Sorry for the ignorance in these matters, I will know alot more after I have completed a full year of this crap.<P>What is a suggested length of time that <BR>STBX and 8 yo d should talk on the phone at night before bed when I pick them up at 6:15 at STBX's house where they stayed and played all day? I never said they couldn't talk, just didn't want it to go on very long when it is after bed time. <P>During our discussion, I made the suggestion that an earlier time is necessary, so that it does not lead into bedtime.<P>Keep in mind one of STBX EN's that I didn't meet was that I didn't talk to her during the day on the phone.<P>8 you d was only here two hours, and I feel as though STBX is not allowing any acclimation time in my house. Am I worrying unjustifiably? STBX says that if 8yo d needs to talk to mom, she should be allowed. I encouraged the phone call, I just didn't want it to be a long time. definitions please?<P>Then STBX gets on the phone and asks me what is going on because 11 yo s who likes to be loud since this stuff began, is being very loud. Now this is only the third time they have slept over, and we all are trying to work out a good system, as well as get ready for bed at a decent time, as well as learn to cook, learn to commute, learn to get good in a new arrangement.<P>STBX then says that girls need their moms more, and need to chat on the phone more.<BR>Is this true?<P>Of course this is my first scheduled weekend I have kids nearly completely, but of course, STBX has made future arrangements with hotels without asking me, and so I said that it would be OK for her to take the kids one day earlier in weekend.<P>STBX then said "We will have to go to the mediator about this." <P>AARRRGGGGHHH! <P>Am I being too touchy? Am I being too unreasonable? what is a good length time phone call per night? What is too long, especially after being at STBX house all day?<P>just need some guidance for new behavior.<P>thanks<P>thl<p>[This message has been edited by WhenIfindthetime (edited July 14, 2000).]

thl,<BR>You may be pushing things at this time as it is fresh for everybody. Think of the kids first. What ever they need should satisfy you. I know it hurts but its whats best for them, not thl.<P>A friend I mad who went a divorce and kids told me and continues to tell me, keep the kids first and everything will work out for the best. Onece the kids become comfortable being with you alone, the length and frequency of the calls should decrease. <P>My kids only talk to their mother a min or 2 per day. She usually calls every day, but they almost never call her unless it is to geta ride or tell her what time to pick them up.<P>Just give yourself time, don't fight over the kids, if she wants to play games with them, let her. If she tries to bring om around, then they will want to be with you.<P>hang in there.<P>Bob<BR>

WIFTT:<BR>What a mess and how hard for the kids.....<BR>As for the phone calls, this is what I suggest:<BR>You have or are working on reasonable bedtimes etc and routines are especially important at this time period for the children. They need consistency as well. They then learn what the routine is when with you. Having given this long preamble.....<BR>you need to decide on a time for d and s (can be different as to appropriate age etc) to finish on the phone. This should be in the context of NO MATTER who they wish to call and talk to, no more calls after ____pm and in this way you are setting some boundaries within your home. <P>In the same breath (and here I am holding mine!) I would suggest that you ask both your son and d if they have called their mom to say goodnight. This enables them to understand that you know they need to be able to call her etc and also it might help alleviate their conflicting emotions.<P>If d needs to talk to mom, grit your teeth....do not intefere, but here you might be proactive. Suggest she calls mom at __time and then plan to have a fun activity in 5 minutes or so which will<BR>A)make the call a satisfactory length and will not allow stbx to manipulate d<BR>B)Give d something to take mind off this mess and mom and take d's mind off her conflicting emotions<P>If son is loud and you can live with that, then it is not for stbx to question, but this is an excellent time to tell, suggest, cajole stbx that son needs therapy...it is son's cry for help........and as concerned parents it needs to be set up. <P>Hope this helps.....I give better advice than I live by!!!!!!!! Not easy at all. <P>Enjoy the time with kids.<P>In future when it is your time, if you can be flexible , and you will know if you can be and how much, suggest that stbx only makes arrangements when neccessary on your time, not as a whim.<P>Throughout my mess, the one thing I never did was to make plans for the kids when dad was supposed to have kids.....(blamed for intefering etc, but never did anything so my conscience is clear and the kids know this)<BR>Dad tried to play games through the kids and that is the reason why I took this to court and it is rigid, UNLESS he chooses to contact me about this and to allow for the flexibility. Since he will not contact me to reschedule, the time unfortunately is lost and I truly do not think he cares.<P>The tragedy is that while he is in his honeymoon phase with new house etc, and thinks that the kids will drop in at anytime, the reality of teenagers in a home is not the fairytale he has now come to believe it is!!!!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by WhenIfindthetime:<BR><B>AARRRGGGGHHH! </B><P>I think RMD had a great post to you, buddy. Don't underestimate the intelligence of your kids. They will see which of you is acting selfishly or immaturely and which has their best interests at heart. <BR>

Hey Mike,<P>When does that happen? <P>My 15 yo D had an emotional awakening. Matured in about 9 months to a responsible person. Great for me great for her. I can finally talk to her like a person, and she shares more with me about her real personal life.<P>The problem is the 10 yo D. Her dad is a dependent needy [censored]. (47 and after his second divorce lives w/ his parents) He leaves D with parents majority of the time after fighting four years to finally win custody of her. X wife was in a profession that lent his bs some credibility long enough for the courts to mess things up. He would call her every day, mess up my visitation, and generally make life miserable for me and H while he projected his hypochondriac (sp?) whims on D. <P>Things with his interference on the mess up scale are better now that he is living his bachelor life style w/ his parents to babysit - I'm a stand in for babysitting because I'm usually available holidays and off-school days because of my two younger boys.<P>Getting to the point. Because of his needy nature, d has picked up all his messed-up bad habits. She needs counselling big time. Has very bad OC disorder. I wish that I had been able to better limit their time because of the imbalance I see in her. Giving up custody to an imbalanced spouse is bad. I didn't have a choice, but now I'm paying.<P>You might consider counselling for yourself and your children to try and work through appropriate etiquette for their contact, and to try to help your children remain healthy in spite of her influence.<P>It also might be helpful to get some advice on the influence of her as custodial parent on your children.<P>I don't have much to give except for my opinion, but your other posts indicated that your w is imbalanced, and I've seen what that did to my d. It kills me.<P>H

OK, I read everyone's thoughts after I talked with STBX. I told her that I can be flexible, that the answer was a call NOT at bedtime to prolong bedtime, but at a reasonable time, way before bedtime.<P>I told her I need the kids to get acclimated, and that they weren't asking for her, I made them call her. <P>(Like she calls s before bed at a sleep over!)<P>STBX said that calling to say goodnight is incredibly important to her.<P>So tonight, they called at 8 pm, conversation was short, they called earlier, conversations were short. Kids said they had a good day.<P>STBX not in a hurry to pick them up tomorrow, and was chatty on the phone. Actually was thinking about us.<P>I think this tough stuff actually works better than I thought when done correctly.<P>I am very reasonable, and agree with Harlequin, although this is a touchy area, since STBX knows she has mental illness, and doesn't want to deal with it, and parents didn't either, and admitted that to us at one time. forcing couseling is a BIG LB, and I can't force it anyways. I just am working with the kids myself, very hard on rules of respect in this house, and they actually use it more here. We will see about how this works, STBX still says it is just age appropriate behavior, all natural. (hey, I have this bridge for sale. . . .)<P>yes, I am looking out for the kids best interests, which would be limiting time with STBX, but that is a hard sell right now. Also, STBX is physically all over d all the time in my presence. ( Like if she turned out to be a lesbian, it wouldn't surprise me)<P>It appears to be getting easier for kids the more often they come here, and daughter had a great time cooking with dad the time she was here by herself.<P>I think this crap may actually work out better than I hoped for, since my message to the kids was getting obliterated by STBX at home, STBX as protectorate of kids from Dad.<P>thanks, everybody, great advice, great support. I'll know everything about this crap after I have finished the process, just like you guys.<P>take care<P>thl