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Chalk, you need to do a better job of patching up the holes in your plan B. Letters like this must not slip through. He is playing with you. Whether it is about the school fees or that he is missing his children is not the point. You cannot be reading this kind of stuff.


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Originally Posted by living_well
Chalk, you need to do a better job of patching up the holes in your plan B. Letters like this must not slip through. He is playing with you. Whether it is about the school fees or that he is missing his children is not the point. You cannot be reading this kind of stuff.

Hi Living Well, the court ordered us to communicate directly (specifically removing an IM) after the hearing on access to kids last week. But the judgement only applies in this country, so when I move in 2 weeks time I can block him out again. I agree, this direct contact makes it really difficult for me to focus.



BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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Originally Posted by chalkncheese
[quote=living_well]But the judgement only applies in this country, so when I move in 2 weeks time I can block him out again. I agree, this direct contact makes it really difficult for me to focus.

But how will he know that you have someone else filtering out this stuff?

Last edited by living_well; 06/09/17 10:07 AM.

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Originally Posted by living_well
Originally Posted by chalkncheese
[quote=living_well]But the judgement only applies in this country, so when I move in 2 weeks time I can block him out again. I agree, this direct contact makes it really difficult for me to focus.

But how will he know that you have someone else filtering out this stuff?

Hmmm. Yes, so I could just auto-forward his messages to my IM you mean? That's a good idea...


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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Originally Posted by chalkncheese
Originally Posted by living_well
Originally Posted by chalkncheese
[quote=living_well]But the judgement only applies in this country, so when I move in 2 weeks time I can block him out again. I agree, this direct contact makes it really difficult for me to focus.

But how will he know that you have someone else filtering out this stuff?

Hmmm. Yes, so I could just auto-forward his messages to my IM you mean? That's a good idea...
Yes we call it a secret IM. The IM only sends you the pertinent information then your response is copied to the WH and they think it is coming from you and you're being protected from the garbage the WH sends you (like his last worthless message trying to gaslight you). We don't recommend this unless legally being forced to direct contact.

You can also set up that the IM checks this email account so they see all the messages first and the BS doesn't ever log into the email account at all.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Originally Posted by chalkncheese
Originally Posted by living_well
Originally Posted by chalkncheese
[quote=living_well]But the judgement only applies in this country, so when I move in 2 weeks time I can block him out again. I agree, this direct contact makes it really difficult for me to focus.

But how will he know that you have someone else filtering out this stuff?

Hmmm. Yes, so I could just auto-forward his messages to my IM you mean? That's a good idea...
Yes we call it a secret IM. The IM only sends you the pertinent information then your response is copied to the WH and they think it is coming from you and you're being protected from the garbage the WH sends you (like his last worthless message trying to gaslight you). We don't recommend this unless legally being forced to direct contact.

You can also set up that the IM checks this email account so they see all the messages first and the BS doesn't ever log into the email account at all.

Thank you! This is really a great idea. I'm so calm and happy when I don't hear anything from him. Life is just simple (as simple as it can be with four kids and a full time job...)


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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It really does mess with your head to read pretend affection/love from your WS, doesn't it? I am really down after the weekend thinking of what a pathetic lack of effort WH has put in to saving our family. Four months of plan B and he can only muster one email that is mostly self-pity because he's alone and feeling the pinch financially?!? This secret IM thing is definitely the way to go. Although I think I want him to try to come back if only so that I get a chance to tell him "no way!!!"


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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Chalk, I'm sorry but you are not in Plan B. You have continued contact in a million ways. I understand some of this is court ordered, but want to make sure you understand that this is not Plan B and will not help you the way a true Plan B will. I also don't want other posters reading to think that this is what Plan B looks like because it isn't.

Hopefully when you move you can go into Plan B and truly reap the benefits of it.

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Originally Posted by unwritten
Chalk, I'm sorry but you are not in Plan B. You have continued contact in a million ways. I understand some of this is court ordered, but want to make sure you understand that this is not Plan B and will not help you the way a true Plan B will. I also don't want other posters reading to think that this is what Plan B looks like because it isn't.

Hopefully when you move you can go into Plan B and truly reap the benefits of it.

I know frown. I was for a while until WH got all crazy towards the end of April, and then all the court stuff came. But will be back in Plan B properly when we move.


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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We are finally moving country - hurrah! Just some last minute complications to do with OC (I think Living Well predicted it a while ago). WH did not sort out OC's paperwork properly so he now does not have a visa for the neighbouring country where we are moving and, because I am not his legal parent or guardian, I am not able to sort out this problem myself.

WH has essentially left his child, who needs visas to travel everywhere, in a foreign country with someone (me) who has no legal authority over him, and has failed to make any arrangements for him. That is what happens when a fogged out wayward has responsibilities, I guess. WH is now acting as though he is doing me a favour by trying to fix the issue, somehow ignoring the fact that this is someone else's child that I am raising as a result of his appalling behaviour and that I am taking him with me to a new life because of my sense of love and responsibility towards an innocent child that his biological parents don't seem to share.

If the worst comes to the worst, WH will have to fly here and pick OC up and apply for a new visa for him from his home country. It would traumatise OC, but there is nothing I can do to prevent it. I will file for emergency parental rights if we manage to get OC into the country. I don't think WH will want to keep him, but it is difficult to predict what a crazy person will do.


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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Originally Posted by chalkncheese
If the worst comes to the worst, WH will have to fly here and pick OC up and apply for a new visa for him from his home country. It would traumatise OC, but there is nothing I can do to prevent it. I will file for emergency parental rights if we manage to get OC into the country. I don't think WH will want to keep him, but it is difficult to predict what a crazy person will do.


This is not the action of a crazy wayward, it is a targeted attack on the one vulnerable spot you have. Stay calm and strong. Tell WH that you will be delighted to leave OC with him.

Of course in the meantime you will quietly make plans and get great legal advice . . .


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Chalk,

See if there is a legal proceeding in your country that allows you to be declared OC's legal guardian on the theory your WH and the mother abandoned the child with you.

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Thanks Living Well and Brits Brat. It seems as though there is no option but for OC to travel back to his home country to apply for a new visa for the neighbouring country where we are going to be living. Even if I were his legal guardian, we would not be able to do the visa paperwork from this country where we are currently residing because my husband has now left and we don't have a valid reason for living here (we can stay here legally, but we can't apply for visas from here because we need someone with a work permit in order to do that. I work in the neighbouring country so don't have a work permit here).

It is now a question of hoping that WH will do the visa paperwork and send OC back to me and his siblings once we have moved. I think he will. No matter how much he wants to hurt me, surely he won't keep OC away from his brothers and sister now that they are all so close and happy?


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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All these problems with visas and passports have meant I am in more or less constant contact with WH. It is extremely stressful, even though he is far less crazy than he was when he was here.

It has also become clear to me that my attempts at Plan B before now gave WH the impression that he was on holiday from marriage. He is so totally confident that he is the most desirable man on the planet, he thinks he just has to wait it out while I get over my emotions and then ask him to come back. He told me yesterday he had planned to "give me a year" to get over it and then we will all move on with our lives as a family. He thinks he is on a one year holiday! It seems that even if I am not speaking to him, the fact that he can tell people that I am his wife and we have four children, and show them our photos, fills a lot of emotional needs for him because people look at him with respect and admiration because of the status I bring him. He also tells people he is "sacrificing for the family" by working alone in another country which brings wholly undeserved additional respect from others.

It is really really galling to see, but I guess that is why I desperately need to be back in Plan B.

Should I send a new plan B letter when I move? Or just stop the direct communication as soon as it is feasible?


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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Can't this contact all go through your IM?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Can't this contact all go through your IM?

Hi BrainHurts, not at the moment because WH got a court order from the children's court to ensure that I communicate with him directly on matters relating to the children. It is only valid as long as we are in this country though.


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 20,348
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Originally Posted by chalkncheese
Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Can't this contact all go through your IM?

Hi BrainHurts, not at the moment because WH got a court order from the children's court to ensure that I communicate with him directly on matters relating to the children. It is only valid as long as we are in this country though.
Is the contact trough email?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Originally Posted by chalkncheese
Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Can't this contact all go through your IM?

Hi BrainHurts, not at the moment because WH got a court order from the children's court to ensure that I communicate with him directly on matters relating to the children. It is only valid as long as we are in this country though.
Is the contact trough email?

Hi BrainHurts, through sms at the moment. It is things that need immediate answers eg, if I am at the high commission and they need a document from WH, I have to ask him then and there.

He is trying to make OC travel to his home country ALONE. A 6 year old!! It is as if he is thinking about moving a bag not a human being. It is not even a direct flight. I am appalled at the total and utter lack of effort he makes for anyone. How difficult is it to buy a plane ticket and come and pick OC up himself? He is rolling in money, so finances are not an issue. He just does not even consider the option of making effort himself for his child. It is the same thing with his parents. His father had a stroke three weeks ago. And while WH was eager to jump on a plane to come here to abuse me through courts, he has not even tried to go and see his father (who lives in the same country as him) whom he claims to love and respect so much that tears come into his eyes when he talks of him. His parents would never complain because they don't realise the cost of a plane ticket is peanuts to him. But I see it. And I am totally disgusted.


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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Originally Posted by chalkncheese
He is trying to make OC travel to his home country ALONE. A 6 year old!! It is as if he is thinking about moving a bag not a human being. It is not even a direct flight. I am appalled at the total and utter lack of effort he makes for anyone.


I am sure that you are now understanding that you enabled this by being his in-house problem solver. So stop solving his problems for him! What about giving him a deadline? Say that OC will be arriving on his doorstep on xyz date unless he has sorted out the visa by then.

Of course you will need to be able to deliver on this threat. You may need to employ someone to escort OC to him. He is so not going to want that to happen.


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Originally Posted by living_well
Originally Posted by chalkncheese
He is trying to make OC travel to his home country ALONE. A 6 year old!! It is as if he is thinking about moving a bag not a human being. It is not even a direct flight. I am appalled at the total and utter lack of effort he makes for anyone.


I am sure that you are now understanding that you enabled this by being his in-house problem solver. So stop solving his problems for him! What about giving him a deadline? Say that OC will be arriving on his doorstep on xyz date unless he has sorted out the visa by then.

Of course you will need to be able to deliver on this threat. You may need to employ someone to escort OC to him. He is so not going to want that to happen.

I am discovering that I have enabled SO MUCH! It is such an eye opener. And yes I think you are right that I need to set and enforce really firm boundaries now to stop!

I am trying. But he is now pushing back with all this rubbish about how I have never respected him, that I want to show everyone that I wear the pants in our house, that I am telling him what to do, etc. Apparently, that is what the court thing was about too: it was all about me telling him if he told me he was coming at 10am to pick up the children, I said he must come at that time or forfeit the visit altogether.

I will stop this behaviour right now. I mean, I will stop my enabling behaviour and stop listening to him pushing back against my boundaries.

Last edited by chalkncheese; 06/22/17 07:05 AM. Reason: clarity

BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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