Stanley,

I am no expert on this matter. I could only tell you what I did.

Why did I have an affair? Because I believed my husband didn't love me. What happened when I revealed the affair to him? He stayed with me. How much more could someone love me??? I betrayed HIM and he stayed with ME?

I did everything by the book after that point. He never had to and never will have to wonder where I am, who I am, or what I am thinking. I truely adore that man for forgiving me. He is a man among men. He is honest and loving and forgiving. My OM? The same cannot be said for him. The choice was obvious to me.

My fog was pretty short-lived after this occured to me.

I can't speak for my H about whether or not he still wonders if I am in contact with the OM. (I am not.) But if he ever asks if I am or if I think about him, pine for him, doI have gifts or reminders of him, or anything else . . . I can look at him straight in the eye and say I am deeply in love with my husband and shall never again betray him. I don't need what that OM offered me because I have everything here already. I give it to myself first (honesty) and then I give it to my husband.

My reward for this? A deeply renewed commitment. A man who doesn't have to ask because he already knows.

Stanley,

I will repeat this. You need to back off. You cannot MAKE Myrta love you and it is NOT your job to remove things OM gave her. It is her job. She can lie to you and tell you they are gone and you won't know. I think you need to realize that so much is out of your control. I realize in your profession having things out of control is tantamount to a major disaster and yes death, but you really cannot control if, when, how, or whether she loves you and respects you.

It really is Myrta's call. Your call is how you heal from this, how you decide to recover and learn from this experience and ultimately if you are happy in this marriage. You need to realize decisions don't need to be made right now, but if things are not to your satisfaction as time moves on, then you also have choices. It is Myrta's call with regard to the marriage right now, as you want it to last and rebuild. She has been given a lot of control, but with it comes more responsibility than she seems to realize. She may like the control, but she had better act responsibly or she will lose a lot more than she seems to realize.

Sit back and see what she does. The ball is in her court. You have expressed a deep desire to remain married to her. You have expressed deep love for her. You have endured a lot for her. It is time her actions started to match her words. Time will tell,but give it time and have patience Stanley. I know it hurts to do this, but for better or worse, she now has to address this marriage and decide if it is what she wants and decide how to fix what she feels she needs.

You have your own work to do, so do it. She has a lot of work to do, and she needs to do it. I think she will eventually realize that the marriage has changed, you have changed your perspective of things, and she must change her perspective on things. I am guessing but for the first time, she is being held responsible for working on this marriage. I suspect you were the one that gave a lot, and when you got busy she decided she still needed what you used to give adn she went elsewhere. The reality she needed to give a lot as well, and that included understanding why you were doing what you did and what you were doing.

Just some guesses. But, step back and do your job in this OK?

God Bless,

JL

Stanley,

You said, "1st of all if CC agrees with Myrta I have to conclude that my beloved wife may still be foggy. I say this because when I read CC the fog is so dense that I can hardly see the words on the screen. No offense CC, but among our elite group of WWs you are tops regarding the number of molecules of H2O that surround you----------- you are wet on this one. And my dear Myrta is swimming in it." Wow! That was pretty harsh!!

I thought that I had made some strides, but after reading your posts and JL's, I don't even want to come back here again!

I said that *I* put many things from the OW away. If anything bothered my H, I'd put it away, or throw it away if it hurt him that deeply. As far as the jewelry and such, I DO NOT HOLD ONTO IT AND WEAR IT AS A REMINDER! That's bullsh**! I happen to like and enjoy jewelry, and I have many, many pieces of jewelry from many friends and family members; the OW included. I don't look at what I'm wearing and associate a loving memory to it. Sorry! I guess I didn't make it clear that I have a TON of jewelry (and "things"), so I'm usually at a loss for who gave it to me!

As I've said before, it it bothered my H, I wouldn't hold onto it. I've ALSO SAID that *HE* has things from the OW which he's kept, simply because he liked them! My children too. It doesn't seem to be a big deal here, and I'm not saying that because I'm in some frickin "fog"!!! I'm seeing things more clearly lately and I DON'T appreciate your harsh tone.

I hope that Myrta is okay and that you two could come to some understanding. I hate to hear her get so beaten up here.

Take care, all. I won't be posting for a while!

CC <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Stanley, I just want to reiterate what FaithfullyHoping said. That is exactly what happened with H and I.

FaithfullyHoping, do I know you? I don't want to embarrass mysef by talking to you like I don't know you and finding you're someone I've been talking to for ages. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

CC, I know it's unpleasant facing this stuff but it has to be faced.

WS's do not have the luxury of taking their time to decide if they want to do things or not. Grieving has to be done in private, the BS has to be put first at all times. Although, having said that, my H sometimes held me as I wept, saying "I miss him, I miss him." Can you imagine anyone loving you that much? I am still in awe of it.

Actions are the only things that count. I've said on another thread to you all H and I burned all my old photos of OM (from when we were at school) as an act of good faith and to show where my commitment was.

Jen

<small>[ October 08, 2004, 08:33 PM: Message edited by: KiwiJ ]</small>

JUST LEARNING====
Well, I want to thank you for all the interest you had shown for myself and my husband. I believe that,as of today you have one less person to advise.
I will try to do as best as possible with my husband and myself.
Before leaving thought, I have to tell you very clearly and with no doubt in my mind, that I do not love the OM. I love my husband, but I think sometimes love is not enough. Sometimes love hurts!
Like I said before, if I am giving him too much to bear, he can leave. That does not mean that I will be going back with the OM. But I dont want to be put down anymore, because "I dont do or say what all of you want me to . Like I said before , and you said too, I have to do what I think is my best way to deal with the situation.I dont like to be push to go against my will.
If you and everyone here dont agree with me, so be it.
Keep up your good work here, but I am out of this game!
You still have my husband to guide and advise.
And by the way too, all the years that we had been married, I had been the one that was trying to have the best marriage in the world. I put much more effort than my husband. I was the one working the hardest to make it work, not him. He cannot deny this!
Have a good one!

Myrta

<small>[ October 10, 2004, 05:35 PM: Message edited by: Myrta ]</small>

Faithfully Hoping said:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I did everything by the book after that point. He never had to and never will have to wonder where I am, who I am, or what I am thinking. I truely adore that man for forgiving me. He is a man among men. He is honest and loving and forgiving. My OM? The same cannot be said for him. The choice was obvious to me.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If I had been a WH I would have done just like you. The last thing in my mind would be to hold on to some cheap gifts. Thanks for the encouraging words.


JL said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Stanley,

I will repeat this. You need to back off. You cannot MAKE Myrta love you and it is NOT your job to remove things OM gave her. It is her job. She can lie to you and tell you they are gone and you won't know. I think you need to realize that so much is out of your control. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As of today I am backing off. I do get stressed out by trying so hard to get things to where they should be. During the 1st weeks it was only me doing 100% of the work by reading and learning about affairs. I guess Myrta’s arrival here was a major step for her, but I feel I have been running in circles.

I told her I had destroyed the CD OM gave her and she became somewhat indignant even thou she does not listen to it or knew it was missing. I guess she feels OM spent money on the gift and therefore she feels it would be inappropriate to get rid of the CD.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">but you really cannot control if, when, how, or whether she loves you and respects you.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is so true and it is something my dad told me when I was becoming interested in girls. He was very clear----------- “there is no point in loving a girl that does not love you back---------- find one that likes you---------- it is much easier.”


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It really is Myrta's call.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are right---- I cannot force the issue. The door is open if she wants to go back to the OM. I feel bad about it, but at some point one starts to get tired of fighting to gain the attention of a wife who is now thinking about someone else. How do I know that? She is holding on to the gifts!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You need to realize decisions don't need to be made right now, but if things are not to your satisfaction as time moves on, then you also have choices. It is Myrta's call with regard to the marriage right now, as you want it to last and rebuild. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Right now I still want to stay married and I hope things will be the same again. However, I have become more inpatient as I slowly become less and less depressed. Some days I am full of hope and on other days is all gloom. Her tenacious defense regarding the gifts by OM affect me negatively-------- I will not deny this.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She has been given a lot of control, but with it comes more responsibility than she seems to realize. She may like the control, but she had better act responsibly or she will lose a lot more than she seems to realize.

Sit back and see what she does. The ball is in her court. You have expressed a deep desire to remain married to her. You have expressed deep love for her. You have endured a lot for her. It is time her actions started to match her words. Time will tell, but give it time and have patience Stanley. I know it hurts to do this, but for better or worse, she now has to address this marriage and decide if it is what she wants and decide how to fix what she feels she needs.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">From day one---- before I had read anything about affairs I recognized that I could only heal with the help of Myrta. However, time and time again she would tell me "this is too much responsibility for me". I know she still feels overwhelmed with the task of trying to help me or fix the marriage.

<small>[ October 08, 2004, 10:48 PM: Message edited by: Stanley568 ]</small>

CC:

Sorry for the 2x4----- my 1st one since I have been here!

You redeemed yourself nicely on your last post-------- good for you!


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If anything bothered my H, I'd put it away, or throw it away if it hurt him that deeply. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Would you let Myrta know.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As I've said before, it it bothered my H, I wouldn't hold onto it. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Keep going CC!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I hope that Myrta is okay and that you two could come to some understanding. I hate to hear her get so beaten up here.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Myrta has taken some heavy duty 2X4s before-- she will be back!

KiwiJ said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Actions are the only things that count. I've said on another thread to you all H and I burned all my old photos of OM (from when we were at school) as an act of good faith and to show where my commitment was.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I would say that to get rid of old photos from high school is way much more difficult than to throw away cheap jewelry. In fact Myrta could give it to her sisters as a gift.

<small>[ October 09, 2004, 08:26 AM: Message edited by: Stanley568 ]</small>

Myrta:

If you really believe the gifts are important and you want to keep them simply tell me why you want them.

If there is sentimental value I will understand and not mention this again. However, when you say the gifts have no intrinsic worth and you deny an emotional connection to them I get very confused.

There must be a reason why you want to keep all this stuff.

Why did you get upset when I got rid of a CD that you never listen to?

These are the things that make me wonder on a daily basis----- sorry if I am wrong on this one.

I just realized that when the issue of the gifts was raised you said I don't think of the OM when I see them or holds them

I think the key word here was I.

That is fine, but in turn I (the BH ) is highly bothered by those gifts. You may say, well that is your problem. If you don't believe me that is fine. Hmm I am back in square one as you refuse to do something that by your own admission would cost you nothing (if you truly believe there is no emotional connection).

<small>[ October 08, 2004, 11:22 PM: Message edited by: Stanley568 ]</small>

Stanely,

Of course I do not speak for Myrta, but I'd like to take a stab at one of your last questions in this thread. You asked her:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">There must be a reason why you want to keep all this stuff.

Why did you get upset when I got rid of a CD that you never listen to?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">In my situation, one of the reasons it was so very difficult for me to go through with getting rid of the mementos of the A was that I felt like I was being forced to do something that was not, at first, my choice. I was experiencing a loss of control after having been so completely in control during the time I was hiding my A. When I confessed my A I agreed to let someone else (my H and our MC) take over for a while. I didn't ENJOY it, but I knew it was for the best. I obviously had not been thinking clearly for myself and I put my trust into the hands of the MC (and my H) because I felt they were less foggy than I.

But trust is a two-way street, Stanley. Myrta is begging you to respect her feelings right now and you are beggin her to respect yours. That is why JL is suggesting that you back off a bit. I know it is enormously difficult right now, but you have to trust her that she will do the right thing. If you tell her, "Myrta, I love you and I want this to work out and I will be here for you in every capacity," then you will likely get the more favorable results that you desire. If you tell her, "Myrta, you HAVE to do this because I am unhappy and it's what is right," then what will happen is you will have a wife who will live up to your low expectations of her.

I hope this makes sense. It probably sounds ridiculous to you that you need to step back and let her choose to come to you. But if you think about it, she's already there.

CC,

I would have to venture a guess that the reason that your H is okay with your keeping the jewelry from your lover is that perhaps he is unaware that it came from her?

But regardless of whether he knows and regardless of whether he even cares, the mere act of your saving the items is horribly symbolic. I know JL has told you to reverse the scenario and imagine that your husband kept gifts from HIS lover in your bedroom, livingroom, etc.

But I think you should forget the idea of reversing the scenario. Instead try thinking strictly about what it says about YOU: evidence here, there, and everywhere in your home that you are a liar and a cheater. Is this your own personal scarlet letter?

Perhaps you need to think about being a lot gentler with yourself. Get rid of the baubles and trinkets and replace them with something that you buy for yourself. And wear them with pride -------- pride in yourself and in honesty and in truthfulness and in being a role model to your children.

You will never have to make a case with anybody over a CD you bought for yourself, or some new jewelry, or whatever else you need to replace. Nobody will ever think twice about its existence. Nobody. Especially not you.

Please think about it. If you have to work so hard to defend having it or keeping it, how "right" is it?

Stanley,

Thanks for your last post. I hope that you re-read my other posts tonight and realize that I'm NOT holding onto everything from the OW.

Faithfully,

I already stated that I'd get rid of things from the OW if it bothered by H. He's already told me that the pictures of her/us bothered him and they're gone.

As for the jewelry, some of it is diamonds, and it's mostly not "cheap" anything, or I'd have put it away (or thrown it away) by now. As I've said, they're NOT reminders of her, and I doubt highly that my H thinks they are either. Again, if he did, I'd get rid of them or put them away. Clear??

I have LOTS of jewelry and gifts from friends/family and no one can keep track of it all; not even me. So, it's no big deal to us. Besides that my H has stuff from my OW and he's not parting with it either! He said that it's okay to keep it b/c he likes it! If it reminded him too much of her or of his pain, he'd get rid of it--that much we've spoken about.

Hope I'm clear here. I'm not keeping my house innundated with her stuff, but she's been a BIG part of our lives for 3 years, and she's bought us all tons of stuff; stuff that my family hasn't wanted to part with, and if I have no problem with that, and if they don't either, then I feel that it's okay. It's NOT a constant reminder of her.

Thanks for your input. I'm going away to the Bahamas on holiday any minute, so maybe I'll check back here when I come home in a week.

Myrta, I wish you the best. Sorry you've had a rough time!

CC

CC,

Enjoy your holiday. I hope you buy some nice souvenirs while you are in the Bahamas.

Dear Myrta,

please understand that the people here are trying to help you, not put you down. I guess you are struggling with guilt right now and that is making you very sensitive to anyone telling you that you might be doing something wrong (still).

Yet you are simply "swimming" a river that many of us have swum before. We know about some of it's dangers. Even though every "river" is different, there are still many similarities. We are standing on the banks of your river (because you asked to come and see you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> when you came to MB) and trying to give you help - be careful of this, don't go there, that's a dead end - but in the end you decide whether you're simply going to do it your way, without the help of people who have been there, done that and got the T-shirt.

It's your choice my dear. We are only trying to give you some pointers. BS's can tell you what is going on in their heads. We can only tell you that. You must make your choices.

You cannot expect to swim up a dead end and then magically find your way through. You'll have to swim back and try another route, or stay in the dead end being angry at it.

We all want you to get through this, to find yourself again, to be in a good place with yourself again. We are trying to help you the best way we know how - hoping you'll not make the same mistakes we did, perhaps.

If people here would think you're a horrible person, you can bet you would get a) no postings at all b) be blocked from this forum b) get very angry postings. None of that is happening. But like Stanley doesn't know how to handle this because he (luckily) has no experience at being a BS, you don't have any experience at being a WS in the eyes of other, either. I guess you feel "hey, this isn't me, I'm much more than this." But when you go to the doctor about an ulcer you might expect a lot of talking about your stomach eh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Please keep posting here my dear. Your feelings about it will also change as you progress in your river. You might even realise those "judgemental people" on the banks of your river are actually trying to keep you from hurting yourself.

Faithfullyhoping said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">In my situation, one of the reasons it was so very difficult for me to go through with getting rid of the mementos of the A was that I felt like I was being forced to do something that was not, at first, my choice. I was experiencing a loss of control after having been so completely in control during the time I was hiding my A. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This morning we talked about the gifts again and I had the feeling that Myrta does not like anyone telling her what to do. He demeanor suggests that perhaps she has no emotions associated with the gifts. In any event-----all of a sudden she got up and gathered the gifts. She then looked at me and said “I have no sentimental attachment to these things at all, but here they are”. She then threw then in our bed for me to see.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But trust is a two-way street, Stanley. Myrta is begging you to respect her feelings right now and you are beggin her to respect yours. That is why JL is suggesting that you back off a bit. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That is a very insightful comment. I think Myrta is tired of having to do things because someone else says you should do this. I know her well and she does something whenever she feels like it. She despises the idea of being manipulated and I cannot blame her for that.


Brownhair said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I guess you are struggling with guilt right now and that is making you very sensitive to anyone telling you that you might be doing something wrong (still).</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Exactly! I think Myrta is tired and sensitive. I feel way better about this than yesterday. For a while I thought she really wanted the items because of their sentimental value. I think I was wrong about that, but something inside of me feels quite good about dumping those gifts.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If people here would think you're a horrible person, you can bet you would get a) no postings at all b) be blocked from this forum b) get very angry postings. None of that is happening. But like Stanley doesn't know how to handle this because he (luckily) has no experience at being a BS, you don't have any experience at being a WS in the eyes of other, either. I guess you feel "hey, this isn't me, I'm much more than this." </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think Myrta struggles with the idea of “this isn’t me”. She also admitted a great deal of remorse this morning which causes her to be depressed.

Thanks to all for the input, it is helping tremendously

JL, et al:

Here is an update-------- Myrta showed me the presents from OM. I dumped then right away------it seems she really had no emotional attachment. She was mostly upset because she hates to receive a direct mandate to do something. As Myrta has said the presents were fairly inexpensive.

We talked about her post D-day conversations with OM. Myrta still claims these conversations were quite helpful because she saw the OM in a different light and that made it easier to go into permanent NC.

She stated she is not ready yet to act or say the things I want to hear. So I will go back to a holding pattern and be more neutral. I think I have been rather intense in expressing romantic feelings and this is clearly not working as I thought it would. There are walls between us and unfortunately I cannot bring them down. This is Myrta’s job and she is not ready.

I am trying to convince Myrta to post again.

Dear Myrta

I wanted to thank you for you input and comment because they made me think quite a bit.

You were right I think that I was getting resentful about Aussie asking asking asking and did not realise it's cause right away. I want to answer him but it seems so hard to do so.

It is hard to be daily bombarded by all I have done to him, yes I deserve it I suppose but it doesn't mean its easy to accept & handle it all.

Yes it does hurt very much to see the pain and hurt and also the disgust in Aussies eyes when he looks at me. It's not constant but it does appear every now & then so I know EXACTLY what I have done, I can't ever escape unless I run away or he leaves.
I know many say I don't actually get what I have done, perhaps I don't in full, but it seems I do. I am so disgusted with myself its hard to look at myself in a mirror. I feel so small, worthless.

I don't want either, him to leave or me to go, like you I want to get my M back, I just doubt I can. I think I will end up settling for something less than it was and that will haunt me until I die.

Anyway I just want to say Myrta thank you and you are welcome to post to me anytime.

Myrta,

Hooray for dumping the OM’s trinkets. Kudos to both of you. I think you will make it.

Myrta, you have a way with words. I enjoy reading your posts. You sound so much like my W it’s scary.

I have a question for you. Perhaps you can shed some light on something similar going on here for me. My W has a picture OMM gave her years ago. He painted it. Very non-descript. But, she keeps it stored at work in a drawer. It is driving me crazy. Why would she keep it when she says it means nothing to her? She says she has no feelings for OMM anymore but still will not get rid of it. Will get around to it…on and on…

It hurts that she may desire this memento more than healing my feeling. Do you think there is something to her keeping this thing? Were there truly, if you are honest with yourself, feelings attached to those trinkets of yours after all?

Aside from this we are doing OK in our recovery. And I am not pushing this painting issue. I have not mentioned it in weeks.

Aside for CC: I do not know what state you live in, but if OW’s H ever wanted to sue you for the value of all that jewelry he could. It is illegal in all community property states for one spouse to distribute any assets, in any way, without the agreement of the other. There was a case here in Washington just recently where the W of a WH sued the OW for many thousands of dollars and won. OW has to pay it all back with interest!

Thanx,
T

THOS--Thank you so much for your encouragement. I really appreciate nice words, not only negative remarks.
I honestly tellyou, with my heart in my hands, that I did not have any emotional attachments to those gifts. First of, I do not like my husband or ANYONE to tell me, what to do or not to do. He knows that. Second, some of those gifts, I just liked, thats all. I did not get misty eye, or emotional knowing that I had them. I am sure your wife or even yourself has gifts from people that you dont like or you dont want to think about them, but yet you kept the gifts. Gifts, are gifts, thatss all. To me, they did not mean anything. Now, if I had love letters, or e-mails or postcards written by him, thats another story. Thats something very personal. I am sure your wife does not want to get rid of that painting, because I am sure its unqiue,, since its a painting. Maybe she can paint over the OM <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . Dont worry about it, . If you are doing well in your M with other things, a simple frame painting should not take your sleep away.

Myrta

Myrta,

:: I do not like my husband or ANYONE to tell me, what to do or not to do.

Like I wrote, you sound like my W. She has clawed her way near the top of a large old-boy network dominated corporation. She does not take no for an answer. So how about the, “Thou Shall Nots” in the Ten Commandments?

:: I am sure your wife or even yourself has gifts from people that you don't like or you don't want to think about them, but yet you kept the gifts.

Actually, no, we don't. Can't think of any - unless as you write, I don't think about them so much I just can't remember.

:: Now, if I had love letters, or e-mails or postcards written by him, that's another story. That's something very personal. I am sure your wife does not want to get rid of that painting, because I am sure it’s unique...

That's just the problem! This painting is a very personalized gift to her from her lover, her slimy lover, at the height of their A. It is a big painful thorn in my emotional side. She knows this yet she prefers to leave the thorn in me. Whatever her reason, it seems weak compared to what her keeping it does to our recovery and me.


:: Maybe she can paint over the OM...

Heehee. Good one. He isn't in the painting except for his signature. I'd like to have the kindergartners at DS's school Crayola all over it.

:: If you are doing well in your M with other things, a simple frame painting should not take your sleep away.

But it does. It's not a simple painting. It's a painting by OMM! It is much greater than the sum of its parts. Combined with all our other A problems it amy be just one more straw on the camel. But which straw will break the camel's back?

I was hoping you might have some words of wisdom for me that I could use to help convince W this is a problem. What finally convinced you?

T

THOS-- Oh, I am sorry about that. That does sound like something that she should throw away. Everything personal like that , that I had, I threw away the day after DD. I had so many e-mails ,and letters, annd I also had sooooo many voice mails with messages from him. I got rid of all that, and myhusband never knew about those things. He will know now, when he reads this.
What made me get rid of the gifts???
Hmm, I was sooooooo tired of hearing about them. I was getting sick to my stomach. And then of course JL's and CoffeeMans, posts, got to me too. I hate it when people think the wrong thing about my actions.
Tell you wife to post here and maybe JL and CoffeeMan can straighten her!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />
Good LUck!!

Myrta