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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He's trying to bait me into an argument or a crying bender </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Don't fall for it! He will use it to 'justify' <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> what he is doing.

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Yeah I know my W visits this site and I know what screen name she visits under. Spying is good it encourages trust!

<small>[ July 30, 2003, 12:04 AM: Message edited by: cold ]</small>

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Hello!!

I am so sorry to hear the turn of events. Looks like you got some great help from some great people. Sounds like you are doing as well as can be expected. Right now I don't have any thing to add. It seems that all of the topics have been addressed.

You have not updated here is a bit.. am concerned about how you are doing.

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Z,

I talked to her briefly before she went to sleep. She's in shock right now, but doing as well as she can. She's been really blindsided by this, but is holding up. She does seem focused about what she is doing, but it's mechanical right now for her. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Thanks for stopping by.....I'm sure she'll need some help tomorrow, so if you could peek in with your wisdom, I'm sure she would appreciate it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

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Star,

Thanks for the update. I can only imagine her frame of mind. It hurts to even think of it.

I will check back in in the morning.

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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by cold:
<strong>Yeah I know my W visits this site and I know what screen name she visits under. Spying is good it encourages trust!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Actually, I don't see it as 'spying'--it's considered being totally open and honest in your marriage to have access to all e-mail's and such..

and It's already apparent...trust has been broken in the relationship...by not openly and willingly giving access to these things..

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<small>[ October 12, 2003, 11:49 AM: Message edited by: *LULU* ]</small>

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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Yeah I know my W visits this site and I know what screen name she visits under. Spying is good it encourages trust!
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think spying is good, and I DO believe it inspires trust. Of course, I've only ever heard a WS call it spying.

Trust is earned. Without honesty and openness you have no trust. Trust is built on truth. You should not trust someone unless they repeatedly tell you a verifiable truths. What someone tells you needs verification. Without verifying someone's word, how are you to know that they are telling the truth? Without knowing for certain that they are telling the truth, how does one build trust?

Here are some thoughts from Dr. Harley:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> So one of the most common clues of an affair is an unwillingness to let a spouse investigate all aspects of life...Difficulty in getting a spouse to talk about events of the day can be a sign of trying to hide the second life. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> One of the most common smoke-screens used by unfaithful spouses is to express shock that their spouse would be so distrusting as to ask questions about their secret second life. They try to make it seem as if such questions are an affront to their dignity, and a sign of incredible disrespect. They figure that the best defense is a good offense, and so they try to make their spouses feel guilty about asking too many questions. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I am a firm believer in letting each spouse do as much snooping around as they want. Nothing should be kept secret in marriage, and no questions should be left unanswered. If a spouse objects to such scrutiny, what might he or she be hiding? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Dishonesty is really a method to force your spouse to deal with a situation that you know that they would not deal with. You control their reaction by not letting them know the truth. You can, therefore, force upon them a situation that hurts them because they do not know about it. The dishonest spouse usually justifies this by saying they are protecting the other spouse. 'It would just hurt her'...in reality it is not motivated by protection. If the dishonest spouse were motivated by protection, they would not have done the act (in this case infidelity) that caused the hurt in the first place.

<small>[ July 30, 2003, 10:00 AM: Message edited by: *Takola* ]</small>

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LuLu here's something important from Dr Harley that I beleive you should read and give serious consideration:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">"Since plan B (and plan A, for that matter), is extremely stressful for the betrayed spouse, I usually recommend that he or she ask a physician to prescribe anti-depressant medication to be taken throughout the crisis. This not only greatly reduces the suffering of the betrayed spouse, but it also helps keep a clear head at a time when patience and wise decisions are crucial. Anti-depressant medication does not numb the betrayed spouse to the crisis, it actually helps raise him or her above emotional reactions that would otherwise prevent clear-headed thinking. Why suffer and and make poor choices when anti-depressant medication can help ease your pain and improve your concentration in this time of unprecedented crisis? "</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You need to take care of your total health (physical,emotional, mental) not only for your sake but for your child's as well, and taking anti-depressants is one way to do that.

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Hey Lulu.... just letting you know I'm around. I have to actually do some work today, but I'll check in as I can. Let me know what I can do for you. Hugs, chica.

Cold.... I'm so sorry you find yourself in this place. It's no fun from either side, and unfortunately the only way out is painful no matter how you do it. I won't lecture, I know it's not helpful (I save that for those who ask for it... and then look out <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ) but I do want you to know that my thoughts are with both of you.

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<small>[ October 12, 2003, 11:50 AM: Message edited by: *LULU* ]</small>

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<small>[ October 12, 2003, 11:40 AM: Message edited by: *LULU* ]</small>

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I am so sorry that this is happening to you. I've been there, it feels awful. My H and I were separated a couple of different times. The first time was for 4 months. His A lasted on and off for 4 yrs. It finally ran it's course ending in mid-98. Then last year he started an EA that turned PA with another woman. I say all this to let you know even if saving the marriage seems hopeless now, it isn't necessarily over yet. Yes, it could proceed rapidly towards divorce. I would still do all I could to stall separation and divorce if I were you. Follow all the great advice you've been given here. Have you reached the OW's H yet? When I told our OW's H he was out of state hunting. I called his cell phone when he was in a tree. He came home immediately. Unfortunately, he threw in the towel too soon and went immediately to start divorce proceedings. Do you know if they have children? Do what you can to take care of yourself. I used to drink Ensure type drinks to make sure I got enough nutrients. I had that nauseous feeling for a long time. I also couldn't sleep. It is a hell you wouldn't wish on anyone. It feels like your body is just shutting down to die. It's so awful not to be able to control it. I did go on anti-d's which seemed to help a little bit. It is so good that you have MB early on. I didn't and floundered for quite a while.

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Hi Lulu,

I am so sorry for all of your pain right now. I think he is making all of these moves because he is just as confused. He does not want to look like the bad guy, so he is giving everyone the impression that he knows what he is doing. That He is 100% sure. He probably believes it as well, but he does NOT know what he is doing. He has NOT thought anything through.

My advice to you mentally. DO NOT PANIC! Breathe in and out. Breathe in and out. Listen to your breathing, concentrate on that.

What he is doing right now has got NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU. Whatever he says, do not believe him. Whatever he does, do not believe him. HE HAS BEEN INVADED BY AN ALIEN, it is not the person you love and know that is doing these things. BELIEVE ME, BELIEVE ALL OF US.

Now, to the practical stuff. You do need to think. But NOT about him right now. Let him storm around, because he is a storm out of control. You need to think practically only, this will protect you.

I do not live in the States, so others will have to come with suggestions on how to secure your finances. Think BASICS. You need food and you need a roof over your head. At least in my country as long as you are married the WS cannot throw you out of your home. All payments, debts etc both spouses are liable for until you are divorced. If your WH has access to your accounts, or any means of your income, change codes etc. so he cannot get into them, to protect yourself.

Others will advise you here how to do the practical stuff and use your energy on that.

Remember SIGN nothing your WH comes with.

You need food. You need sleep. You need your support network around you. Friends. Family. Your doctor. Tell them now. Ask for help. You have us here, it helps, but LULU you need physical people you can lean on. NOW.

Lulu, you are in the middle of a hurricane. Hold on. The hurricane will pass. Any hurtful things your WH throws at you, TURN A DEAF ear.

Picture yourself like this.

You stand in the middle of your home. Everything around you is flying left and right. People are screaming and shouting at you. Furniture is flying. But you are using all your energy to keep ground. You say to yourself, I WILL NOT ALLOW THIS TO TAKE ME WITH IT. You feel like you are going to give up, but your willpower is stronger.

That willpower will bring you through this. That willpower will tell you, that you need to stretch out an arm to eat and sleep to stand strong. That willpower will tell you to not to allow yourself to use energy on vengeance, but to try to stay as calm, gracious and well posed as possible towards your WS, but allow yourself to break down to people that will support you. That will also help you to stand strong.

I KNOW this is hard. But it will get better. We will help you as much as we can to make it better!

Cyber hugs
-queen-

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<small>[ July 31, 2003, 10:26 AM: Message edited by: Zorweb ]</small>

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Lulu,welcome to the Forum. Rushed Fool and I live in SF( we met twice since last Saturday and we also had wonderful times) RF told me about you this morning( I have been busy with work therefore I do not get on MB as much as I wish to)and;we wonder if you want to meet up and we can give each other support,we are not doing any better except that we are not alone!So please write to Rushed Fool; notmesf@yahoo.com
or me; wangiaja@yahoo.com, we will then exchange phone numbers and form our little support group,OK.

You are in my prayers. Write us,OK <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

p.s. Zorweb,are you disapponted in me? Please know that I appreciate all your help and I still want to hear from you,OK. Peace. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

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<small>[ October 12, 2003, 11:41 AM: Message edited by: *LULU* ]</small>

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<small>[ October 12, 2003, 11:41 AM: Message edited by: *LULU* ]</small>

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LuLu it is at times like these that you know who your true friends really are, and those people who chastised you for telling them about your WS's A(affair) are NOT your friends period. Forget those people and concentrate on your plan A.

As far as not having access to the computer, you may want to consider going to your local library and using their computers to access the MB forums.

Hang in there LuLu, we're behind you 100%.

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Did you email only close friends and family? Or just about everyone you know. The reactions you are getting sound more like something that would come from aquantances and not true friends.

My questions here are for others who are reading as LuLu has already told everyond.

Additionally, wouldn't this be better done in person, one at a time? I think that it would have a better inpact this way. The idea is not to cause the WS harm but to get some help.

I'm a little bit concerned here. It seems to me that the people who are told about the affair should be picked carefully. Those you can get support from and not everyone in your address book. Most people could care less if a person's spouse is cheating.. remember we live in a society that has almost no moral foundation. And the little we have is slipping away.

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