Yeah, we'd all rather do that but
YOU CAN'T COME TO AN AGREEMENT WITH ALCOHOL IN THE PICTURE
so this is just an irrelevant fantasy.


Her drinking is HER forcing her will on YOU.
Having a bar is HER forcing her will on YOU.

You not tolerating her drinking is you preventing her from forcing her will.
You getting rid of the bar is you preventing her from forcing her will.

My plan is that i will not drink at all for a time....so far i have been doing it and no problems. I feel resentment towards you sometimes and want to but only because i always want what i tell myself i can't have (this is why i don't do diets well). I was hoping that occasionally maybe we could have a glass of wine together but judging from your reaction last night when i brought a bottle home i am not sure your are up for that. I would still like to be able to have A drink with friends or maybe a couple on xmas eve with family and on New Years Eve. I am not sure how you feel about that. I think my plan is that it should not be an every day/week thing but occasionally. I agree that the softball thing is out of line and i know that i never felt right about it but went along with it anyway. I need to be stronger and do what i think is right and not let others influence me.

Not sure if this helps or not....is this something you can live with? I thought it was a good start, to show you that i am serious about the occasional thing, to call off tonight as we are going next week and thought two weeks in a row would be not as occasionally as i had planned.

Maybe its wierd but i always picture us curled up by the fire talking or doing a puzzle or something and maybe having a glass of wine or something. To me that sounds romantic but i think you believe that i have a problem with drinking so that it would only irritate you.

I have been reading stuff and understand that you think i have a problem. The things i have read say that it isn't necessarily a drinking problem but that we have a relationship problem. We need to fix that. I have to understand that it bothers you and show consideration for your feelings about it. I plan to do that. I am hoping we can work this out.

Let me know your thoughts.

Thanks for the kind response. I am very happy you are openly discussing this with me.

I wish I could trust that you could control it. It�s been a problem for us for some time, unfortunately I�ve done my share of keeping it bottled up and now I have built an aversion to it. I feel triggered when I see it. Just to clarify, I don�t know if irritated is the right word. I try not to get angry about this stuff anymore because my anger only hurts me and certainly hurts you and our relationship. So I feel more hurt than anything. Us guys you know, we turn pain into anger. So I�m trying really hard to deal with this for what it is, a hurt not an irritant. The best way to avoid hurt is to avoid the things that trigger the pain.

I love your picture. I, too, imagine us having a very romantic marriage doing fun things like curling up, playing and enjoying each other. I so want that for us!!! Does drinking really have to be a part of it?

I want you to know I really don�t like what I feel I�ve had to do. I don�t want to parent/police you anymore than you want to be policed/controlled/etc. It�s taken me a long time to get to the point where I felt I needed to step up and say something. I�m very hopeful that we can work this out too.

I am very happy that you said this: "I have to understand that it bothers you and show consideration for your feelings about it."


Could we have a marriage where you drink in it? It�s hard for me due to the history. It feels like it is so important to you � but to me it�s just alcohol. I don�t need it to be happy. I need a great, happy, romantic marriage with you to be happy. I love you, I don�t want to be alone and I don�t want to be without you.

I would love it if you could prove to me and yourself that the drinking isn�t something you have to have. I understand skipping tonight because you wanted to avoid drinking. The fact you have to avoid a place to not drink doesn�t make me feel any better. Almost tells me the need for the drink is stronger than your will to not have one even though everyone else is. But all that talk is about making me feel better and doesn�t really answer the question about whether or not this is a disease or not. I don�t have any answers for you on this one.

I have a proposal but I�m not sure you�ll accept. I have been emailing back and forth with Dr Harley about our situation. I have been following his advice because he believes the drinking is a big hindrance to our marital happiness and I agree. He is well versed on alcohol and drug addiction. Would you be willing to exchange emails with him and get some advice from him? It�s free!!

Just so we�re clear � right now I would really like it if we stopped drinking. I know you think the timing sucks but there is never a good time. There is always a reason or influence that leads to drinking. Right now I�d like to put all our efforts into creating that picture we both want (minus the drink).

I recently texted my W after she informed me she was going out with a coworker after work. This means going to a bar and having drinks.

Text: I'm confused. You said you would stop drinking. I was very happy to hear you say that. I'm in the dark what your plan is for committing to doing just that. Sounds like you aren't committing after all.





I followed that up with:

1. Brought home a bottle of wine last night? Two nights ago, yes. How did she square this with not drinking? She didn't. Her commitment to me was a single statement. She would stop drinking. How did she manage not to drink it last night? She isn't drinking. For some reason she thought I'd be OK sharing it. I told her I'm not drinking. Where is it now? Right were she sit it down on the counter. It hasn't moved.

Alias, the way you talk to your wife gives the impression of wiggle room- that you are just trying this out.

Thank you for clarifying.

I'l be back later, but for now, I also want to point out that her "informing" you that she was going out for the drink with a colleague is very Independent Behaviour, as well as breaking her pledge to you.

It isn't okay for either of you to "inform" the other of your separate social lives, and she should know this, since you have done MC coaching. You mesh your social lives together. You make plans to go out with each other, and you pretty much don't go out alone with other people. You can only go out with other people IF

1. Your UA time is regularly met, and is satisfying to both of you;

2. You ASK each other, rather than inform each other, about going out with other people, and;

3. Having been asked, you are enthusiastic about your spouse going out with those particular people, to do that particular activity.

When your spouse "informs" you of her plans to go out, none of those criteria is met.

[quote=MrAlias]1. Brought home a bottle of wine last night? Two nights ago, yes. How did she square this with not drinking? She didn't. Her commitment to me was a single statement. She would stop drinking. How did she manage not to drink it last night? She isn't drinking. For some reason she thought I'd be OK sharing it. I told her I'm not drinking. Where is it now? Right were she sit it down on the counter. It hasn't moved.

[

We aren't following MB. She isn't 100% on board even after counseling with Jennifer. She buys into pieces of it but not all of it.

Alias, the way you talk to your wife gives the impression of wiggle room- that you are just trying this out.

Be clear and use the words that SugarCane gave you. Let your wife know that you need for both of you to stop drinking entirely forever. Let her know you dont want alcohol in the home, or for either of you to go on drinking dates with each other, friends or family.

Even if she agrees to stop, you have your work cut out because she is going to struggle. She is trying every avenue to get you to bend, then she may raise the volume.

Sorry, even that message wasn�t clear.

I would love it if we stopped drinking completely, forever. I see that as the only way this is going to work. I would like to replace what you associate with drinking to something else we do together, as a couple, that builds a happier, stronger marriage.

Is that something you could live with?

[
Where did she get it from? Did she go to a shop and buy it? I don't know where. I was upset and let her know I wasn't going to drink. That was the end of the conversation.

Why haven't you removed it from your home? For example, why didn't you offer to take it back to the shop for a refund?
Probably because I'm lazy and to some extent want her to take some ownership of this problem. I've been fighting for us for quite some time and have the same mantra year after year, it's not good, it's not totally horrible, when is it bad enough?

While this is written for adulterers, the principle is the same because they are both addicts:

Originally Posted By: Dr. Harley Effective Marriage Counseling pg 94
"Granted, there are situations when demands may be necessary in marriage. During a spouse's affair, for example, I recommend that the betrayed spouse demand there be no contact with the lover. If there is continued contact, separation or even divorce would be the logical consequence. While normally demands don't work, in this case there are no reasonable alternatives because thoughtful requests are even less likely to separate lovers."

It becomes an argument. I think she has a drinking problem, she doesn't think it is one.

I have told her it hurts me, she says she wants to consider my feelings, I am hanging my hat that she is sincere and will stop drinking because I AGAIN asked her to stop.

"Just so we�re clear � right now I would really like it if we stopped drinking. "

I did reread this part and the RIGHT NOW words shouldn't be in there. That is where the wiggle room shows up.

So to provide better clarify I sent this:

Honestly, MrAlias, why so wimpy?