|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
I get all of the above though I never considered church an unsafe place! I considered it a safe place, as compared to bars or meet-up groups, etc.
The only way for me to make deposits is to eliminate LBs first.
There is no way for me to make deposits these days. Have you let her know that you will no longer engage in any behavior she is not ENTHUSIASTIC about? I don't know if that will make a deposit, but I think it will at least make her glad. What things are you giving up that she has complained about?
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
I seemed to get off into Independent Behavior, when that's not even the biggest concern right now. The biggest concern is learning how to interact with her without being disrespectful. I think both of these love busters are at serious crisis level and will spell the end of your marriage if you do not stop them. Are you familiar with the Love Busters worksheet procedure for disrespectful judgments? Will your wife follow it with you?
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
She also dropped out of the bible study group we�d been in for years and I kept on going to it. If your bible study group teaches people to attend church and bible study even when their spouse is unenthusiastic, I would say your wife was right to drop out! Maybe you can find a marriage-affirming church or Bible study. BTW, I'm a big advocate of worshiping at home as a family when no other options are suitable - IF husband and wife are both enthusiastic, of course. We bake our own unleavened bread for communion, sing hymns, read the Scripture, and pray. It is very moving and valuable for us. You might find out how your wife would feel about doing something similar. Another thing I also did was, a few years ago, I started playing softball with my two adult daughters who have a similar passion for softball. (I had the similar privilege of playing softball with my father and brother many years ago when we were all adults. Both of those experiences are very high on my list of joys in life.) Incomparable to the joy of bringing your marriage back from the brink and having a romantic relationship with your wife, though. It turns out ANY recreational activity will do if both people are enthusiastic about it. I can't imagine being enthusiastic about softball, myself - sports aren't my thing. My father and brother love football, but they can't bond with me discussing it, because I have zero interest. There are zillions of recreational activities in the world: millions will be interesting to you, and a different set of millions will be interesting to your wife. Activities that are in both of those sets will bond the two of you together. A marriage that is on life support does not need outside recreational activities. There's no time to spare for that.
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573 |
I get all of the above though I never considered church an unsafe place! I considered it a safe place, as compared to bars or meet-up groups, etc.
The only way for me to make deposits is to eliminate LBs first.
There is no way for me to make deposits these days. Have you let her know that you will no longer engage in any behavior she is not ENTHUSIASTIC about? I don't know if that will make a deposit, but I think it will at least make her glad. What things are you giving up that she has complained about? She hasn't complained about IB for years because when she did complain about my softball with my adult daughters, I replied "Don't even think of complaining about my softball with them!" And this was when I wanted us both to do the Harley program last year.
Now, I know that IB is bad, so on my own, I've stopped them.
Yes, I agree it would be a good thing for me tell her that from now on, "I won't involve myself with anything that we don't have enthusiastic POJA on", but she doesn't care. She feels POJA won't work for us because of me.
Last edited by Remark; 11/23/14 09:16 PM.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
My MB handle is Remark, and my wife�s MB handle is JustDaytoDay I can see from her thread that one of her big problems has been you engaging in activities with family members that she is not enthusiastic about. I had to come to a point where I would not engage with my family if my wife was not enthusiastic. The result was a happy marriage AND a vastly improved relationship with my family (they stopped being disrespectful to Prisca and to me).
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
I get all of the above though I never considered church an unsafe place! I considered it a safe place, as compared to bars or meet-up groups, etc.
The only way for me to make deposits is to eliminate LBs first.
There is no way for me to make deposits these days. Have you let her know that you will no longer engage in any behavior she is not ENTHUSIASTIC about? I don't know if that will make a deposit, but I think it will at least make her glad. What things are you giving up that she has complained about? She hasn't complained about IB for over a year because when she did complain about my softball with my adult daughters, I replied "Don't even think of complaining about my softball with them!"
Now, I know that IB is bad, so on my own, I've stopped them.
Yes, I agree it would be a good thing for me tell her that from now on, "I won't involve myself with anything that we don't have POJA on", but she doesn't care.
I would leave the Marriage Builders terminology out of it. I would say: "I am sorry for hurting you by playing softball with my daughters over your objections. I won't be doing that any more." "I am sorry for hurting you by seeing family members over your objections. I will not be doing that any more. From now on, you come first, till death do us part. I am ready and willing to forsake them for you."
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573 |
I can do that. That is true and a good suggestion.
Still, I see independent behavior as the secondary issue. The first being disrespect, being a jerk to her, being defensive.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
I can do that. That is true and a good suggestion.
Still, I see independent behavior as the secondary issue. The first being disrespect, being a jerk to her, being defensive I am sure you have been very disrespectful about your independent behavior. When she posted here a month or so ago she posted about your independent behavior, but she didn't use that term. She posted about allegiance - you were seeing your family over her objections. And church as well. In any case there doesn't need to be a LOT said about it - just stop it! Steve Harley once told me not to expect a lot of accolades from my wife for stopping love busters. People don't typically blow a trumpet and announce they've stopped abusing their wives. But the love busters need to stop in any case, all of them. The more withdrawn she is, the less she will care about some love busters - this is a bad sign, because it means she simply wants to be away from you. In all your marriage builders listening, have you heard Dr. Harley discuss an approach avoidance conflict?
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573 |
In April, my wife wrote saying I refer to her as a reluctant wife and she described herself and her efforts and said she was NOT a reluctant spouse. Dr H said she is a reluctant spouse because my LBs have pushed her into withdrawal.
He advised me to stop my LBs and she'll come around and allow me to make deposits.
That was April 14 or 15, this year.
There have been others, but I don' have dates or specific topics.
Last edited by Remark; 11/23/14 09:36 PM.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
BTW, I'm more than willing to bet your extended family is disrespectful to your wife. So again, seeing them over her objections is very entertwined with the issue of disrespect.
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
Still, I see independent behavior as the secondary issue. If you are dying of cancer AND the bubonic plague, it probably doesn't make a whole lot of sense to worry about which one is primary and which one is secondary. You need urgent treatment for both. Instead of navel gazing about which one is primary or secondary, knock them both off immediately!
Last edited by markos; 11/23/14 09:47 PM.
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573 |
OK, I agree. That makes a lot of sense.
How do I stop being defensive? I have done research on it, I've studied it. I've watched youtube videos on how to avoid it. Still, when I am questioned or complained to, I get defensive?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
OK, I agree. That makes a lot of sense.
How do I stop being defensive? I have done research on it, I've studied it. I've watched youtube videos on how to avoid it. Still, when I am questioned or complained to, I get defensive?
I would focus on keeping your mouth shut until you are totally calm. Don't respond until you have had a chance to get us or Dr. Harley to help you understand your wife's point of view. Focus on understanding her point of view BEFORE you try to give her your point of view. Be quick to listen and slow to speak: http://biblehub.com/james/1-19.htm
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
Are you familiar with the Love Busters worksheet procedure for disrespectful judgments? Will your wife follow it with you?
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573 |
I am familiar with it. It is in the Five Steps to ROmantic Love, right?. We each did is separately sort of several months ago. I will review.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
I am familiar with it. It is in the Five Steps to ROmantic Love, right?. We each did is separately sort of several months ago. I will review. It's not a one time activity: she should give you a weekly written worksheet listing each time you said or did something disrespectful. See if she is willing to do this.
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573 |
I generally don't have angry outbursts. I do respond with calm, (I think) unemotional defensive comments, often like "No, I don't" or "No, I wasn't" (defensive, for example.)
It's not so much the tone or emotions, but the words.
It's a love buster for me to say trigger words like "I try", for example.
Last edited by Remark; 11/23/14 10:12 PM.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
I generally don't have angry outbursts. I do respond with calm, (I think) unemotional defensive comments, often like "No, I don't" or "No, I wasn't" (defensive, for example.)
It's not so much the tone or emotions, but the words.
It's a love buster for me to say trigger words like "I try", for example. Did you read all of my suggestions in that post, or did you stop at the suggestion to be calm? This is a matter of simple habit formation. Eliminate the old habit and form the new habit. Dr. Harley has written a lot about habit formation, and you can find a lot written about it anywhere. One thing you'll find is that in order to override your old habit, you are going to need to be calm enough to remember to think before you speak, so you can learn to start filtering out the things you say that she finds disrespectful. After you have done this long enough, it will be automatic. The worksheet procedure is very good help in learning to eliminate the habit of disrespectful judgments.
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 573 |
I asked. She is not interested.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818 Likes: 7 |
OK, I agree. That makes a lot of sense.
How do I stop being defensive? I have done research on it, I've studied it. I've watched youtube videos on how to avoid it. Still, when I am questioned or complained to, I get defensive?
Build this new habit: When your wife tells you something you don't want to hear, thank her for telling you. Then, shut up. Can you do this?
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
|
|
|
Moderated by Ariel, BerlinMB, Denali, Fordude, IrishGreen, MBeliever, MBsurvivor, MBSync, McLovin, Mizar, PhoenixMB, Toujours
Forums67
Topics133,619
Posts2,323,474
Members71,917
|
Most Online3,185 Jan 27th, 2020
|
|
|
|