My wife told me a few months ago she does not think we can work past the problems we have had. I don't see anything that we have had an issue is close to big enough to split up. Are there problems, sure but nothing super major and we just do not fight much... We have both not been abusive, to my knowledge neither of has cheated (I know i have not) and we both do a lot with the kids/house. To me it feels like we just haven't had the best communication and have focused too much on other things outside of US. She gave me the whole i love you but im not in love with you. I am not attracted to you, I want to be happy etc. etc.

Since then we haven't really had many talks other than when she will tell me that she wants a dissolution or something along those lines. During them she pretty much just tells me how bad of a person I am and brings up things from way in the past. I do not want to split up in any way but I also haven't fought her. I initially did my share of pleading that it can work if we try, we haven't tried to fix it and that the things she wants to change I am willing to change my end. I setup a marriage counselor for us to go to and she agreed to go, but only went once and then said it made things worse. I have continued to go myself to work on myself and the things I can control. As much as i can i give her space (cant give her more as were still living together) and don't complain when she wants to go do something, just say ok.

What is the wait? Is she actually considering staying when nothing she says or does shows otherwise. Or is she just setting up all the things she needs to move on? When I attempt to bring something up she doesn't want to talk. If I even suggest nothing is going to change if she isn't trying on her end she tells me she is and is trying to figure things out on her end. Just because I can not see what she is trying or that its not immediately better does not mean she's not trying. How long do I live in this state of not knowing? Is this normal for her to just be in this state of nothing? We aren't sleeping in the same room, do not hold hands, kiss, and some days not even say goodbye. If I try to initiate these things like asking how her day is going I just get ignored most times or if in person i get rolled eyes and barely a response? Rarely during the day does she talk to me about anything other than the kids. She is still asking me to do things for her, which i do not mind doing at all. I know most of these are signs she has moved on or that there is no love left so what now?

To be honest Im just ready to move forward with my life, I want that to be with her and do not want to be the one to begin some type of divorce/dissolution but it almost feels like that is the only wait. Either to push me so far that i am the bad guy or that maybe she's just getting all her ducks in a row before finally dropping the bomb on me. It just feels like I'm trying to get to a point A (just a point where we begin working on this not that its better) with a huge wall surrounding it and keep walking around it over and over with no end in sight. Everyday is a struggle to not try and talk to her about us and or what our future is but I do not so i can give her whatever space she needs.

My friend - she's having an affair.

What is a "dissolution"? How is it different from divorce?

Welcome to MB.

Maybe Im being naïve or oblivious to it but what would she tell me she wants a dissolution (divorce) if she's having an affair? Wouldn't someone in that situation just want to keep status quo and not bring attention that could bring that out? She rarely goes anywhere outside of work and home, so I feel like at best I guess she could be emotionally with someone. Could you elaborate why you might feel that is the case?

Dissolution is basically a civil divorce where you don't have to go to court. You agree on all aspects of the divorce is basically what it comes down to.

Are you in a civil partnership? Is it a same sex partnership, or opposite sex?

Opposite sex with me being the male and her female. I would say we are pretty civil. We aren't fighting, just not communication as much as we used to and no affection what so ever atm. We do still talk about the kids, she doesn't ignore me but its like she put up a forced wall to not communicate with me.

Maybe that is to try and move on or convince her that moving on is right. I feel like she is looking for reassurance that leaving is the right decision and the fact that Im so willing to work on things and actively trying to do whatever i can that it makes her have doubts.

You misunderstand - by "civil partnership" I meant the legal relationship that is available in some countries. Civil partnerships were normally introduced for same-sex couples who were not allowed to marry. In my country, opposite-sex couples can now get them. You would know if you were in a civil partnership - there would have been a legal ceremony and a document.

I still don't understand what is meant by "dissolution". I've been posting on this forum for a long time, and it's the first time I've come across that term. If people are legally married, they have to go to court to get a legal divorce. I've never come across a legal marriage that could be dissolved with a "civil divorce".

Are you legally married?

Yes, we are legally married. I would say for the ease of understanding lets just consider it a divorce, not a dissolution. At the end of the day they serve the same purpose.

A dissolution is what you get at the end of divorce. Your marriage is officially dissolved the day the judge signs the divorce decree. A certificate of dissolution will be issued by the state, which is a legal document providing proof that your marriage has ended (similar to the way a marriage certificate shows you are married).

All divorces are civil actions. If by 'civil' you mean that you will do this on friendly terms; don't be too disappointed when it does not work out that way although a spouse having an affair will sometimes agree to terms that would ordinarily make no sense such as giving full custody of the children to the other parent.

You are in good hands with Sugar Cane. Follow her guidance and you stand a good chance of saving this marriage if you want to.

But living_well, if all divorces are civil actions (and I realise that this is true - I'm not contesting what you said), and if a dissolution is what you get at the end of divorce, what did he mean by this?

That does not sound alike a divorce to me.

I think what he means is that they will negotiate a settlement between themselves. Perhaps he does not realise that this still has to go in front of a judge, you cannot just file on line with minor children.

Yes, I understand it needs to go in front of a judge. From my understanding it was just like what you said. Either way you look at it we will be legally divorced at the end if she goes that route.

Thanks, l_w. That makes things a lot clearer.

TroubledMarriage, the reason I think she's having an affair is because, as Dr Harley says, deserted spouses have later found undiscovered affairs so often that when one spouse suddenly announces that they want to separate, that's the first thing that he, and we on the forum, think about.

I don't know if you have read around this forum very much, but a good place to start is in the forum MarriageBuilders 101. Look for threads that have been moved - signified by an arrow. Read those threads that have moved to the forum SurvivinganAffair. You'll find that when the poster first came here, we immediately diagnosed an affair. They refuted that. We told them to snoop. Either they resisted but found out anyway, or they snooped and - bingo.

There are numerous clues, such as the inexplicability of it all. A wife says she has been unhappy for a long time but resists looking into ways to repair the marriage. Your wife went to counselling once and bailed. Most women will not walk out on a marriage when they know that the father of their kids is the best person to be with (which he is - absent abuse or serious neglect). They will not put themselves on the open market knowing how hard it is for a woman to find a man who will love them and their kids. They know how often second marriages fail. They don't just walk away and hurt their own kids.

Those things, and the fact that your wife said these things:

"I love you but I'm not in love with you" is said by the wife who has a new point of comparison. It means she is in love with someone else.

She is not in a position to jump just yet. Perhaps he is married and he is prevaricating about leaving his wife. Perhaps he has blown smoke and flattered her into thinking he can't live without her, and now she has dropped the bomb on him about leaving her husband, he knows darn well that he does not want to take on her and her kids - he never did.

You need to snoop and find out who this rat is.

And don't listen to living_well's kind words; I'm actually rubbish at saving marriages when there is an affair involved. I don't have the dedication to take people through the steps. You'll need a team of people to help you with exposure, using Facebook, writing to HR and a ton of other things. But the one thing I can help with is telling you she is having an affair. I'm so sorry.

Thank you for explaining. That helps me understand where you are coming from by saying it like that. I don't want to believe that's the case but what I believe and what it is are 2 different things at times.

So to expand: since she has told you she wants to leave, she does not want to keep the status quo. It's true that she does not want the affair to come out. She wants to separate from you "amicably" and get a civilised "dissolution" - which is likely to be favourable to her, and will not drag her name through the mud - and build her relationship, seeing him in total secrecy when the kids are with you. In a year's time, lo and behold, she'll introduce her brand-new boyfriend to her kids and her parents, and you'll never know that this was an affair - that is her plan.

You say that she rarely goes anywhere outside of work and home. Well, there's a clue: could it be someone at work? And as for at home: we've had many a married woman start an affair online with her high-school boyfriend, or anyone at all that she met online. What do you know about what she does online?

Ask yourself, if she were definitely having an affair, how she would be able to do it? - and follow that avenue. You need to spy on her digital communications - and you need to keep your poker face and not let her know that you suspect a thing. If she knows you are looking for evidence, she'll take the affair underground and you'll have the devil of a time finding out anything at all.

How long have you been married? Do you have any children? If so, what are their ages?

And I agree, your WW is having an affair.

Do you have access to her phone?

15 years married, 20 together.

Kids 5,8,13

No access to her phone and I would rather leave her than invade her privacy in that manner. My belief is even married people deserve reasonable privacy, right or wrong that is just what I feel. If I have to go to a point where I'm looking at her phone for reassurance or proof then it's not something worth saving. My state doesn't care about infidelity, that just comes out as incompatible. I'm not saying your both not right but I'm saying that I'll look for any other sign first. Like what's is already pointed out. I also know that basically conflicts asking for advice on here but I have to draw the line somewhere.

What you don’t seem to understand, is that if you want to save your marriage you need to know what is going on. If you don’t know what the problem is, then how do you fix it? If there is an affair Dr. Harley has a path to try and recover your marriage.

Why not prove to us that there isn’t an affair?

Please read SNOOPING: IS IT WRONG? OR, IS IT THE RIGHT THING TO DO IN MARRIAGE?

I remember how snooping felt distasteful but for me it ave me information I needed so I could stop and I told him later and he fully understood.

For you it can help you get information that can keep someone harmful away from your kids. When you read the stories here the men that women bring around their children can be men you would want to make sure are not around your children and we can help you protect them. The thing about your wife that worries me is how checked out or detached she seems. I’ve been here for many years and I used to be naive and think well maybe she’s just depressed and needs more help with the kids and I hope it could be so simple for you that the four four hour dates a week articles can patch you up right quick. But it’s so sad when folks come back and report no they are more made and then put the VAR in the car and get sad news about their lives. I hope she responds well to the date nights and the VAR turns up things that give you hope like she’s reaching for help from family members that support your marriage and not someone preying on her. I hope you find what you need here to inspire you to fight for a marriage that brings you happiness for a lifetime.