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My H made plans w me today on how to do that going forward. What are the plans?
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I snoop on my husband all the time. He's never had an affair. He doesn't have a second secret life, nor are there any red flags that I should be worried about. But, we're married. In the good marriage culture, spouses check up on each other. THAT'S what makes me able to trust him, and it keeps anything from ever becoming a problem.
We are so integrated that there is no way he could ever have an affair without me finding out about it almost immediately.
Unlike my husband, your husband has a lot of red flags. You have even MORE REASON to snoop.
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No, Dr. H doesn't see it being the issue Dr. Harley did not say that on your show.
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No, Dr. H doesn't see it being the issue, due to previous IB back when dating/throughout M. I would if H refused to give up rec activity tho. Just because Dr Harley was focused on other things during the radio call doesn't necessarily mean that he doesn't think infidelity/possible infidelity is an issue. He thinks that is an issue for all spouses to be worried about. That is an integral part of his program, affair-proofing your marriage, which includes snooping.
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My plan is to continue to show him how we can integrate our M. My H made plans w me today on how to do that going forward. And, like Dr. H said, my challenge now is to get him to change his theory, that we CAN get along and enrich our lives doing things together, making decisions and plans together.
As long as there are no more rec classes w OS and overnights, we can move forward. I do need to have a plan in place if he reverts back to class w OS instead of me and overnights away. There is some over-simplification going on, here. He said you should be preparing for separation. He said in another case that reminded him of your H, the H just ramped up the IB and thoughtless behavior after being asked to address the problem. He said you need to be prepared for that.
Last edited by SusieQ; 05/16/16 07:43 PM.
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Just because Dr Harley was focused on other things during the radio call doesn't necessarily mean that he doesn't think infidelity/possible infidelity is an issue. He thinks that is an issue for all spouses to be worried about. Kat, when Prisca and I attended the Marriage Builders weekend seminar in 2010, the packet of books we received came with a copy of Surviving an Affair and a note saying that Dr. Harley thought this was a good book for all couples to read whether their marriage was experiencing an affair or not. Little did I know that within the next year, Prisca would start an affair! Unless Dr. Harley told you "I don't suspect an affair," I think you should be really careful not to read your own opinions into what he is saying!
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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No, Dr. H doesn't see it being the issue, due to previous IB back when dating/throughout M. I would if H refused to give up rec activity tho. . Just so you know, Dr Harley DOES recommend snooping. Whether or not he wants to give up his rec activity, you NEED to find out if he is having an affair.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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My H met me right after to go for a long walk and discuss. He was not happy about giving up R class, but he is going to start practicing from home. As long as he does activities that he enjoys by himself more than the activities he does with you, your marriage will not work. He enjoys yoga more than he enjoys you. Yoga should go. Then he asked if grabbing his paddle board to go out for a while solo is off the table. I think it will be baby steps for us. I don't think he will ever be able to give up doing his own activities, but everyone here has helped me realize how important it is that he give up any activity that is causing me pain, and he agreed he will stop with overnights away and outside classes with OS. No, do not take baby steps. You need to be assertive and no longer accept any crumbs. He needs to join you completely and whole heartily in this marriage, or you need to separate. You are risking becoming so resentful that you hate him, at which point the marriage will be a hundred times harder to save. So, don't take baby steps. In order for you marriage to fully recover, ALL recreation needs to be with you at this point in your marriage. Dr. Harley allows for spouses to have recreational activities alone once certain criteria is met: 1. YOU are his favorite recreational companion 2. You are getting 15 hours Undivided Attention a week, meeting the 4 Intimate Emotional Needs, and you are in love. 3. The activity doesn't include the opposite sex. It will be awhile before he should expect to do any recreational activities all by himself.
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Little did I know that within the next year, Prisca would start an affair! Guess what kind of lifestyle I was living ... It was full of Independent Behavior and secrets! I had poor boundaries around the opposite sex ... I accused markos of controlling me .... Sound familiar?
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It IS an issue because the IB lifestyle LEADS to affairs. It is Dr. Harley that has taught us this, and that is why we have been telling you to snoop all along.
You need to snoop. Ok, so I must have misunderstood Dr. H. He told me off air that this is a case of IB, which he is seeing a lot more of. It's challenging for sure, but I didn't connect the dots to mean challenging in that it leads to A. So I should not stop snooping because the R classes and overnights are stopping. Our plans: H home practice instead of going to outside class at lunchtime. No more overnights. We go as a family or send son w family friends. Hiking together 3xs a week, date night 1-2x a week, talk before bed 30min a night, no more devices in morning over coffee (30min).
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My H met me right after to go for a long walk and discuss. He was not happy about giving up R class, but he is going to start practicing from home. As long as he does activities that he enjoys by himself more than the activities he does with you, your marriage will not work. He enjoys yoga more than he enjoys you. Yoga should go. Then he asked if grabbing his paddle board to go out for a while solo is off the table. I think it will be baby steps for us. I don't think he will ever be able to give up doing his own activities, but everyone here has helped me realize how important it is that he give up any activity that is causing me pain, and he agreed he will stop with overnights away and outside classes with OS. No, do not take baby steps. You need to be assertive and no longer accept any crumbs. He needs to join you completely and whole heartily in this marriage, or you need to separate. You are risking becoming so resentful that you hate him, at which point the marriage will be a hundred times harder to save. So, don't take baby steps. In order for you marriage to fully recover, ALL recreation needs to be with you at this point in your marriage. Dr. Harley allows for spouses to have recreational activities alone once certain criteria is met: 1. YOU are his favorite recreational companion 2. You are getting 15 hours Undivided Attention a week, meeting the 4 Intimate Emotional Needs, and you are in love. 3. The activity doesn't include the opposite sex. It will be awhile before he should expect to do any recreational activities all by himself. Thank you for this plan. To implement these 3 steps i need to assert no rec activity without me, not even alone. Dr H said I'm supposed to join him and make it seem like he benefits too. Need to figure out how to do that...
Last edited by Kat37; 05/16/16 08:02 PM.
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One of the biggest reasons IB is so dangerous to marriages is because it is the kind of lifestyle that leads to affairs.
So, as Susie has pointed out, he may not be in an affair YET. But he's living the lifestyle that leads to affairs. You need to find out for sure.
The reason you need to find out for sure whether it's an affair or not is because the course of action you need to take will be different if there is an affair. So you need to rule it out.
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Hiking together 3xs a week, How long does this take? Do YOU enjoy it immensely? Do you spend the time talking and flirting? How long will the dates be? Doing what? I'm not trying to grill you ... I'm trying to help you refine your plan 
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Little did I know that within the next year, Prisca would start an affair! Guess what kind of lifestyle I was living ... It was full of Independent Behavior and secrets! I had poor boundaries around the opposite sex ... I accused markos of controlling me .... Sound familiar? Yes. I understand.
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Hiking together 3xs a week, How long does this take? Do YOU enjoy it immensely? Do you spend the time talking and flirting? How long will the dates be? Doing what? I'm not trying to grill you ... I'm trying to help you refine your plan Yes I love hiking w him but we hadn't done it in 2 yrs. today he said several times how much he was enjoying it w me. It's great because we can open up and be outdoors. Today we hiked locally for an hour. If we plan a longer trail this could easily be 1.5-2 hours.
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Thank you for this plan. To implement these 3 steps i need to assert no rec activity without me, not even alone. Dr H said I'm supposed to join him and make it seem like he benefits too. Need to figure out how to do that... Basically just be a fun gal to be with, but do it in a way that you enjoy. Lots of talking and paying attention to each other, while engaging in a recreational activity that you both enjoy. No demands, disrespectful judgments, or angry outbursts in the conversation. (Dr. Harley had a great point in the call about not judging each other's food choices, for example.) Meeting a typical man's emotional needs is usually not very complex, as long as he isn't doing something more fun without you the rest of the time (contrast effect), and as love busters aren't happening.
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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Date nights have been 2 hours but we can stretch them out. He likes getting out of the house and we talked about getting tea after dinner.
He was more open than I expected. He's the one who suggested he start a home practice. I could do it w him...but I'm not sure it would be what he has in mind. Not sure yet how handle this. I don't want to force him to stop stretching.
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Thank you for this plan. To implement these 3 steps i need to assert no rec activity without me, not even alone. Dr H said I'm supposed to join him and make it seem like he benefits too. Need to figure out how to do that... Basically just be a fun gal to be with, but do it in a way that you enjoy. Lots of talking and paying attention to each other, while engaging in a recreational activity that you both enjoy. No demands, disrespectful judgments, or angry outbursts in the conversation. (Dr. Harley had a great point in the call about not judging each other's food choices, for example.) Meeting a typical man's emotional needs is usually not very complex, as long as he isn't doing something more fun without you the rest of the time (contrast effect), and as love busters aren't happening. Thank you for this! I need to remember to do this each time I'm w him.
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When I told him we could brainstorm until we come up w solutions we both like instead of always compromising or going solo to avoid compromising, he right away said he'd love to go to 2 places for lunch that he didn't think I'd be open to.
He was very happy to hear we can do those options. So food has been a bigger issue for him than I realized.
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These hiking trips will count toward UA, but you need to have blocks of 3-4 hours at a time. So come up with some activities that can surround the hiking experience ...
For example:
Drive: 30 minutes
Hike: 1 hour
Picnic: 1 hour
Hike: 1 hour
Drive home: 30 minutes
That is a pure example. You would need to tailor it to things the two of you enjoy doing. Driving in the car counts toward UA, btw, if it is full of enjoyable conversation and affection.
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