IF, and that is as BIG "IF", you decide to reconcile your marriage, your Husband and You will have to be all in with that quoted previous advice.

It can not wait 2 years for the work bonus.

What do YOU want to do?

Can you see if your H is interested in the MB style of a caring, safe and compassionate marriage?

LTL

Actually, you and your husband were not very nice people. Adulterers suck. They care about no one but themselves. After all, if you had not been having an affair wiht this womans husband, the marriage might have had a chance.

And I am sorry you chose to have children with a serial cheater, but you did this knowingly and willingly so you volunteered for it. You are not a victim, but a volunteer.

You should have stayed away from a married man. That is just simple basic common sense. At least accept the consequences of your choices. He cheated on his wife, so obviously he is going to cheat on you too.

His new OW can say the very things you are saying: your marriage is over, you are evil, she didn't split up your marriage, blah, blah, blah.

I am sorry you chose a MARRIED serial cheater to be your baby daddy.

If you drive faster than the speed limit, but you need to get somewhere so you just don't see it as speeding, guess what? You'll still get a ticket! And whether you see it that way or not, you were the OW and now you are reaping the rewards of that.

An affair is *having a relationship* with a married man. It does not need to split up the marriage in order to constitute an affair, that is ridiculous.

You are right it WAS all totally in your control. What you should have done is 1) not get involved with a married man, or at the least 2) UNinvolved yourself with said married man. Instead you waited in the wings for over a decade, until he threw you a crumb by means of a quick wedding, all the while he ALREADY had another OW on the sidelines.

Yes! You should have left him. You chose to have 2 children with him, without being married, while he was still married to someone else. You CHOSE to be a single mother, with a married man as the father of your children.

You resent the implication because it is true! You made very selfish choices, choices the put another woman, another set of children, and your own children in a very disastrous situation. You chose to bring children into this mess! And yes, being born into a situation where there are families torn apart and adultery abounds is VERY damaging to children.

You have not done the best you can, or you would have made choices that would not put your children at such a disadvantage. This is not something that happened *to* you it is something that you yourself created after all.

Its all over now. I've caught him again. Please stop giving me hell about the last relationship. Its his fault, catching me when I was vulnerable. He fed me so much [censored].

Goose, it is not all his fault. HIS choices are his fault, but yours belong to you.

Despite the fact that you yourself are an OW, I am sorry you are going through this. I know how painful it is. You can find some personal peace here, but you yourself need to change how YOU see relationships first. Are you willing to do that?

We are not giving you hell; just pointing out that you knew he was a cheater going into this. You signed up for this. It is your fault for marrying a cheater. He is probably telling his new OW the very things that he told you.

His new OW might be vulnerable too. Is that ok?

This is quite an obscene statement to make.

Most BWs endure a lot of suffering. This one far more than most of us because he put her through it so many times.

The worst part is when the girlfriend is still pretending to be just a friend. Usually vulnerable (mine was a widow) she laps up attention and the old 'my wife doesnt understand me' line.

When there is no sex yet but you are forced to watch the foreplay. When she is closer to him than you are. When she puts her nose in where it's not wanted - your marriage. When she tries to 'patch up' something which is quite frankly none of her business.

Most of us have had frankly insulting advice from OW before they invade the marriage. If we were less dignified we would tell her the problem is his women friends and their gullibility.

Now you know too. Cheaters can reform and I suggest you try by feeling shame for rubbing this woman's nose in your blossoming affair with her husband.

This is not the 'last' relationship, it is your current affair age! This is the reason you came here seeking help, yet you now do not want advice on where it all went wrong?

Dear Goosegoose,

It is sad that the loving man you thought you knew was only a mirage.
Modern society tells us to "follow our hearts" and that you can declare yourself separated to be free to live like a bachelor.
Sadly, you have fallen for the lies of a predatory man. Although you cannot call yourself totally innocent, it is obvious from his behaviour, that he is very good at luring women into relationships without telling them about his real agenda.
I'm certain he never gave you the impression that you were "the other woman".

In hindsight, I am sure you wish you would have done things differently. Please read the materials on this site, because they can be of guidance for future relationships. Dating men who are still married should be off limits. Not because we want to be boring people who like strict rules, but because these rules protect us if our feelings steer us in the wrong direction. Following this rule would have avoided your current heartbreak.

You can still follow the rules laid out in "surviving an affair", as they are in your best interest and in the best interest of the children.

I wish you well and hope you will find wisdom in the materials on this site, so that future relationships will turn out better.

God bless,

Happyheart

My intention is never to attack anyone here but the OW in my situation was fully aware of the fact that the man she was dealing with was married.

It first started with my husband (they met online) lying to her that he was divorced and that his "ex" wife (me) had moved back to her home country (we live in US) with his DD which OW believed.

But then after I found out that they had married in her country I called her (she had her contact info online) and told her that:

1. He and I are still legally married here in US and live together.
2. We have no intention of getting a divorce.
3. You are dealing with a married man and that's wrong. Turn around now and never contact him.

OW got pissed, didn't give up on him and they continued. She even concocted 2 fake nasty emails which she forwarded to my husband saying him that I had sent them to her. Of course fogged out WH believed it.

Then he made a plan to fly to her country to see her. I begged him to not go and told him that I would have to leave if he did choose to go because staying would mean allowing him to do me more abuse.

He did go and my daughter and I left.

But after I left he only went to see her once. And even though it did result in an OC, which he hid from us until a week ago, now my husband is there wrapping things up with her.

Again, I won't really know what is happening there right now until he comes back next week and shows me and DD the evidence of the termination of their relationship, I don't trust his words and without the proper documentations there will not be any "talk" or meeting with him.

What I wanted to say here is that anything that starts with lies and deceit won't last. I provided the OW with the true info and she ignored it. Not only that she tried to frame me and blamed me for something I had not even thought of doing. Now she will end up with a child and a man who, in a best case scenario, might only come around once every year or two. I guess she deserves it. She asked for it.

taka, so sorry to hear this tragic story. Unfortunately, your husband is there engaging in his affair. That is the only reason he is there. Someone who is serious about ending his affair, ends it. He is lying to you about ending it. Going to "get closure" or "end the affair" is a clever ruse to get the betrayed spouse to go along with his continued affair. I assure you he is there sleeping with her and carrying on his affair.

A WS who is serious about ending his affair doesn't go see his affair partner, he ends the affair. That can be done with a curt letter.

Dr. Harley would tell you to separate and go into Plan B. Your husbands continued affair will make you sick. And hanging around allowing him to abuse you like this only makes you look extremely unattractive to him.

He would also tell you to expose the affair wide and far. Everyone should know the despicable thing your husband is doing.

He should have never seen or spoke to her again, taka. That is the only way to recover. I would demand that he never see or speak that hoe again and that he adhere to extraordinary precautions if he wants to stay with you. Otherwise you should separate from him.

It also sounds like one of the problems in your marriage was a traveling job where you spend the nights apart. As you can see, that has been a disaster for your marriage and unless that changes, you can look forward to a life of hell.

Melody, thank you for your kind words and wisdom.

I know that he should not be there at all. Yes, he most likely is lying to me and that's nothing new lol.

We are already separated and all that has to be done is get the divorce.

The traveling is of course the big issue here but the bigger and the biggest problem is that he doesn't want to POJA. If he had been willing to POJA, he would have not gone or done anything that I was not comfortable with.

Like you say, any serious WS who wants to reconcile would agree to POJA and a complete list of EPs.

If he says he will NC the OW and OC then I may listen to what he has to say but if he still doesn't want to commit to EPs, I will divorce him and plan B him forever.

Also Melody, I exposed it years ago to people that mattered. His mom (with whom I had a very close relationship. She passed early last year), all his sisters knew.

His sisters "liked" the OC pic on the OW's FB page (they are all FB pals)and commented on it. They sent OC gift and stuff, to them, it's just blood is way thicker than water.

WS is the only boy, have 3 older sisters who, together with their mother, spoiled him rotten and they had a family culture in which it was completely OK to lie for peace keeping. Also when he wanted something, there was always someone in the family who would give it to him when he wanted it. If his mom said no, then he would go to his sisters and one of them would do it for him. That way he probably learned to have his needs met by many different people and is completely ok with it.

I grew up in a very different environment. If my brother did something like this, I would not speak to him and would want nothing to do with him until he corrects his actions and do what's right.

They seem to believe in "unconditional love". Excuse me, they enable each other and think they love each other unconditionally. And I know in marriage unconditional love is very destructive.

Anyway, none of the above will no longer matter to me if he decides against NC with OW and OC. Even if he agrees to NC, it will be a very difficult road for me because of the above reasons. I am not confident. Thank you so very much for listening.

taka, rather than sitting around waiting while he continues his affair, I would send him a Plan B letter and shut that door. Waiting around for him to possibly choose you is horrendous to your mental health and only makes you look less attractive. He has chosen the OW and that is evidenced by the fact that he is WITH HER.

Please take back your life and shut that door. He is not serious and as such, is not a safe person for you. He is just jacking you around so he can keep you on the sidelines as an option. His sincerity is demonstrated by his ACTIONS. He is with his mistress.

Thank you Melody. I agree. I will plan B him.