this is just too depressing...

Depressing, but a cold hard possible reality.

My Wayward Wife has now gone exactly 499 days since she has seen or even spoken to our 11 year old son.

She is living with Affair Partner #4 or #5 and has been for the past 1 3/4 years.

Her apartment is only 9.4 miles from our home.

There is absolutely No Excuse. It must be who she became since she had her 1st Affair and also relapsed after 10 years of sobriety in AA.

You can not expect a Wayward to be the once responsible and loving spouse or parent that they were prior to their affair(s).

So sorry for what you've been through, LearnedTooLate. i just don't know how to raise a 4 yr old and 8 months old all by myself while working full time. maybe i should stay at home and take care of my son until he's older.

Do not leave your children if you go to CA. You will likely be wasting your time and money...only to return to HI and WH will refuse to let you take the kids. After all the crap he has put YOUR DAUGHTER through (cold, heartless, and manipulative) I would NOT leave her with him for even a few days much less weeks. That sounds crazy to me.

as suggested by one of our counselor, we'll have an agreement that i go to CA just to set up things and will return soon, not abandoning my children, and get the agreement notarized.

but bringing my 4 yr old DD with me, would make the apt hunting, purchasing necessary furniture, and setting up home quite impossible.

i don't know, maybe i got too caught up in the middle of things. is my WH that bad now? "cold, heartless, and manipulative". it's a shock actually to see these words.

Don't listen to the counselor.

Do not leave your DD even to set things up.

We at MB would rather you stay in HI than leave your child for even a long weekend.

Only go to CA if you take the children and have someone reliable and respectable there agreeing to care for them while you hunt for a job and home.

Really? I know not to trust WH, but he agreed to let me take the kids to CA. if he changed mind, he could just file for D at HI right away. Then I would have to stay, and fight for the custody.

He agreed to let you take them to CA
but
if you leave for CA without the children
you risk
him filing and making you go back to HI or him becoming custodial parent (his mom IS their child care provider after all).

The counselor isnt an attorney.
I would not do anything without first consulting a family law attorney.

You could probably qualify for state aid and work part time.
You may need to do that untl the child is older.

xpbrain,

The reason you are feeling so lost and depressed is because of the contact with your WH. It is an unhealthy environment to be in contact with him.

Why are you shocked? Those are the words YOU have used, xp. On May 30th you wrote:

"WH was so cruel and cold, even DD was crying and begging for him to stay, he chose to leave. later on, DD told me WH told her he didn't break up the family. this is just hopeless..."

and you have said such things before. If you don't even remember what YOU said, don't you think that is a problem and says a lot about what you are subjecting yourself to?

x2

A notarized agreement like that likely means as much as the paper it is written on...nada.

Thank you all for the support and guidance. Sometimes I thought WH is still the old loving and caring husband i had before. it's difficult to accept who he is now, since DDay his actions surprised me all the time. Actually i was quite confident that WH would be remorseful and begging for a second chance before i confronted him on DDay.

Anyway, the moving decision might not be well thought-out. I called Steve Harley yesterday morning. His direction is try to make WH to call him. He gave me some ideas on how to do it, and told me to take it as a project. Based on WH's current reaction, which is he wanted to have minimal interaction with me, I'm not sure if he would be interested. But Steve did ask me to keep trying. I didn't do it yesterday, since I was reluctant.

i'm at the end of the rope. this is the last chance of my M.

Does Steve know you're in Plan B?

Yeah, I told him the timeline of the whole thing.

if WH is still in love with OW, although MAYBE no active contact for a couple of months (no way to verify NC, no EP in place), doesn't it mean the A is still alive?

had conversation with WH, and he said he couldn't live with me right now. he chose to live in his office, or find a apt, although he can barely afford another apt. at the end of the conversation, i mentioned he could give Steve Harley a call. He said sure, actually he meant he wanted to tell Steve how much he hated the program. Anyway, i will set up the appointment next week.

Some updates. Hope to get your insights, dear MBers. Thanks so much.

WH talked to Steve on Tue. I called him to ask how it was going. He was very reluctant to talk to me, basically he's like trying to Plan B ME! Anyway, he told me he talked to Steve calmly for about an hour, and asked me to talk to Steve to know more detail.

I had another session with Steve on THU. Steve told me WH believed I wouldn't change (I very much wanted to ask WH, actually I did ask, that if he believed grownups can't change their characters and behaviors, does that idea only apply to me, or apply to him also, (that once a cheater always a cheater? i didn't say this part to him). He decided that he would be better off living by himself. WH also told Steve he's very disappointed of the end of his relationship with OW. He's willing to explore the MB idea Steve presented, and do some research (well, I doubt if he would do it).

Steve asked me to continue to live with MIL, and avoid love busters, mainly angry outburst, and DJs, and demonstrate my ability to change to MIL, since WH is plan Bing me. I also need to fill out love buster questionnaire and have WH's perspective on it.

After going through this for almost a year from Dday, I feel avoiding LBs is so difficult, esp. that I have so much resentment toward WH. But I d/l kindle version of love buster book to read anyway. But i'm gonna take it slow, because I really don't want to talk to him while he's acting like he's the victim and hates so much to talk to me.

Another thing is, previously before talking to Steve, I wanted MIL to live with WH and I'll take care of kids by myself. We just discussed some options last Friday, and WH's like can't wait to find an apt for them and already got one now. He told DD he would have her overnight if she wants and if I agrees last night, but during the day, I confirmed through email to him that we will keep the living arrangements status quo, which is no overnight with him at all. Of coz when I told DD she's not going to live with Daddy in his apt, she got very upset / mad and almost cried. I really hate that he tried to bond with DD and say things to confuse her. Then I wrote an email to him, ask him to stop confusing kids. I found my emails always try to educate him in a certain way, I had to proof read every time to delete those lines I might regret to send him. I'm not sure if it's a love buster.

Also financial wise, renting another apt will cause more burden to our current situation. I'm tempted to write him an email to tell him this apt rental should not be spent with joint marital asset, and it should be part of the cost he wasted for his choosing independent single life. I guess it might be a love buster? how do i bring it up without being disrespectful?

I really need some help to follow through Steve's plan here. Obviously my instincts/emotions are getting in the way. Now when I need to do sth for this M, I started to hate it, and resent WH. But when I actually have to move away, I'll chicken away. in dilemma.

Thank you so much for all the support and help.

Steve also pointed I need to apologize for my angry outburst and disrespectful behavior toward MIL. I apologized in the email I wrote to WH yesterday and asked him to convey the apology. I know I might need to say it to her face to face, but I just can't right now. It's just difficult as she's the no.1 supporter to WH, no matter what he does.