Hi!
My story is:
Married 8 1/2 years, 6 year old son, 15 month old daughter
Good but not perfect marriage for the past 8 years. the past 5 months have been horrible.
Last August my husband took a job out of state. We considered moving as a family but decided against (I regret that big time).
Husband works out of state Monday through Thursday, back home thursday night and home through the weekend leaving Monday morning.
November we had our first big fight that had my husband suggesting trial separation. I was SHOCKED. We've fought hard before but never has the D word come up.
We keep coming back together but he grows more and more distant and right now he "doesn't know" if he wants to be with me. When he is home he isn't really "home." He is mean and exhausted often. No, there isn't another- I have checked into it. But he has started watching porn when he is away which I know has added to the distance. He is unbelievably stressed as this is a high power position and the company is tanking.
At our last "make-up" I suggested we move together as a family but he doesn't want that anymore because we've been fighting too much, he doesn't like the state he is working in and says he likes leaving and coming 'home.' Whenever we fight he goes straight to "we shouldn't be together." It just hurts too much to hear this all the time.
I just started private coaching with Dr. Harley (today was my first call) and I hope I can get SO on board to coach with me/Dr. Harley.
But, if not, and because he goes to separation so often so quickly, I'd like to prepare a Plan A/B ahead of time. I think it will give me strength.

Any advice/sample letters without an affair greatly appreciated.

I assume you are couching with Dr Harley's son Steve Harley?

Did he give you any help or suggestions for bringing your husband on board with MB? Coaching?

Also, welcome to MB. I'm sorry you are in distress.

Welcome to MB.

What advice did Steve Harley give you?

Thank you both-

My fist step is getting my husband on board with coaching. So that is the goal this weekend. Yes, he gave me some pretty straightforward (and genius) things to say- I feel fairly confident that he will at least call and coach with him....
I'd just like to be prepared if he doesn't.

SFL,

Dr. Harley does not suggest that women remain in a Plan A for a very long time. In cases of an active affair, he would suggest women move to Plan B after three weeks. Without an active affair he might suggest giving it a little longer, but not months or years.

I would let your husband know that in order to keep you, he needs to stop watching porn and commit to no nights apart. That means his job must go, or he must take you with you. There is no way to make this work if he maintains the right to do either of those things. Steve Harley may be able to help persuade him of the importance of making these changes. You might also want to contact Steve's father, Dr. Harley, on the Marriage Builders Radio show: mbradio@marriagebuilders.com

Also, SFL, you've got to stop fighting with him! That is a mandatory part of Plan A no matter what the situation and no matter how short or long it is. Do not be demanding, disrespectful, or angry toward him. Simply let him know what your complaints are and what it will take to keep you as his wife (quit the porn and the nights apart). You don't have to be demanding, disrespectful, or angry to do this. For example, don't tell him how disgusting or sinful porn use is - stick to the fact that it hurts you terribly and is unacceptable to you and that psychologists like Dr. Harley say it causes a contrast effect that makes you less desirable to him. As another example, don't blow up at him, call him names, punish him, etc. If he says he's not going to do these things, let that be his choice, and then you do what you have to do to protect yourself - move to Plan B.

You can do the whole thing without one single disrespectful or angry word, even though you are hurting dearly because of his behavior. You can, should, and must let him know that you are hurting terribly, but do not try to make him feel what you feel or demonstrate by getting upset (angry).

Are there any sample Plan B letters that aren't because of an affair?

His reasoning for not wanting me to go with him is because he ates the state, the job is tumultuous (not knowing if it's going to end in 2 months or a year)

I'm not sure how to prepare Plan B when he already is separated from us MOnday through Thursday. Basically what he'd lose is seeing me at all on the weekends, talking to me at all (which is currently very minimal) and he'd lose Friday with the kids and sunday (because my terms would be that he can come and get kids from a 2nd person Friday at 5 and bring them back to me Saturday before bedtime.) Financially he is the complete breadwinner So this would be a separation with no change in financial situation. Is that possible?

SFL,

Welcome to MB and I'm so sorry that you are going through such a hard time. I think all the advice you are getting is wonderful.

The only advice I would give you is don't over think it just listen to Dr. Harley and if you pray, pray before you do what he tells you to do.

I know how you feel, I have felt the same way like I need to get a lot of advice so that I could control what is happening with my marriage. What I have found is when I get a lot of advice from a lot of different people it can make me unsure of what to do. I even have found that I start taking bits and pieces from everyone which doesn't seem to work.

It's like learning how to drive, one instructor is tell you to do it in this way, while others are giving different directions to do the same thing and when the time comes you choke.

I'm a man that reads a Bible a lot an it does say a wise man has many advisers and I believe that to be true. I just want you to listen to Dr. Harley and if you are unclear how to do what he a has advised then post the advice and let us help you with following that advice. Of course if you are unsure the advice is the wises for you and your husband, and want a sounding board to make sure you are doing the right thing let us help with that.

I so wish you success and we are here for you even if you just need to vent because you are not able to vent to your husband right now. Just make sure you say you are
venting in your post so we know you just need to know you are not crazy in what you are feeling and that you don't need advice right now.

Are you legally married?
Why do you call him your significant other?

He is probably having an affair.
A man that is gone for 4 days usually loves to be home..I used to spend a third of the year out of town and I loved getting home.

I encourage you to snoop and see if he is having an affair

Then again, it's entirely possible that his emotional needs are not being met, it could be that he's sacrificing the most important ones for the financial stability of the household - that would be my guess if he (as SFL says) hates where he's working. Is Financial Support one of your top ENs? Is it one of his? Why spend youth seeking wealth, then wealth seeking youth?

My grandfather, on the other hand, just loved his job and was cranky when he wasn't working. He actually retired, then decided he had to go back to work because he was miserable. Not because Gram wasn't a wonderful housekeeper and wife, but he just lived for his work. It doesn't sound like this is the case with you two.

The doctor will probably suggest a survey of your respective emotional needs. Even doing one for yourself would be enlightening. I realized that the one I thought was highest wasn't really up there very far, when I really looked at what would make me happy without any of the other ENs being met. You might even find that what he's focusing on most is your lowest priority, and vice versa.

Discord, there are a couple of cardinal MB rules being broken here: spending the night apart and having a job that does not complement the marriage. Those are a big no no.

The most important emotional needs that are being neglected here are the INTIMATE emotional needs of affection, conversation, recreational companionship and sexual fulfillment. THOSE are the key emotional needs that create romantic love in a marriage. FS and DS and other minor needs do not support the foundation of the marriage.

But none of that is relevant if they are not spending every night together and spending UA time together. It is impossible to sustain romantic love under these conditions.

Hi, I've posted before but now have new info. I currently started working with Steve Harley but am just beginning doing "Love Busters." We have been pretty rocky over the past 6 months with hubs wanting "out" (but not really) several times. I say not really because he never pulls the trigger. These past 2 weeks have been pretty darn good, but this weekend I discovered that a woman he works closely with calls him "Babe" and "sweetie" and says "I miss you." and even called him leaving a teary message saying "Sweetie... I love you so much." Now believe it or not I know for a fact they are not having an affair. She is "trouble" and nothing physical has happened. I don't want to tell my hubs that I know the above because he doesn't know I know his cell phone code. What do I do with this information? He has never cheated on me but he is letting this type of language happen. I know this gives him something. Do I proceed with the program/coaching with Steve and when we get to a better place, then ask him to quit letting this be? Or do I treat this as an "affair" even though this is the extent of it? Any advice appreciated. Thank you!

This is an affair. Why do you think it isn't?

Any woman who tells a married man she loves him and misses him is having an affair.

Have you looked up his online phone account to see how much they are communicating?

Also, hit Notify to have your thread moved to SAA.

Do you have the book SAA?

Please read these.
Start Here First-SAA

HI- I appreciate your help but Everything I have listed is all that it is. I know for a fact that nothing physical has happened. So, if they text and she communicates like this- is that considered an affair? Just want to be clear. I don't think "exposing" that she texts like that at the workplace or to friends, etc. would be truly taken as an affair. I have snooped and snooped, plus he is scared to death of Sexual harassment and has even gone so far as to make sure they are never alone together. So the extent of it, is, fully, that she talks to him that way.
Please advise.
Thank you.

Why is she texting his personal device if it's work related? Why doesn't he report her for crossing the line?

What are HIS responses to her? What does he text her?

- It is his only phone. He doesn't report her because I'm sure he enjoys it to some extent.

- If she says "I miss you!" he says, "me too."

Again, their inappropriate relationship of her calling him babe, etc. (and him not telling her not to) is the extent of it.

We are already barely moving forward and I think we aren't in a healthy enough place for me to ask that he stop it. Was thinking I should move forward with building (why I put it in Marriage Builders section) and then, when we are both "on board" with moving forward, that would be a definite Love Buster that needs to stop? But any advice if that doesn't sound right is welcomed!

If it's not physical it soon will be. There's no way they haven't had some kind of physical contact, such as kissing. Have you ever exchanged I love you's with someone you'd never touched?

I appreciate you've snooped but we've seen affairees who make the PA happen at work, on lunch or via email and webcam.

If he can't fend off her emotional advances then he can't fend off the physical ones either. He does get something out of it I'm afraid.

The fact you say 'possible' EA tells me you are downplaying this in this in your shock. They are communicating like lovers. You have PROOF of an EA. Enough to expose.

It really doesn't matter whether an affair is physical or not,, the plan to kill it remains the same. Expose, demand NC, plan A and plan B.

You may have a shot to prevent this going physical but you won't have long. Do not dilly dally.



This affair is the cause of your marital problems. You cannot make love bank deposits when an OP is too. Your H's natural response will be to keep your marriage in trouble as a justification while enjoying the cheap admiration of a trouble free idyll. All unexposed affairs are trouble free idylls.

You won't make progress while this affair lives.

I don't think he is a passive recipient but if he is, and you have got a pro mistress targeting him you cannot delay. She won't stop until she has him and your marriage is so vulnerable she will succeed.

An important part of exposure is the workplace. Is your H her superior?

Is she married?

I think this is probably a full blown A because of your timidity in tackling it. Usually that means the WS has worked hard to make the betrayed feel unloved and timid.

I saw in your previous thread that your H asked for a trial separation.

You need to listen - your H is having an affair. People who ask for separations or "space" have someone waiting in the wings. Dr Harley has said it and it's what we have seen over and over and over again here on the MB forums.

What we also see frequently is a poster who is in denial that there is an affair, they swear on a stack of bibles that they have snooped, that they just know there isn't one etc. And they always come back later and tell us that we were right.

You can't know everything because THEY WORK TOGETHER.

It's not a coincidence that you found out this woman is telling your H she loves him and you have been having marital issues for the past six months.