I have been supporting my wife thru her mental illness, unknown to me she's been having an EA with a man 25-30 years her senior.

She's told me he's what she wants, he's what she needs, they're getting a flat together and they're going to be together.

I'm destroyed, kids are destroyed everythings a mess.

Bull**** to meeting her EN's she's just out of it.

Neil.

Seek out an attorney immediately to protect your children and yourself. Financial considerations are paramount for your children at this junture.
Discuss all of the options available to you and decide after counseling what you really want.
I wish you luck.

Hi Neil,

OMG!!!!!!!how terrible. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

You have shown so much strength in the past months and I have always followed your story. I'm really feeling with you, gosh...........

Neil, I know that this situation is very difficult for you as you always tried your best and believe me don't feel destroyed for what she is doing. Have trust in yourself as your wife is showing that she doesn't know what she wants.

I can feel the pain that you are going through and mostly I can understand how confused you must feel. After all that you have written, your wife has alot of problems and she is running from them instead of facing them.
You know her and you know that these problems will not just go away. They will not just disappear because she is thinking this.
The problems will still be there even if she thinks that OM is the solution.

No matter how bad you feel, don't take this personally. I know this might sound stupid and like babble. But your wife is running from her problems and nothing else!!!!!!!!!
It might now help you but think: Do you truely believe that these problems are just going to disappear??? Do you truely believe that OM is aware about her problems and what he is heading for???
Do you believe that OM can do "more" than what you have done?????????

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She's told me he's what she wants, he's what she needs, they're getting a flat together and they're going to be
together. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What has she told you before??? To me this is definate "fog" babble and I don't think that she really knows what she wants.
She might want to "avoid" anything that has to do with her problems. This might make her feel safe that OM doesn't know her in her "lowest" times.
He's getting the story from one side and as I have once told you, I don't believe that many people would be able to give as much as you have.

You were there for her in her "darkest" days and she told you this. Believe me, this is true!!!
You feel destroyed and I understand why you feel this. You don't know what to believe, but have trust in yourself and for what you have lived. It was a good thing and you showed what a wonderful guy you are.

You never gave up and you have all reasons to be prowd of yourself. Your wife really needs HELP. You know that!!!!! Don't listen to her words. Don't let this destroy you. You are living reality and you children need you!
Try to calm down and concentrate on what you have now. Your beautiful kids and see it in their reactions what a great guy you are.

I hope this will help you abit. If you need help there are many here in MB'S that will help you through this difficult time and I'm sure you will get some good advice.

take care of yourself Neil

bb

I am assuming I should immediately go to a solicitor and discuss separation. I want this to be as amicable as possible but now I am frightened about losing my home and children.

I am selfemployed so have to work or I dont get paid. The OM2 is threatening me if I *hassle* my wife so I am waiting for the Police to arrive to take a statement.

My Mum is on her way to help. She is so messed up with abuse and everything, I already know she has been lying and deceiving OM2 and she is still cutting herself.

I am right now trying to get thru each hour.

Neil.

She has visited and is in a terrible, terrible state. She is very confused, desperate and low. She has asked me not to divorce, it's not what she wants, she wants space.

I have agreed to give her some £3000 for her to get a flat and get some space. This may be a bad move but I can't see this happen to her, I love her too much.

I have given her the paid car so she can travel around.

I have made a note of all this and she has signed it all. I am hoping that I can see a solicitor tomorrow to see legally what I should do. Its UK law so may be different than USA law.

Anyone have any thoughts?

Neil.

Hi Neil.

I'm so sorry your going thru this horrible crap, but have you and your children started counseling?

If you know for a fact that she is still engagin in self-mutilation, and have the evidence to prove it, could you go to court to have her hospitalized?

I wholeheartedly support the idea of you seeking legal counsel on how to protect yourself and your children from her self-destructive behavior. You do not want to be in a situation where you could lose your home and children to her when it could possible to avoid it.

Why not let OM2 support her? If there is one great way to inject a toxic dose of reality into the fantasy that is an affair, is to let the OP fulfill all her EN's. If you give her financial support, the OM2 will also be a beneficiary and will have no incentive to leave her.

God bless you and your family.

Thanks TooMuch,

Yes I will going back into Counselling. My girls aren't getting any help at all really and are up and down. Sometimes they are laughing the next crying their eyes out.

I have to focus on them right now because they are so important to me. My world is upside down.

Neil.

I was married to a woman that became so addicted to sex with other men that she did not 'give a f**k'(her words, not mine) about the pain she inflicted upon our daughters and myself. I finally had to accept the fact that I could not force her to do the right thing, and took my daughters and myself away from the unhealthy environment we were exposed to by living with her. I filed for divorce, and won custody of our daughters thanks to all the evidence I had regarding her horribly negligent behavior. My divorce was finalized two years ago, and my daughters are doing much better, thanks to counseling, I'm in a new relationship with a woman who is a lady in the truest sense of the word, and to which I'm engaged to. As for my xWW is concerned, she finally crashed and burned and has been going thru therapy for her addiction, and is finally on her way to coming back to the human race and slowly becoming a responsable mother.

So you see Porsche S, even in the worst scenarios, there is always hope for a better life with or without our WW's.

I'm so torn though.

It's all out of my control. I have just to sit back and watch this. I tell you if this was a movie you would be going "huh just as if..." right now.

She came back to collect some bed linen, she said she is not having an EA and you know I think I'm believing it. She is such a mess. When it was time for her to go, she held onto me and was crying and crying. "Please dont divorce me, please dont throw away my wedding rings, please dont trash our photos, I need some space to get my head straight..." this is what I'm listening to.

It just sounds so messed up. She's not interested in sex. In fact sex (abuse or otherwise) is the root of the problem.

How does it sound. Am I doing the right things?

Neil.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Porsche S:
<strong>I'm so torn though.

It's all out of my control. I have just to sit back and watch this. I tell you if this was a movie you would be going "huh just as if..." right now.

She came back to collect some bed linen, she said she is not having an EA and you know I think I'm believing it. She is such a mess. When it was time for her to go, she held onto me and was crying and crying. "Please dont divorce me, please dont throw away my wedding rings, please dont trash our photos, I need some space to get my head straight..." this is what I'm listening to.

It just sounds so messed up. She's not interested in sex. In fact sex (abuse or otherwise) is the root of the problem.

How does it sound. Am I doing the right things?

Neil.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Your doing well as far as not love busting her.

She doesn't want you to divorce her because she is not so sure that her R with OM2 will work out and she needs to know that you will be there waiting for her in case she decides she wants to come back.

As far as the sex is concerned, I would not beleive her because she will be living with him and OM2 would most certainly dump her if she didn't put out for him. You and I are men, and we know very well that one of the things we men want in an intimate relationship with a woman is sex. Plus if she truly is 'in love' with the scumbag, she'll more than likely give herself to him sexually. Sorry to burst your bubble but you know that I'm probably right.

You are acting rational and that is always the right thing to do but I do have an issue of you supporting her financially. I personally would not and I would let OM2 support her financially because it will be a dose of reality that he might not be too happy to deal with in the long run. If she asks you why you won't support her financially, you can just tell her that you need the money for therapy for the girls and yourself to weather this latest crisis. Without love busting her, she needs to know what her behavior is doing to not only you but to the children as well.

Whatever happens we're here for you.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by TooMuchCoffeeMan:
<strong>[QUOTE]She doesn't want you to divorce her because she is not so sure that her R with OM2 will work out and she needs to know that you will be there waiting for her in case she decides she wants to come back.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"></strong>
So are you saying I should not be?

<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As far as the sex is concerned, I would not beleive her because she will be living with him and OM2 would most certainly dump her if she didn't put out for him.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"></strong>
Well it's all a bit more messed up than that. She sees him as a surrogate father. She is the broken child. He is the "parent". She is not in love with him, she is saying that now, she is saying that I have misinterpreted the feelings. She says she doesnt love him but he gives her friendship, a shoulder to cry on and supports her when she is low (all things I do) but asks nothing of her. My view is that is probablythe case right now but agree with you that his agenda is not what she thinks and is as you have said.

<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Plus if she truly is 'in love' with the scumbag, she'll more than likely give herself to him sexually.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"></strong>She has never actually said she loves him. In fact she is now saying that she cannot say that she does not love me. You see it is changing literally by the hour.

<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I do have an issue of you supporting her financially. I personally would not and I would let OM2 support her financially because it will be a dose of reality that he might not be too happy to deal with in the long run.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I have given her enough to get a place admittedly with him for probably two months. I made her sign a receipt as proof.

Neil

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by TooMuchCoffeeMan:
She doesn't want you to divorce her because she is not so sure that her R with OM2 will work out and she needs to know that you will be there waiting for her in case she decides she wants to come back.

Originally posted by Porsche S:<strong>
So are you saying I should not be?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No not at all, I was just stating a probable fact. Only you can decide whether you should be there for her or not. Your love for her is unquestionable, but will it survive for a possible recovery? Again only you know.

But do seek counseling for your girls because by your own admission they have been destroyed just like you have by your WW's latest development.

Other things to add to the mess:

She hasn't taken her Anti-Ds for almost 5 days. I think she is taking them now.

She has lied to OM2 about cutting herself, and he is completely unaware of the severity of her illness <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

She has really only known him properly for 8 weeks.

Her brother is trying to get her to move in with him - which I would be so happy with.

She has to hold a job down monday to friday.

Thankfully my mum has come down and "will stay as long as it takes" so I'm not alone.

I made her leave the house keys, car keys (although I later gave her the small car), and her wedding rings <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> that was probably a bad move.

Should I box up her stuff? Should I put away the things that are hers? They remind me of her so much.

Neil.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by blondblossom:
<strong>Do you truely believe that these problems are just going to disappear??? Do you truely believe that OM is aware about her problems and what he is heading for???
Do you believe that OM can do "more" than what you have done??</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't think her problems will go. In fact they will be magnified without my support, and the childrens support <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>What has she told you before??? To me this is definate "fog" babble and I don't think that she really knows what she wants.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She has said before she can't see life without me ,that I am her rock etc. She is very confused. She holds me and doesn't let me go. She kisses me and cries.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>She might want to "avoid" anything that has to do with her problems. This might make her feel safe that OM doesn't know her in her "lowest" times.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He doesn't know the half of it and some of what she has said is false.

Thanks BB Neil.

I've followed your story off and on for the past 3 months. I want to add the following:

-your wife appears to be expertly manipulating this situation and you play along with it. You need some stricter boundaries. Her behaviour is controlling everyone and making them miserable...totally unacceptable!
-you have done everything you could possibly do to make your marriage work. No one could say otherwise.
-your wife is very ill, you cannot make her better or 'save' her. You can only support her recovery.
-your wife has to want to recover and be willing to do what it takes. She is not able to do that right now.
-your children must be your priority right now, to the exclusion of your wife. You can help your children at this point, your wife is a lost cause at the moment.
-you really need to see a lawyer about this. I'd hate for you to go through more with her than is necessary.
-you must prepare yourself for the fact the M may end (or it may not). Either way, you must build a support network, make new friends, look after yourself properly.
-emotionally, you must start breaking away from her.

I cannot believe it Neil. How horrible. I feel ridiculous for trying to give you so much hope about your situation.

All I can say is to protect your children, your finances and try to distance yourself from her. She is so fragile but how much are you responsible for? You don't know what she says is true and it changes from one minute to the next. I doubt that physical infidelity is not involved or at least on the horizon. OM2 is too invested.

Had another person entered my husband's life I would have gone to Plan B for certain and put his family in charge of him and his mental health. I would suggest an additional step of letting her health care providers know about the continued cutting.

You really need to think of the girls and keep her visitation very controlled and monitored. This is truly traumatic for all of you and although she is dealing with more than the usual fog, this is still her mess. You can only do so much and then let go, she can't be helped until she is ready. You are enabling her to run from her problems as she runs back and forth between you and OM, all the while confusing and destroying these little one's stability and dreams as well as their view of their mother.

If she ever "gets it together" they are going to have a great deal of trouble trusting her. You have to protect their love for her as well as your love for her.

You might want to give OM2 some instructions if she does move in with him, such as removing all razors, etc. If he wants her, he should know what he has to do to take care of her.

I know I am coming on strong but we've watched you be tortured so long, and I've been in similiar shoes. I had to balance the children's welfare with the hope of saving my marriage. It is not an easy call to make but you are over the line, don't you think? I hope that long-term the two of you can work this out and she gets better but the priority now is protecting the girls.
Take care of yourself. Childhood abuse is not an excuse for what she is doing to her own children, nor you.
God Bless.

MGM, and Nurse B, and TooMuch and Bryan thank you for your support. I have to go to sleep now it's 12:15am in the UK and I am emotionally drained.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by mgm:
<strong>-your wife appears to be expertly manipulating this situation and you play along with it. You need some stricter boundaries. Her behaviour is controlling everyone and making them miserable...totally unacceptable!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I will hopefully see a solicitor in the morning to find out what to do. I am so unclear and have so much to sort out. It's like a massive chaotic time.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>-you have done everything you could possibly do to make your marriage work. No one could say otherwise.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thankyou I just wish she would see it. Of course he's poisoning her mind about this and has been verbally abusive but now that has been reported to the Police. I don't want him around my kids. I don't know him from Jack. He could be manpulating my wife for all I know.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>-your wife is very ill, you cannot make her better or 'save' her. You can only support her recovery.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">In what regard? I have been supporting her recovery as best I can. What more can I do?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>-your wife has to want to recover and be willing to do what it takes. She is not able to do that right now.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't know if we "know" what it takes. We seem to be getting very little support from her Doctors.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>-your children must be your priority right now, to the exclusion of your wife. You can help your children at this point, your wife is a lost cause at the moment.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know I have to do this. I am hoping I can see a solicitor tomorrow and that he/she will give me some guidance and an element of control. I hope also that pushing ahead with this will act as a warning shot to my Wife.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>-you must prepare yourself for the fact the M may end (or it may not). Either way, you must build a support network, make new friends, look after yourself properly.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I have found a Carers Project Team that will support me and my kids. They look after the Carers of people who are ill. I don't know if they will support me if she is not here though.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>-emotionally, you must start breaking away from her.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Are you meaning a proper Plan B? I do not want her to not see our children but it is so hard I just want her back. And she collapsed earlier on the table and cried "I just want it all back to normal", I just cant stand this pain or seeing her like this. We have been thru so much together, I have seen her do things to herself that no Husband should see. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy.

Neil.

Neil,

I think you really need to listen to Coffeeman carefully. This is NOT something that MB can fix. It is NOT something you can fix. Your support is simply enabling her to do what she wants including going off her meds. Your W has very deep and serious issues and no one in your family or hers can fix it.

You said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I don't think her problems will go. In fact they will be magnified without my support, and the childrens support </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Neil, from this end of the telescope I think you are wrong. The support you and kids have given have enabled her to refuse care and to walk away from that she has agreed to receive.

I know you love the woman you married but she isn't there right now. Definitely, see the soliciter. She is very sick but she is not stupid and she is using you as a narcotic. When she gets strung out some comes home for a hit or two and then heads out again. She doesn't want you to leave, but she doesn't want to stay either. She is constantly looking for someone else.

You may know what has caused her issues, and you may even understand those causes, but you clearly can do nothing to overcome her issues. Your love nor the love of your children cannot heal or help her until she takes control of her life. Until she hits bottom that won't happen. Given her tendency for self - inflicted damage, she really needs to be under the care of a physician and inpatient care. I know she was before, but clearly that didn't get the job done.

Neil, I really don't know what to tell you,but to back off, protect your children, yourself, and see if her relatives can get her some help. You cannot fix this.

I am so sorry and it is my hope that God Blesses you and your family,

JL

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>see if her relatives can get her some help. You cannot fix this.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">They are the abusers <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> OM2 is the surrogate father figure she feels she needs.

I dont have time now. Will post later. I am trying to get to a solicitor, to the bank, my C and also my Doctor. Neil.

Neil,
By supporting her recovery I meant that should she ever get to that place (recovery path) then, and only then, can you be there for her. She Is NOT in recovery now, she is spiralling down to the bottom. Don't let her take yourself and the kids with her to the bottom.

The support network you have started for yourself is a good beginning! Are there 'single parent support groups' where you are? They are a good resource.

Don't see a lawyer to use it as a warning to WW, use the lawyer to protect yourself and your kids. The lawyer isn't there to scare your wife, the lawyer is there to protect you. I know you want her back...but, I suspect you want the woman you married or a close approximation and not this travesty she has become.

Breaking away (my definition) isn't about plan A or B, maybe a plan B, in a sense <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> . It's about turning your attention/focus away from WW and towards yourself and your kids. It's about rearranging your priorities so WW is at the bottom of the list. It's about doing what's right for you and the kids and not factoring WW's needs into the equation. It's about deciding not to let one 'sick' individual control your life. It's about taking care of your needs for a change and doing what you need to do to get to a better place yourself. Finally, it's about preparing to move on with your life with or without her.

<small>[ September 09, 2002, 10:11 AM: Message edited by: mgm ]</small>