Ditto here. This is VERY common!

I'll add that even after I knew (and they knew that I knew!) it continued at work. She was never late getting home either and never went in earlier than usual.

But I pulled out all the stops and took time away from work, spent money I didn't have, and got the evidence I needed to expose it. I got creative.

And just last week, three and a half years later, my wife THANKED me for fighting for us.

That still doesn't answer my question... If I didn't think there was any kind of affair, why would i be snooping and parking by her office during lunch? Im not disagreeing with you... Im asking what is considered evidence, a picture of them getting coffee doesn't prove anything other then getting coffee...

ESL
So many of us have been where you are(me included) I was a basket case when i got the bomb dropped on me after being a "rock" as you put it my whole life.

I found this site far too late and really had screwed things up with my ex.
So I am asking you to follow the advice here, it is going to be the hardest thing you have ever done. It is going to be scary.

For crying out loud, stop worrying about what is "legal". We have had so many posters frightened off by "illegal", it is just silly. Not one has been charged with any crime! For heavens sake you are at "war" with OM and WW for your family!!!!!!!!!

You are on the right track, but you have to double or triple your efforts on snooping. Get the evidence by hook or crook!

Here is the truth- where there is a RED FLAG there is in appropriate behavior!! Multiple RED FLAGS = full blown adultery(that is where you are at). It has been proven here, over and over and over.

You get the GPS info, you get the spyware installed, you get a PI, you get the VAR setup in her car(they always call their lovers in the car when alone).

You will keep asking that question forever, until you get divorced and the POSOM becomes your children's Step-Daddy.

You don't know, because you have not pulled out all stops.

Have a friend follow their car at lunch. See where they go. Pay someone she does not know to follow them. If they go to a restaurant, then that person goes in too and takes cell phone photos and video, recording their conversation.

Don't become too afraid of consequences to save your marriage. So What if spy software is technically illegal. You very easily are morally justified in attempting to save your children's intact family. Geez!!! Jaywalking is illegal too.

Quit waffling because of things that "Might" happen.

Do you want to stop this affair?
Do you want to save your marriage?
Do you want your children to grow uo in a loving family together?

If the answers are YES, then do EVERYTHING you can..... NOW!!!

LTL

I'm not endorsing anything but just did a quick Google search. If you're determined you'll find a way,

Very small voice recorder

Maybe hide it in her pocketbook somewhere. Or sew it into her coat. Legal? Probably not. When I was in your shoes I didn't care.

You need evidence of an affair. You can best get that by putting spyware on her phone. You have a much greater risk of losing your wife than getting caught putting spyware on it. If you are caught putting spyware on the phone, it wouldn't be in your wife's best interest to cause you legal problems.

Or at least recover the deleted messages from it. There are several programs out there to do that. What kind of phone is it?

ELS,
I know what you are trying to say, because you are already anticipating that your WW will just spin everything and say �we were just getting Coffee or lunch�. I personally, for my own sanity would do whatever it took to know beyond a shadow of a doubt. For example. If you placed a real time tracking device under his car, you would never have to let anyone know that you placed it. The way it would benefit you, is you could give them time to go park somewhere, and then show up five minutes later, to give them time to get comfortable, if you know what I mean. They would just think you followed them, and would never know about the GPS. Point is, that you should never give up your spying resources anyway.

I also really like the idea of the Micro VAR, that you could place inside her jacket, or the inseam of her purse. For your own sanity, you need to do something that will confirm the affair in your mind, and give you a way to expose this to everyone. That is the only way this will ever end. I assume you will probably be going to see if they go together again today. Try to keep track of them a little better, so that you can see where they are going. Nothing is better, than catching them red handed in the act. There is no way to justify things when you are busted that way.

I prayed for you yesterday, and I know that if you stay diligent, that you will get the evidence you need. There is hope, and you can get your wife back. Right now she is an alien in your wife�s body. She doesn�t even know why she is doing these things. It is your job as a husband, to rescue her from herself, and restore your marriage.

It's much easier than you think. I thought I'd never get credible evidence because he was so loud and proud about being friends and going to her house.

Guess what? Waywards are sloppy. They hold hands in public, they text soppy/inappropriate things, they spend far more time on the phone together than is believably platonic, racking up record bills.

Keyloggers will give you access to the works.

All you have to do is look. They are doing this therefore there is a trail.

This might be the solution. If he could snatch the phone while she is sleeping and install a deleted message program, he could retrieve old messages.

Guess what? Waywards are sloppy. They hold hands in public, they text soppy/inappropriate things, they spend far more time on the phone together than is believably platonic, racking up record bills.

Keyloggers will give you access to the works.

All you have to do is look. They are doing this therefore there is a trail.

[/quote]

Ditto, waywards never think they will get caught so the evidence is everywhere.

I think this wayward is very careful and very clever because ESL confronted her about an EA with this same guy 6 months ago. It gave her a heads up to go further underground while she quietly ended the marriage for other "issues." Going to counseling is part of the ruse so she can say she "tried."

It is not hard to hide a workplace affair. Sugarcanes husband did it for 6 years.

Ditto for me too. ESL please tell us you see a pattern here too.

I don't think they are getting coffee when they go off during the work day together and I don't think you will catch them grabbing coffee when she's supposed to be at her mom's at night.

But really, you won't know until you try. You need to hire a PI or get someone else to follow them.

Thank you all.. I do see a pattern here, I dont disagree... I aleady have been using 2 VAR's One in the car, and one in our bedroom, although the last 5 nights we have shared our bed in our room so that one is useless for the time being. If we continue to share a bed, ill be moving it to another location. its not small enough to fit in purse or jacket though.. Not sure where to put the second one just yet. The micro recorder im going to check out. Purse would be the most likely place to put it.

I snooped a bit today, drove by a few times and spoke to her on her office phone to confirm she was in the office, he was not... atleast not yet. Ill be driving by again this afternoon to see if his car ever shows up. But i know for now they aren't together so far today.

Ive set up a babysitter for Friday... ill be snooping afterwork and see where she may go between work and therapy and then after therapy... im still trying to work out using someone elses car or have someone else come with me as i dont want my car to be seen...

Can you get a GPS on her car before Friday so you don't lose her?

Can you get your hands on her phone to see where she has been going? There is a way you can tell where she has been on an iPhone.

Quote:
Do this: Open Settings, then select Privacy, then Location Services, then System Services, then Frequent Locations. This shows you all the places that the phone has spent repeated times visiting.

Not sure ill be able to get a GPS in time.. im looking for any local places that sell stuff for that... But even if i get it, ill need to find time to get out to her car and place it without her knowing.. thats a bit easier but still not simple.

Access to her phone is hit or miss... Its often enough that its a couple of times a week, but its random and part luck. She does leave it out alot, and if a new text comes in i can see the screen and who its from. But time to get into it and look through it is a different story. I try daily and take what i can get.

From operation investigate: Posting from my phone, so no link, but check out TeenSafe for monitoring your "Childrens" cell phone usage.

http://www.teensafe.com/

It also has a version for Android, but with that one you do need physical access to the target phone.

Teen Safe seems to be a highly regarded and well known outfit to do business with without seeming like one of those Scam companies out there, AND...

The cost is ONLY $14.95 per month!!!

Copy/Paste from the site:

However, TeenSafe lets parents spy on text messages � and more � without the child knowing. TeenSafe iPhone also works on an iPhone without needing to �jailbreak� the phone. The process is simple:

1. Register with TeenSafe. 2. Pick the type of smartphone your child uses � either an iPhone or any Android device. 3. For an iPhone, you just need your child�s Apple ID and password � you don�t even need to have the phone in hand. 4. For Android devices, you�ll need the phone to initiate the program download, but that�s it.

Once set up, you can read all the text messages your child has sent and received from your TeenSafe login page.

No icon appears on your child�s phone, so they won�t know about TeenSafe unless you tell them. As long as you are the parent or guardian of the child, this is legal. As for whether or not you should tell your child, TeenSafe puts it this way:

LTL