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You are handling yourself admirably.

I agree, you need to go no contact with your WH to protect yourself. Get your number changed or simply turn off your phone for a few hours.

You don't have to answer every call or read every text! When you respond you are meeting his EN. Let him vent at OW.


Me 58: FWH (NC 32 yr), W 60, married 36 yr, DD 32
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Thanks so much everyone. Officially in Plan B and he has been served!
He hasn't contacted me since.

His texts before plan B were threatening to lock me up for extortion and taking my kids from me, etc, etc. they were just awful. Then when I was asking him to deposit 1/2 the funds of one of our investments accounts he texted back with some details and said, "I can't believe we are actually doing this. And it's all my fault." Then, the next day he texted at our son's bedtime asking if he could talk to him (he hasn't cared to call in months). I let him know it wasn't a good time because we were at a special school event (our son was off with his friends) and he said. "Oh, Ok. I feel sick."
He knows he is losing so much but he is still choosing it!
Just sad.
Glad I served him first but he is a smart, tough one and I am worried about what's to come.
Appreciating all of your support so much. My kids are my life, and I am a damn good mom. Him trying to get the kids more than the minimum is just a power play for him because he has been so absent for so long....


BS
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Originally Posted by SFL
I let him know it wasn't a good time because we were at a special school event (our son was off with his friends) and he said. "Oh, Ok. I feel sick."


You hear the word *I* an awful lot, when your spouse is betraying you. "I feel so terrible! - yet I continue trying to destroy us all! Go figure!"

Don't get me wrong, it's an addiction and I know for sure it is terribly depressing and all that (they know deep down they are hooked on a very dismal type of person who won't cut it long term) but it's a bit rich to expect YOU to feel sorry for THEM.

Good job not falling for it.

Have you cut off EVERY way he has of contacting you? How could he contact you if he really wanted to?


The first few weeks of Plan B are typically the roughest. What self care do you have planned?





What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Mornin' SFL

Glad to read that he has been served and I hope that you are feeling "ok"....all things considered. If WH sends you angry or boo hoo poor me text/emails, keep them. Do not delete anything...tell your IM not to delete anything either. WH's communications may help you in court...waywards manage to spew all sorts of idiotic garbage and hang themselves even more then they already have.

Like you, I was practically a married single mother for a long time given that my then WH seemed to be more married to his job and interested in syrupy admiration for OW. Expect him to spout off to your attorney how he will seek 50/50 or sole custody MrRollieEyes Ignore this type stuff...you have been primary care taker forever and it is physically impossible for him to be primary given his work. Your attorney should draw WH a very clear diagram that not only will that not happen but that he may want to save himself a lot of embarrassment by accepting a reasonable divorce agreement.

You will be ok, SFL.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
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Originally Posted by SFL
He knows he is losing so much but he is still choosing it!
Just sad.

It is the nature of an addict. The full force of reality upon him is his best chance at saving himself.


You, on the other hand, have Plan B which gives YOU the ability to take control of your life and protect yourself from him. Right now he is a crazy and reckless addict who will pull you down with him unless you cut off all contact.











ME: BW
HIM: FWH
Married 18 yrs
DDay 09/2008 and 12/2008

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You all are so amazing. Thank you.

Yes, I've cut off all contact and it is very, very helpful. Plan B has saved my sanity. I have mailed most of his stuff off- but I do have some things (photos of his, things I didn't want to ship off to another state) that I'd REALLY like to get rid of asap. I told my IM to let him know it's all packed up and I'd like to get it all shipped as soon as he gets a place here or I get the address of his sister who lives near by.
I have A LOT of books of his and some expensive framed art that I also don't know how I am going to get our of my place. WH asked IM if I could just "hold" it for him and if not, if IM (who happens to be my dad) could hold for him. No way right? Just a way to hang on to a reason for him to contact me.

Those who have divorced- I have a lawyer but is it recommended to mediate (with lawyer) to save $$? Going to court is MUCH more expensive right? He did text me once saying "I've been served, can we please get a mediator?" I ignored the text. I really want to get a forensic accountant to go through everything as I believe he's spent a large amount of money (that should have been for us/our kids) on these OW. Wondering if that could be done through mediation... Have a call in to my lawyer but thought I'd ask your experiences.


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SFL, I would just hang onto his property for now. As for his texts, I would shut down that avenue so he can't contact you again.



"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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I would hold on to his stuff, SFL. I held onto my stbx's things during the entire D process...they are marital assets even though they were "his" belongings they have value. If the expensive framed art is worth $X, you will want an equivalent in property or cash so just hold onto the stuff. If you don't want it around the house, stick it in a closet, garage or storage unit.

I never went to mediation and most people I know who did still spent a pretty penny and/or it fell apart so they went to trial anyway. I had an attorney. My ex did not. I had my attorney draw up what I wanted in the decree. When it was done, I emailed it to my then stbx. If he had issue with anything, he noted it. Some things were not a big deal for me to change or remove but other things were dealbreakers and I told him I would not change it...if he didn't like it he could consult an attorney and we could go to trail (where all his dirty laundry would be aired *cough*). After minor tweeking, he signed the decree. We never went to trial or had a single hearing. I am not a fan of mediation from the sounds of it.

You can try to minimize the lawyer fees. I will be back in a bit to post about that.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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SFL ending contact means changing your number and email, blocking social media and asking people not to pass on third party messages - aside from your IM who will have read the training thread on what to say.

You still have a long haul of healing to do and ignoring his texts still takes a toll. Having him blow up your phone when things get dicey, his A isn't perfect fantasy land or he doesn't like what his lawyer is saying about finances is not healing. Have you read the how to Plan B correctly thread? I know you are going Plan D, I did too, but Plan B is still needed for your healing and self interests.

As for mediation it is a good idea on paper, I find. The lawyers say: "What would be best is if the two of you are logical and reasonable and split things without a fight".

Which is perfectly true as far as that goes, but it doesn't seem to occur to anybody that you wouldn't be getting divorced if you were dealing with a reasonable and logical person who isn't all-out selfish.

Waywards in particular seem to use the mediation process for a last shot at contact and time-wasting. Then they go after as much money as they can possibly get their hands on once they realise how much two households cost, that OW needs shoe money and the BS isn't going to work like two donkeys to support herself.

So I'd tell your lawyer to expect unreasonable and grapsing behaviour from the get-go.I offered mediation, but it was purely to look good later on in court and I would have done it in separate rooms.




Last edited by indiegirl; 06/03/14 01:22 AM.

What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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A forensic accountant will probably cost you a pretty penny so if you concerned about spending money on attorney fees, this will zap you too so pick your poison. Your WH will be required to turn over all financials. You can look at the financial stuff yourself...don't be intimidated by it. Since WH is so keen on saving money, you can ask him to fork over the financials and point out that he will be ordered to do so during Discovery if he refuses. WH's credit report can be ran to see what accounts he has that you may be unaware of.

If your attorney fee structure is like most, you will be billed in increments of time...usually 15 min blocks. Don't piecemeal questions to your attorney. Write down your questions and when you have enough to fill in close to 15 mins worth of convo then call him to ask your questions. Make notation on the lengths of your phone calls and content so you can make sure you don't get overbilled. You can dispute any overbilling. If you get charged for photocopies, tell your attorney to just email you electronic copies. Attorneys charge by the page and it can add up if they are just throwing printed paper your way for every little thing. An electronic copy is free and you can print it if you need too.

During my divorce, I was not in Plan B nor had an IM. Even if you are, your IM can send stuff back and forth on your behalf. You will have to discuss these things one way or another. I chose to discuss as much as possible without my attorney. My assets were complicated and I didn't want to spend more than I had to on attorney fees...they were already going to suck.





BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Since you rent, you don't have a house to consider...which is a good thing. If either of you have retirement accounts like IRAs or 401ks those are subject to division. Your attorney should have given you some asset/debt/income worksheets. If your assets are not complicated, the division of property should be pretty simple.

Look at the standard child visitation order. I took my state's standard order and tweeked a few things here and there to fit what I needed. Any moral clauses were also added. I have a clause that my OWs can never be around my children in any way. That clause was a deal breaker for me. I would have gone to trial if my ex disagreed with it. Write down the things you want in your decree. You don't need to have upteen conversations with your attorney to figure these things out...what do you want? (but you also need to be reasonable). Once you have a preliminary list you can then discuss the issues with the attorney.

The process can be overwhelming but it is also pretty black and white too.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Thank you so much everyone- should I start a new thread in the divorced/divorcing section?
My WH has taken it upon himself to say he's going to just deposit half his check into our account from here on our. This is not ok and not enough to pay for our rent and all bills, etc. I know I will have to make adjustments when we settle but to start that TODAY, when he lives on the companies dime in the other state and crashes at a friends when he's here on the weekends is not fair.
Can he do this?
Also- how do we do a full on Plan B if we get joint legal custody and have to agree on schooling decisions etc? Thank you!


BS
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Originally Posted by SFL
Thank you so much everyone- should I start a new thread in the divorced/divorcing section?
My WH has taken it upon himself to say he's going to just deposit half his check into our account from here on our. This is not ok and not enough to pay for our rent and all bills, etc. I know I will have to make adjustments when we settle but to start that TODAY, when he lives on the companies dime in the other state and crashes at a friends when he's here on the weekends is not fair.
Can he do this?
Also- how do we do a full on Plan B if we get joint legal custody and have to agree on schooling decisions etc? Thank you!

SFl, I would have your lawyer file an emergency order for support.

And you don't need to agree on any schooling decisions with him. Since your child lives with you, you would enroll your child in the local school. Any PERTINENT information about the child would be passed through the IM.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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you may also be able to visit your local welfare department and they can help you with food stamps, medical insurance, child support, etc.

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Has your attorney requested temporary child and spousal support? He should have...this would include things like medical/dental insurance too. Until a Support Order is issued, WH may do all sorts of stupid stuff. Request an Order ASAP. This is also why posters advised you to transfer some funds into your own account. It's also another reason not to give him any more of his stuff.

Originally Posted by SFL
Also- how do we do a full on Plan B if we get joint legal custody and have to agree on schooling decisions etc? Thank you!

You don't have to agree to share all decisions. My ex and I share joint custody but I have a lot of exclusive rights...which I asked for...decisions about education is one of them. I will post them in the Divorce Forum some time tomorrow.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
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Originally Posted by SFL
Also- how do we do a full on Plan B if we get joint legal custody and have to agree on schooling decisions etc? Thank you!


What do you mean by joint legal custody? He works out of state, lives with OW during the week and crashes at friends pads when in town.

SFL, you are the rock and the only sane person that your kids have. Go for full custody and take away as much of the decision making as you can.

Active waywards will always make decisions based ON THEIR OWN BEST INTERESTS... not the kids. Isn't that what he is doing now? They are terrible parents and horrible role models.

Last edited by pokerface; 06/04/14 10:55 AM.

ME: BW
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DDay 09/2008 and 12/2008

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Originally Posted by pokerface
Originally Posted by SFL
Also- how do we do a full on Plan B if we get joint legal custody and have to agree on schooling decisions etc? Thank you!


What do you mean by joint legal custody? He works out of state, lives with OW during the week and crashes at friends pads when in town.

SFL, you are the rock and the only sane person that your kids have. Go for full custody and take away as much of the decision making as you can.

Active waywards will always make decisions based ON THEIR OWN BEST INTERESTS... not the kids. Isn't that what he is doing now? They are terrible parents and horrible role models.

I agree- though currently, in CA fighting for full, sole custody is expensive and usually just happens if the parent is on drugs, abusive, etc. I think his main desire for this is "control." He wants me to need to consult with him regarding educational decisions, etc. The physical custody is not going to happen but the joint legal custody probably will. Silly because I did EVERYTHING (and he trusted and encouraged this) when it came to finding the best classes (extra curricular), preschools, schools, etc. But now, all of a sudden he wants to have a say.... I will talk to my lawyer about this for sure.


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Originally Posted by SFL
I agree- though currently, in CA fighting for full, sole custody is expensive and usually just happens if the parent is on drugs, abusive, etc. I think his main desire for this is "control." He wants me to need to consult with him regarding educational decisions, etc. The physical custody is not going to happen but the joint legal custody probably will. Silly because I did EVERYTHING (and he trusted and encouraged this) when it came to finding the best classes (extra curricular), preschools, schools, etc. But now, all of a sudden he wants to have a say.... I will talk to my lawyer about this for sure.

Be sure and explain to your lawyer that you will be in Plan B, so any communication will have to be handled via an IM. That will take away your H's ability to control you. He will do everything to FORCE you to interact with him directly and will drive you crazy unless you are prepared to defend your Plan B.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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And keep in mind that the goal of an attorney is to get you divorced in the easiest, most "amicable" manner possible. His concern is not your mental health or well being so it will be up to you to make sure he protects your plan b.

You might want to read up on Parallel parenting so you are prepared to defend Plan B. http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2566139#Post2566139


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Not going to make a thread in the D forum but here ya go. This is standard (probably in all states) and what my decree orders:

"IT IS ORDERED that, during his periods of possession, WAYWARD HUSBAND, as parent joint managing conservator, shall have the following rights and duties:
1. the duty of care, control, protection, and reasonable discipline of the children;
2. the duty to support the children, including providing the children with clothing, food, shelter, and medical and dental care not involving an invasive procedure;
3. the right to consent for the children to medical and dental care not involving an invasive procedure."

I have the same three duties/right above.

"IT IS ORDERED that WIFE, as a parent joint managing conservator, shall have the following rights and duty:
1. the exclusive right to designate the primary residence of the children within XYZ County and contiguous counties;
2. the right, subject to the agreement of the other parent conservator, to consent to medical, dental, and surgical treatment involving invasive procedures;
3. the right, subject to the agreement of the other parent conservator, to consent to psychiatric and psychological treatment of the children;
4. the independent right to receive and give receipt for periodic payments for the support of the children and to hold or disburse these funds for the benefit of the children;
5. the exclusive right to represent the children in legal action and to make other decisions of substantial legal significance concerning the children;
6. the exclusive right to consent to marriage and to enlistment in the armed forces of the United States;
7. the exclusive right to make decisions concerning the children's education;
8. except as provided by section xxx of the Family Code, the exclusive right to the services and earnings of the children;
9. except when a guardian of the children's estates or a guardian or attorney ad litem has been appointed for the children, the exclusive right to act as an agent of the children in relation to the children's estates if the children's action is required by a state, the United States, or a foreign government;
10. the exclusive duty to manage the estates of the children to the extent the estates have been created by community property or the joint property of the parent; and
11. the exclusive right to direct the moral and religious training of the children."

#1, 7 and 11 were really the only ones I wanted as exclusive rights but I got the others as well...#4 is just saying he owes me child support so that was going to be in there. The geographic restriction of #1 is also lifted if my ex lives outside of my state...which he does.

My ex has the duties of #2 and #3 and this is #1
1. the duty to make periodic payments for the support and benefit of the children;

That's it.

I don't know how your attorney formats his decrees, but I still was given exclusive rights even though we share joint custody. Your lawyer should be able to design a parenting plan that will fit your situation...vs a cookie cutter version. He should be able to add specific language that gets you what you want even if you don't get sole legal custody. You may even write the language yourself vs trying to explain it to him and tell him to add it...that is what I did throughout portions of my decree.

Are you not planning to send your children to public school? Something like pre-k and daycare should be a non-issue...it would be hard for WH to argue why he wants daycare A over daycare B...unless it is a matter of cost which he will be expected to bare. But language can be added to address limits, exceptions, etc.



BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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