We would never advise that you make a scene. I don't quite know what kind of "scene" you meant, but it sounds as if blowing up and having an angry or tearful outburst was the alternative to saying nothing. As you know, those things should never be done.

Your kids have already been told about her problems with alcohol and that you want this to stop, and that you might ask for their help soon, so why was this something you felt you could not put your foot down about in front of them?

And when she said "I brought this home. I thought we could share it", your response should have been to remind her that she'd agreed to stop drinking, not to tell her that YOU are not drinking.

I think you have already been very direct in your request that she stop drinking for good. I agree with your earlier statement that she knows exactly what you want her to do. Now, you need to be like a broken record when she brings up drinking.

"You agreed to stop drinking altogether. It hurts me when you drink."

"Please do not bring alcohol home. You promised to stop drinking altogether."

"Please do not go out drinking with your colleagues. You promised to stop drinking altogether. It hurts me when you drink."

You need to give the same message, all the time: "Please do not drink, as you promised, in order to stop hurting me".

Something else that really stands out to me is the fact that you are in the habit of ignoring the elephant in the room. Were you aware this is a dysfunctional trait of alcoholic families? Everyone pretends like there is not a problem. So when she brought the bottle of alcohol home, it should have been openly addressed.

Totally aware ... and it is not confined to the drinking either.

Again we don't have an integrated relationship. It is far from an MB marriage. I should be able to talk to her about this stuff without any issue. But we don't see eye to eye on all areas of our relationship and tend to ignore the elephant that arises from that.

Agreed. And I am never sure whether or not I can control my response when I've been triggered so I walk away or avoid the confrontation to ensure I don't have an AO or say something stupid (DJ).

The scene could be created by me.

Except that you are not really "making a demand" rather, you are giving your wife valuable information about the true state of your marriage and what you are no longer willing to tolerate.

Take a look at Melody's wording again:

"Dear wife, your drinking hurts me terribly and has for years..."
1. You are informing her, clearly, how you feel about something she is doing that affects you and the family.

"I am asking that you stop drinking forever."
2. You are asking , not demanding.

"If you can't stop drinking on your own, I would be willing to help you by seeking out treatment centers."
3. You are offering to help her.

"I want to have a happy, fulfilling marriage and that can only happen if you stop drinking."
4. You are telling her the standard for what you want from your marriage - a happy fulfilling marriage - and letting her know that you will not feel happy and fulfilled as long as she is drinking.

Your wording was probably more likely to result in conflict because it is confusing and comes across as manipulative - your words completely leave the door open for her to do whatever she wants, but you both know you're trying to get her to do something (stop drinking). Also, it's clear you're trying to avoid conflict and seems weak in a way that I don't think is attractive to most women.

I am an extremely conflict avoidant person and it definitely has not served me well over the years. But I have found magic and some strength in learning to word things the way Melody worded that. "This is what I am feeling." "This is what I need to be happily married." If she blows up, or you feel tempted to, definitely walk away, but don't back down or appear uncertain about your message. Be prepared with good wording in advance and if she twists things, just be a broken record with your reasonable request.

And it is simply a request. And, if the reality is that you are not willing to continue to be married to her under the current circumstances, she has a right to know that. You need to be CLEAR with her.

Sorry Mel, I see I skipped over this response, probably along with some others. Thanks for the continuing guidance.

You asked if I buy into it. I do. I envision how this program will make my M be the happy, romantic marriage I so desire. I do things like spend time on this forum to help others as well as continue to learn or keep my MB knowledge fresh. I listen to the radio show in spurts. Good weeks at least 2 or 3 programs a week. I reread articles especially ones that are linked in forum threads that feel relevant or are of interest to me.

It does come down to my habit of avoiding conflict. I've always been this way. Having confrontations is very stressful for me. The adrenaline floods into my system and I get very nervous, shaky and it's all I can do to keep the lid on any emotion (which is usually anger) that pops up. I typically email her to have these difficult conversations to avoid the confrontational situations.

And yes I do tend to try to feather in what I intend to say to her. Which then comes off, most likely, vague and unclear as you've said. My guess, I do things this way to avoid the confrontational feeling and also because I have empathy for my W and feel, to some extent, that I'm forcing my will onto her (which if I word it correctly (which I suck at) I know I'm not). She certainly communicates to me that she feels forced to change. My lack of wording the request correctly and the fact we really don't have a habit of focusing on providing extraordinary care to each other is the reason she feels forced. We aren't as integrated as we need to be.

I would love it if she was 100% on board. She's told me flat out she's not. Doesn't believe it is important that we spend tons of time together. Agrees we should spend time together having fun but there's no way she's giving up going back to see her sister and to take care of the horses she boards there.

Thanks AnyWife and thanks again Melody.

I feel as if I need to carry these around on index cards and pull them out every time the drinking conversation (and her negotiating) begins.

No response from her. She worked late and when she did arrive she was pretty cold. Which was expected.

She was communicative with the kids but pretty short with me. I chose not to talk about the elephant again. She has told me when faced with tough decisions she does need time to absorb and respond.

We were supposed to go grocery shopping together. We have our Xmas menu ready to go, just need the stuff. I asked if we were going to go last night. She said no she'd do it on her way home tonight. I said I'd love to do it together and that I could just meet her there. She declined, said she would take care of it.

Pretty upset, I'm sure , and needs to avoid me. This will probably go on for quite a few days, maybe weeks. I'll do what I can to stay positive and be pleasant to be around, but I don't think this is going to be a wonderful Holiday.

Didn't Dr Harley suggest an intervention but you held off on that since you had an agreement from her? Maybe it is time for that to happen now...

He said if she drank then that was the next step. So far she hasn't had a drink. She has insinuated that she was going to drink. I've since explained that I'm asking her to stop entirely forever.

Maybe I should email him the latest.

I think that would be good because my understanding of his advice was based on the premise that your wife agreed to quit when she hasn't done that at all. She's bring home alcohol and still trying to negotiate with you and being cold when you won't give in. She hasn't really agreed to quit at all.

Thx Suzie. I did send Dr Harley another email.

We made it through the In-Laws without a hitch. Others were drinking while MrsAlias did not. She was obviously not happy with me as she spent most of the night cold and avoiding me to some extent. The car ride home afterwards was very quiet.

We had a nice Xmas. Hunkered down at home all weekend and for the most part yesterday. Things are a little more normal between her and I. Less frigid. We spent some time alone, doing a puzzle, watching a movie.

Still no physical affection yet, no touching, hugging, etc. I'll be looking to move in that direction this week. Doing my part to find plenty of UA time together. We have nothing on the calendar unless she still plans on going out with that coworker later this week. Last night, when I asked if she had any plans this week she said she couldn't think of anything. It's possible she has decided to give up on that idea knowing I don't want her to drink.

She was in a great mood yesterday. I was so tempted to ask why.

Here is what Dr Harley provided in response to me last week.

A little off topic and yet it is not off topic.

Our eldest son was picked up for OWI Sunday before last. The night before he and a couple of hometown girls that go to his college went back to his college town to be with their friends. It is less than an hour away. He was drinking, obviously, said he slept some, woke up late as he had to work near home and was speeding to make up his lost time. Was pulled over and taken in where he blew under the legal limit for an adult but in WI there is a zero tolerance rule for underage drinking and driving. He was charged with OWI which carries the same penalties as an over-the-age over the legal limit driver.

I took this opportunity to discuss one on one with him the dangers of drinking. He's in college so I'm not na�ve to the things he's exposed to. I told him if he thinks he's adult enough to drink then he needs to make better decisions. Use wiser judgment. There was no need to go to this party when he knew he had to work early the next morning. "Someone could have been hurt or killed with your recklessness. What do you think your employer was going to do when he smelled alcohol? He would have fired you."

He will learn his lesson through inconvenience and be hit financially. He'll lose his license for 6 to 9 months and he will be responsible for any fees, fines, etc and the additional cost of insurance. His days of having extra money to go play are over for quite some time.

MrA, he will learn much more than that!! Is he being charged with a felony?

SO HAPPY that you are receiving support from Dr. Harley!! I know this is very hard for you but you are doing just great. Hang in there, because your reward will be great if you tough this out.

In WI a first offense OWI isn't even considered a misdemeanor let alone considered a felony. A first offense is considered a civil offense. However it is only considered that in WI and if he ever plans on moving this "ticket" will be on his record forever and it will have consequences for a very long time.

He'll be paying high-risk insurance for anywhere from 3 to 7 years and at 19 years of age the costs will be extremely pricey.

Is there a way he can get this expunged from his record entirely? Alcohol related offenses can be the kiss of death at most companies. My son had a very hard time getting a job at my company because of a possession of alcohol charge when he was 19. [class c misdemeanor] We couldn't even hire him until the full 7 years had passed because we go back 7 years.

Before that, he couldn't even get a job selling furniture at a furniture store or qualify to rent an apartment!

x2!

We are lining up a consult with a DUI Lawyer. Seeing he passed the field sobriety test we have a little bit of hope we can get the charges reduced. At this point in time we are not too familiar with the laws and what his options are. We have a couple of referrals from friends on good lawyers.