcing
She has read a lot on Surviving an Affair...

You can not educate a wayward. This for when you both in Recovery.

Quote:
...anytime the EP[s] are mentioned...

No mentioning. This is a requirement for Recovery.


Last edited by clark_kent; 04/22/14 10:47 PM.
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Clark Kent,
why dont you do something more helpful like fly to OM place, grab him and carry him to the moon and drop him off there?

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Jedi,

I used to believe that all POSOM/OW should have something despicable, mean, and nasty happen to them. Oh... but they are living it. Can you imagine that life? The only thing they deserve is our pity.

I know now that the BS has only control over setting the stage for recovery. The BS does not kill the affair. the Waytards do that themselves. Exposure/Plan A/Plan B are the ways in which the stage for recovery is set.

Exposure is the way a BS give a sense of control for what appears to be an uncontrollable situation. It helps draw the BS into logical thinking and action orientation, instead of being subsumed by the waywards fogbabble and inaction to save the marriage. Read how MelodyLane's posts. She sets the stage for the logical thinking for exposure.
Originally Posted By: MelodyLane
Please go read the exposure thread linked in my signature and come back and we can talk.

Originally Posted By: MelodyLane
Enabling does not save marriages.

Originally Posted By: MelodyLane
The more people who know, the more people to hold her accountable.

It demonstrates to the wayward a level of protection for the marriage, that immediately is not understood as long the waytard is wayward.

If you want to read the best Plan A, read ?????'s thread. Can't remember who it was. The funniest part is ????? knew WS was meeting up OW and she had to get her mom to come over while she was getting gussied up to the nines. Vets please help. Plan A extraordinaire. I could go on about the Plan A. Read the thread. When I ran across it I peeked at the ending, then read the whole thing. Way funny!

Plan B. WOW! That was indiegirl. I did not peek at the end. Was rooting for the underdog. She had me crying and laughing at the same time. It took an entire night. Wondering all the time if her xWaytard would want to recover. Hoping. After the all nighter just took it and realized indiegirl was not an underdog, but the heroine getting everything she needed. WOW!

Affair partners cannot ever becoming Buyer/Buyer. the dynamics for that occurring are astronimical. when I finish reading FRB, I'll comment further.

Last edited by clark_kent; 04/23/14 12:23 AM.
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Last edited by clark_kent; 04/23/14 12:59 AM.
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Originally Posted By: wifedivorcing
Of course this isn't easy as I'm finding out. My wife gets angry when I tell her about being transparent. She gave me her password to her cell phone and of course there was a 27min phone call to OM on Easter day. I asked her on Easter if there was any contact and she said just a text happy Easter it said.

How do I handle this?

She has read a lot on Surviving an Affair and she said it's over the top and her life is going to be controlled and looked at by a microscope. She thinks she is the exception to the book and how waywards are.

I just don't know how to handle it. We are having great time together but anytime the EP are mentioned she gets angry and blames.me. I told her I know she is angry however Im not the one responsible for her being humiliated nor am a I'm responsible for her reputation being looked at.

I don't want to love bust. She throws that in my face now, you're love busting by talking about it. I'm not throwing the affair.in her face at all. She is the one COMPLAINING about EP.

The positive is she gave me her cell password.
She now back and forth about the nc letter. It's like I have to go by her steps. She said you want all this done in one day, I said yes so we can move forward and protect our marriage for the future.



How are you doing WD?

The microscopic look into EACH OTHERS lives are for BOTH of you.

Without complete honesty and transparency, either one of you could become vulnerable to someone else meeting your Emotional Needs.

Often enough, a BS becomes the one having an affair, so your W needs to understand that these EP's are also for HER protection as well.

I sure hope that your prolonged absence from posting insinuates that maybe you two did decide to get away together for some meaningful UA time.

When is the hearing for the PPO filed against you by the POSOM?

Did your W withdraw the Divorce Petition?

I hope all is well. Take care and control of this vital period of initiating Recovery.

LTL

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Closure contact is common.

They also think they can keep their affair partner as a friend and casual contact. They don't get "no contact" as they just think it means no [more] skin to skin contact.

I know it FEELS like you are in recovery at times but in all the conversations and manipulations just remember that "no contact" is the ONLY goal right now. You can't even begin to truly recover until you achieve "no contact". She can read SAA and play the "I'm gonna cancel the divorce petition" and even actually cancel the petition but you've got NOTHING until you get absolute and final "no contact".

Mr. W

p.s. - another favorite tactic...lead you on and then shock you with some silly wayward comment and when you react THEN blame you for resorting back to your old ways and saying "see, I knew you were acting" and then run out of the house and call OM. It's about getting her fix of the OM and not you. Just stay calm and persistent as you have all these last weeks.


FBH(me)-51 FWW-49 (MrsWondering)
DD19 DS 22 Dday-2005-Recovered

"agree to disagree" = Used when one wants to reject the objective reality of the situation and hopefully replace it with their own.
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Wd,

How is it going?


Sacrifice is at the heart of repentance. Without deeds, your apology is worthless.
Bryan Davis, Liberator

I am the WH of FooledMeTwice.
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Very pleased to hear about your recent successes! Richly deserved.

I'd say you are still in Plan A for the time being, as she waffles and the negotiations continue. Do you think you could take advantage of this current softness and take her away for a short trip?

Changing phones, as ML suggested is a great idea. I'd say she likes that you were protective of her to this intruder and I'd sell it along those lines. That you want to keep him away from her so he doesn't hurt her as he did his wife etc... Even if she doesn't go for it, the offer will resonate and it will tell you something about the state of the affair.


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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You haven't posted for nearly a week.
I hope that you are not accepting her terms for marital recovery, or being bullied into a quiet divorce.....

or back in the mental hospital

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I think they are on vacation in Florida smile


Me: BW, 36; WH: 37
Married 14 years
DD: 4yr, DS: 8 month
DD: 11/24/2013
Plan A (not properly done) since DD. Exposure to OW's friend and work on 03/25/2014. Lots of LBs.
Plan B (w/ MIL lives w/ me): started 4/4/2014. Exposed WH to most of our friends in early 05/2014.
Plan A before moving to CA as suggested by Dr Harley started 6/8/14.
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