Interestingly, I had that book mentioned to me in divorce mediation! My wife said I was trying to control her and verbally abuse her by insisting she end her affair and if not, that the children were to have no contact with her affair partner!

It's worth noting that what that author considers "abuse" is a different definition of abuse than what Dr. Harley uses.
I would instead read Love Busters, as it might help you more and it does tie into MB methods.

I have been trying to keep my mouth shut since first reading this post, and I'm not claiming to be any sort of expert, and I haven't read the books by Dr H - just the articles and letters on this site. And I'm probably going to get shot down for saying this, BUT

It is not OK for anyone to dictate to you about how you look and how you should treat your body - not anyone! And certainly it's not OK for him to treat you differently depending on whether or not you are losing weight! This man made a commitment to you knowing how you looked and if he did so knowing that he couldn't fulfill his promise to you to love you that way you are then it is his problem and his hangup! To make you continually feel like you are not good enough because you don't live up to his expectations of what you should look like is not OK. Ask yourself if you are happy trying to be someone you will never be able to be, and having to continually strive for that perfect 20 year old body which you will never have, and to be made to feel like his love for you, and your whole marriage, is based on if you can ever achieve his idea of this perfect woman. If you are happy with it then carry on - if not, go find someone who thinks you are the most beautiful, sexiest woman in the whole world, and appreciates you for exactly who you are.

Seems to me another option would be to get him some electric shock aversion therapy to get rid of his obsession with athletic redheads and see if he would be ok with this! Yes it would be torture for him, but that's exactly what he is doing to you.

Okie, I forgot, we had one couple in a similar situation. The poster was canwemakeit and then changed her posting name to cwmi. Her H didn't get on board until she was ready to leave. She did a long and strong plan A, like you have, making a full out effort to meet the needs he expressed. Then when she told him she was leaving, he agreed to meet with Steve for coaching. He got then on a plan like you guys with the UA and explainedto her H that the one who wants something more is the one to large the effort. In their case it was over the top cleaning and once he had the chores they shrank back onto perspective. For your H maybe he needs to take over the cooking and such, along with the UA will hopefully get him back to something sustainable too. And brainstorm with abandon, don't commit to things until you are enthusiastic. Someone needs to protect your marriage here, don't just follow him off a cliff until you hate him!

msmcbeth, you made me laugh when you mentioned electric shock therapy. NewEveryDay, it just may take me threatening to leave. I will start with this plan A and take it from there. Although, I do love the idea of him cooking!

Two days ago, my husband rated my physical attractiveness on Dr. H's scale as a negative 1. This morning, I asked my husband why he said things like, "You're beautiful and you're so sexy" at times (particularly during sex) as it is confusing when paired with his other statements about needing me to change my appearance. I thought perhaps when he was relaxed, he thought of me differently than when he was stressed or anxious. I thought "we can work with this. He is constantly stressed/ anxious. I just need to help him relax and then he'll find me attractive enough." I didn't say that to him, I just waited for his answer. Well, unfortunately, he said that he says those things because he thinks of a part of me that is beautiful/ sexy and then he can honestly say that. So...it's like a kid who says he didn't eat the candy bar because he only ate half the candy bar. So, when he says I'm beautiful, apparently he is only talking about my skin, my face, etc. He made it clear that he wasn't talking about my waist down. Fabulous...

Jedi_Knight, thank you for the suggestion of Love Busters. I'll look into it.

Oh bless your heart Okie. I cannot imagine being married to someone who goes about getting their needs meant in such a thoughtless way. His refusal to reach out for help from Dr. Harley and find ways to make you BOTH happy says a lot...not to mention how he turned it around to make you the bad guy with his comment about poisoning the well.



Does he say these things in front of the kids? Is this environment healthier for the kids than divorce?


Just "threatening" to leave does not work. He needs to see that you are serious and will carry through if he cannot get on board with MB.

You are going to have a nervous breakdown trying to live up to something that is impossible for anyone to live up to.

Okiegal,

Since he is unwilling to get help by either seeing a psychologist (as Dr. H recommended) or talk with Dr. H himself. What do you plan to do?

What about asking him to write Dr. Harley himself to "give his side"? Maybe an email corresponding with Dr. Harley himself might help?

I have let assumptions be made about my husband. Please imagine a pretty healthy marriage with dates, vacations, healthy happy kids who are homeschooled and doing great, and a husband who wants to spend his free time with his wife. He provides financially for her, spends quality time with the family, admires his wife's personality and basically everything she does, and unless speaking directly about her body, gives plenty of compliments. He is even very giving in the bedroom. Now, imagine that there is just one glaring problem. The one I have mentioned. It really is a problem because he's convinced he can't be happy without me changing and I don't feel loved, but please understand I am not talking about an evil man who goes around wanting to hurt me or speaks about me rudely. And no, he does not mention this topic in front of the children.
He will not speak with or write to Dr. Harley. I have told him that I will continue to work towards his goals for me, but that I at least need him to try some recreational activities with me that we both enjoy. I guess I'm still hopeful there will be some miracle in our situation. I'm not willing to give up. We really do have a nice marriage together other than this. Although he originally told me he had thoughts of leaving, he says he will never leave now. He's just scared that he isn't attracted to me. Yes, I'm hurt with this ongoing knowledge, but at least I know God loves me unconditionally and I can continue to pray for wisdom in our situation.

OkieGal;

Okay, but what if, by discussing the situation with Dr. Harley, he could find a way to resolve it?

What if THIS is the miracle?

What if THIS is the thing that worked?

Why would your husband (and you) want to settle for a 99% great marriage? What if 100% is available to you both?

Honestly, this thread is a bit haunting for me, and leaves me rather confused. I have a number of things I can relate to from the husband's perspective, but want to ensure I don't go about it in ways that would harm my future spouse, as he is. I'm currently dating a girl name BETH who is wonderfully conversational, admiring, affectionate, open/honest, loves Christ, and is very pretty as well.

Physical Attraction is a top emotional need for me, but I worry that my combination of perfectionism and previous years of pornography addiction (now ended and under control) have wired my brain to unreasonable expectations of beauty.

When I wrote Dr.Harley about this, he addressed it on the radio show by saying, "First, don't marry anyone you haven't been with for at least two years, and the person that you want to marry has to be somebody that you protect from your critical nature. In other words, you're aware of the fact that you can become very critical: there can be a minor flaw, and you can treat it as though it were something major. In other words, don't get married if the person you're going to marry is going to be subjected to your critical nature. You've got to make sure that you have a wall of protection for that woman, and that you may be thinking critical thoughts but you're never going to say them. And that, to me, may help."

So although I don't find BETH's physical appearance to be incredible (I have yet to meet a girl that I have felt that way about, sadly), I have been focusing on complimenting her on the things I truly do find beautiful about her. "You have amazing eyes. I love your smile. I like that shirt on you. You look great in those shorts. Your hair looks wonderful today. etc" and I definitely become wildly attracted to her when, as Okiegal described, I'm relaxed and kissing her. Suddenly everything about her starts to glow with attraction.

But it sounds as though Okiegal would say I'm 'like a kid who says he didn't eat the candy bar because he only ate half the candy bar' and finds it offensive. I really do want to get married, but want to make sure I'm protecting BETH from my critical nature, but it is sad that I can't be fully open and honest with her. It breaks my heart that I may be wired for a dissatisfactory marriage because of my own nature, and I would like to overcome it in whatever way possible. So a thread like this frightens me of myself.

Satuha, seeing flaws in another person is human nature. There isn't a woman on the planet who is completely perfect in every way. It sounds like you, like my husband, notice every detail and therefore every flaw. However, the difference seems to be that you would be willing to get the help needed to relax and let flaws be flaws and learn how to overlook them and enjoy your wife. But, yes, she really does need to think that she is absolutely beautiful to you. Without that, she won't have the confidence she needs to feel secure in her relationship with you. If the "flaws" you notice in her are an easy fix, like wearing more makeup every now and then or styling her hair slightly differently, then I bet she'd be willing to try that out. But, if like my husband, you are wanting a picture perfect woman with no fat on her body and some exact color of hair, understanding you need help instead of telling her to try to look like that would certainly be the better choice.

Dr. Harley helped Satuha come to that understanding.

I really wish there was a way he would correspond with Dr. Harley.

What about signing up for the online program?

catwhit, I hear what you are saying and would love for that to be an option. Unfortunately, I'm looking at only two options at the moment since my husband is absolutely against getting help. I can either try the suggestions about recreational companionship or divorce him. I was just saying that I'm not willing to go to divorce yet.

Ok what about filling out the RC inventory? Will he do that?

What do you do during UA time?

Yes, I had mentioned earlier in the thread that he not only filled out the RC inventory, but also filled out the emotional needs questionnaire. He is on board with trying out new recreational activities with me that we both enjoy. We are going to start there.

Fantastic. I would sit down on Sunday afternoon and schedule each week.

Do you have any ideas for your UA?

I'm sorry, I'm still learning. Do recreational activities we do together count as UA? If so, I made a list of the ones we scored highest on and plan on sitting down with him this weekend and deciding which ones to try. I'm actually looking forward to it...and I think he is too. Bicycling was rated up there, so was playing tennis, along with a lot of other things. So, I'll have to get back with you

That's fantastic and yes recreational activities done together count as UA as long as it's done together and meeting one of the intimate emotional needs, IC, SF, affection and RC. So you'll be meeting RC.

Here read this and listen to the clips. The Critical Importance of Undivided Attention

Just a quick update. My husband and I picked an activity from our list that we both rated pretty high, tennis, and played a little Saturday evening. We hadn't done that since we were dating as he had ruined it by taking the fun out and replacing it with instructions and aggravation that I didn't learn faster. Well, apparently 16 years of personal growth and a pep talk from me about keeping things light and fun was a recipe for complete success! We had so much fun and then grabbed some dinner afterwards. I think he forgot my flaws and I forgot he saw them. We have been holding hands off and on all day today and I actually felt relaxed and not judged in the bedroom. I know things aren't suddenly all better, but it has been a wonderful weekend. Some of this could be happiness on his part b/c he knows I've taken up jogging in my free time to try to look better, but his smiles while playing tennis with me were genuine and it feels good to have him look at me the way he has been all weekend.

Okiegal - so glad things seem to be working out

I actually haven't been able to stop thinking about your situation and it came to me yesterday morning! How about you take up pole dancing if there is a studio in your area? Apparently it is great exercise and will tone you up, you can have fun doing it, but most importantly it is all about being sexy and making you feel sexy. So even then if you don't get the affirmation you need from your husband, you can still feel sexy and desirable And maybe put up a pole in your house to give him and few private shows and drive him wild