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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by RavenFlight
<EDIT> Ok, I just spoke to the other spouse. "She's aware that they are duo partners, she's aware that some things are going on, but she's not I a place to talk about it and wont be for a couple of days... I'll call you back"

How did you open up the call with her? Did you tell her they are having an affair?

I said something along the lines of:

"Hello, my name is XXX, we've met but you probably don't remember. I'm the husband of YYY, who is your husband's duo partner. I'm ringing to advise you that I'm certain that my wife and your husband are involved in an emotional affair"

Or words to that effect.

Then went on to say that I don't want their marriage destroyed etc.

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Ok, the other spouse called me back.

She said "I know there is something going on. My husband admits it and says it isn't sexual. I don't know what you're trying to achieve here?"

I advised that if she wasn't aware I felt that she should be.

She thanked me and basically said 'If they are in love there's nothing we can do'.

So, contacting her seems to have been a waste of time. Perhaps not.

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Originally Posted by RavenFlight
Ok, the other spouse called me back.

She said "I know there is something going on. My husband admits it and says it isn't sexual. I don't know what you're trying to achieve here?"

I advised that if she wasn't aware I felt that she should be.

She thanked me and basically said 'If they are in love there's nothing we can do'.

So, contacting her seems to have been a waste of time. Perhaps not.

In 14 years on this board and hundreds of exposures this is the STRANGEST response I have ever heard. Almost unbelievable. Most spouses care about their marriages and it seems you have found the one spouse who doesn't care. Saying there is nothing you can do if they are in lurve [a ridiculous notion] indicates that she doesn't care one whit. And that is ok, you can still fight for your marriage.

But, just because she is an enabler does not mean you should be. Now, you just need to expose the affair wide and far.

Did you read through the exposure thread?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Raven
We have seen your situation here repeatedly, heck i was the same way.
You are in denial about what has happened/happening.

Waywards always lie about the extent of the affair by usually several levels.
Waywards that want to get deeper in the affair without trouble always want to move out.

There is a slim, slim chance(1%) that you are right and it hasnt gone physical.

Regardless, do the exposure as laid out by Melody. No partial, or trickle or I'll do it later exposure.


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Originally Posted by RavenFlight
Ok, the other spouse called me back.

She said "I know there is something going on. My husband admits it and says it isn't sexual. I don't know what you're trying to achieve here?"

I advised that if she wasn't aware I felt that she should be.

She thanked me and basically said 'If they are in love there's nothing we can do'.

So, contacting her seems to have been a waste of time. Perhaps not.

There is a possibility it wasn't the wife you talked to

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Contacting the other spouse was NOT a waste of time.

Even if she doesn't care, at least you know that YOU did the right thing. YOU did everything you could.

See part of the MB plan is not just about saving your marriage, but also going through this very difficult situation while maintaining your own emotional, physical and spiritual well being. If you follow the steps here, even if your marriage fails you can move on assured that you did everything in your power to end this affair and save your marriage. You can hold your head high knowing that you have done the right thing.

So great job on exposing to the OM's BS.

Also keep in mind that sometimes there is more to the exposure behind the scenes. Meaning, she may have played it down to you (it isn't very easy to hear your spouse is having an affair after all), but freaked out once she hung up, who knows.

Carry on with a far and wide exposure.

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Who is on your exposure list? Have you exposed to her adult children? Who is on your list from OM's side?


FWW/BW (me)
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2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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My wife exposed this to most people interestingly enough. She exposed it to her children & her friends before I did, and I did to a few of my friends. Most people now know. It's been pretty much played as 'I didn't intend to fall in love, but I did, and now I feel trapped'. She's moving into a Christian couple's house who also have another Christian female house-mate, so I've got some hopes there.

Followup from the other Betrayed Spouse through my wife, apparently she did have a bit more of a heated discussion with the other party. Don't know if it's had an effect.

Now, I'm sorry about my previous misunderstanding of plan A/B. I have been reading a TONNE of literature on this and got confused. Anyway, I'm firmly in Plan A (now that I understand it better), and my wife is moving out making it a kinda/sorta plan B. Now in the book Dr Harley recommends that males sit on plan A for up to 6 months before implementig plan B. Ok, so WHEN she moves out, if I'm still in plan A, do I still see her and express my 'I'm willing to work on this marriage' part of Plan A, or am I essentially pushed into Plan B?


Last edited by RavenFlight; 10/02/15 12:38 AM.
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RF, the first step in Plan A is exposure. That means that you call or email all those people she told, and many more, and ask for their help. You would also expose to the OMs family.

Unfortunately, she is moving out to have an affair so that should not give you hope.

Please comeplete a wide spread, nuclear exposure following the instructions in the exposure thread.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by RavenFlight
My wife exposed this to most people interestingly enough.


No she didn't. She spun her version of the story out to these people. Unfortunately this is not going to help you to save your marriage because she told them all sorts of negative things about you that presents you as the reason for the breakdown of the marriage.

Now telling people that she is having an affair is going to look like a spiteful move on your part. But you have to to do it anyway. When you tell them, be sure to call it an affair (it is) not an 'emotional affair' or any other euphemism.


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Ravenflight, my friend, reading between the lines it looks to me like you are trying to avoid the job of exposure by giving us the impression it has been done in some form or manner. I also have a very hard time believing you actually spoke to the OM's wife since I am pretty sure it is you who believes that cockamamie reasoning of "they are in love and there is nothing we can do." That is the conflict avoider and the enabler talking. Like I said before, enabling will not save a marriage.

I would caution you about sweeping exposure under the rug because it is the only chance you have to save your marriage. Exposure is your absolute most potent weapon against the affair. If you don't expose it, the affair can go on forever because the fantasy that supports it will never die. And if it does die, she will likely have another affair because she will be foggy. You can be here for years fighting against a secret affair and end up divorced if you won't act.

Dr. Bill Harley is a clinical psychologist who has specialized in saving marriages from infidelity for 40 years. He is the author of Surviving an Affair. Here is what he says about exposure:

Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
"Exposure is very likely to end the affair, lifting the fog that has overcome the unfaithful spouse, helping him or her become truly repentant and willing to put energy and effort into a full marital recovery. In my experience with thousands of couples who struggle with the fallout of infidelity, exposure has been the single most important first step toward recovery. It not only helps end the affair, but it also provides support to the betrayed spouse, giving him or her stamina to hold out for ultimate recovery."

Quote
"The reason for the wide exposure is not to hurt the unfaithful spouse, but rather to end the fantasy. Your husband's secret second life made his affair possible, and the more you can to to make it public, the easier it is for him to see the damage he's doing. Keeping it secret does damage, but few know about it. Making it public helps everyone, including the unfaithful spouse and lover, see the affair for what it really is."

Don't allow your fear to control your actions, because your marriage will not make it if you do.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Raven,
Stop being a chicken. If you want your wife, you will need to lure her back (PlanA), she will not come to her senses while in the affair.

When you expose far and wide, you are demonstrating through your ACTIONS that you are willing to FIGHT for her. Women seem to like men demonstrating their commitment through action. You also demonstrate through your actions to the POSOM that you are willing to fight. Most POSOM are just looking for a cheap/easy/low hassle piece of action. He'll be less interested too.

Plan A is also about demonstrating through you actions that you are committed to being your version of a good husband. This will be tested too, in order to find out if it is real. So when you start to achieve results, thereby introducing "confusion" to your WW who thinks her mind is already made up, she will bait you. Bait you in the most despicable ways. So go into your Plan A without any expectations of a payoff for at least 6 months, longer than that if your WW moves out so she can get physical with her "Soulmate" or whatever.

If you do a real exposure, the experts here can help with the plan. If you do a Plan A, they can help with that and help keep you focused.

If you continue with Plan Raven, then consider mediation for your divorce, it usually costs less than a litigated divorce.

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I will reiterate, you are desperately downgrading the addictive nature of an affair and the fog that a wayward spouse is in when they engage in an affair.

You believe your wife's every word. I don't care what kind of woman you were once married too, right now you are married to a WAYWARD woman and that means you are not going to get the truth no matter how much you want to think you are. Face that.

This is a physical affair. Period. If there is a chance it is not *yet* it will soon be over because she is moving out to pursue a physical affair.

She is moving out to pursue her affair without your interference, not to 'clear her head' or any number of other affair manual excuses to move out.

She has not 'informed everyone' that she is cheating on her husband of X years with a man who is also married and is breaking up 2 families. She has probably informed them of just how evil and terrible you are, in preparation to move out and introduce them to her new boyfriend that was the breath of fresh air after she left her terrible husband.

You really need to STOP believing that your wife is above lying, physically cheating, or any other disgusting behavior. I assure you she is NOT, not while she is in the fog working to get her next fix. Many many people on here saw a wonderful, Christian spouse do atrocious things in the midst of the an affair.

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Who is on your list to expose to? You need to expose to OM's side.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Question for RF: Why haven't you shoved the karaoke mic down the OM's throat?

Your wife will tell you she doesn't want you to confront him, but deep down the old wife who used to love you is devastated that you haven't.

When a husband doesn't fight for his spouse he shows a lack of caring and lack of courage.

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