I was just curious to see how many of you feel that your spouse would have the courage to admit they had made a mistake and would be willing to reconcile the marriage if you wanted them back. Also, what have you said or done to let your wayward spouse know that the door is still open if they should change their mind?<P>Personally speaking here, if my ex decided that she had made a mistake and wanted me back, I’m not sure if she would have the courage to admit it or not. She already feels that the whole world is against her and nobody understands why she wanted the divorce. Backing down from what she was so adamant about just a few months back is something that I think would be very hard for her. Although ending this marriage was hard to and she managed to do that without much hesitation.<P>As far as letting her know that the door is still open, I’m not so sure that I have done that exactly. During the separation she knew exactly how I felt and knew that I was willing to do whatever it took to work on our marriage, but since the divorce, I haven’t offered her any of this validation. Since the divorce I have only been there as her friend and have not mentioned anything of my feelings for her. A part of me is still so hurt for laying all of my feelings on the line and getting nothing in return but a divorce decree that I am really afraid to ever bring up the issue again. A person can only have their heart broken by another so many times before they quit trying you know?<P>I have toyed with the idea of sending her some kind of letter so that she knows I still care and would still like to spend my life with her, but I can’t manage the strength to do it. At least not yet. So far though, I haven’t seen anything from her to indicate that she would even want to hear of such a thing. I’m still having a hard time picturing the rest of my life without her.<BR>

I (and I don't know why) feel that my ex will one day admit that he made a mistake once his fairy tale turns "Grimm." His wisdom comes slow. My H thrives on his personal angst--it helps him "create." He won't go to therapy to help him work out his issues with his screwed up family and childhood because it gives him "subject matter." <P>I know I have not kept the door open. I did everything to keep it open during the separation, like you. Once he made up his mind, I filed for divorce. It was more out of convenience. He was moving out of state and I hastily wanted to get on with my life. We did the paperwork together. I somewhat regret that and wonder what if I had stalled it or made it more his responsibility if things would have changed. I did make it clear even after the papers were in that we were not doing the right thing, but that I would not fight his decision and emphasized that it was HIS decision. However, I think when I started dating that guy, he got a message that said that I was through with him. So I may have shut that door inadvertently. <P>I have asked myself if I would want a reconciliation. I am not sure. I think I am so bitter right now that the idea is repulsive, but I did pledge my life to him for better or worse and this is truly a "worse" situation. I feel I have invested much in him and our life, and I might want a second chance. Pride might keep me from pursuing it, though. I mean, I'd look like a desperate fool and lose a bit of self respect. He already admitted to using me during our separation (he was "seeing" her but sleeping with me. I would give him sex whenever he wanted it because I was trying to be a good wife.) I don't want to be the fool again. I feel disrespected and like I deserve better treatment. Also, there is no trust left. Deep in my heart, I think if he did come back to me, I would like to think that I have the strength to say no, believe it or not. I actually think my ex has conditioned himself not to like me as a person or personality. He has convinced himself that we are so different and incompatible, I think there is no going back to a relationship. <P>It sounds like your ex wasn't involved with anyone else and this was all so sudden. You are still friends so I assume there is still respect and affection in your heart for her. My opinion, write the letter. You just don't seem to be where a lot of us are. Just be prepared for a rejection, no response, or a response months or a year later when you truly have moved on. That would pain me, I know. You must discern for yourself a point where you can honestly let go and "quit trying." I don't think you are there yet. <P>On the other hand, I have been puzzled by many people's need to cling to hope. I wonder how they can reconstruct their life as an individual when they stay so focused on rebuilding something that may never actually happen. It's like planning your retirement based on lottery winnings. At any rate, write the letter. Post it here so we can read it if you want. We'll help. Good lick.

How could my XW have made a mistake in dumping me? <P>She did what she needed to do in order to keep her sanity. If we ever build anything again it will be on a renewed foundation--different from the time before. I have come a long way in my thinking about what happened. <P>The thought that what she did was a "mistake" would only complicate any effort to reconcile. It certainly hurt her and me, but how would I know whether she could have actually continued in the marriage without having a nervous breakdown more serious than anything I could imagine? <P>From my point of view of course it was the wrong thing to do. But I'm past the point of judging her by the standard I would apply to myself. <P>If she wanted to come back, she need admit nothing. This said, there is no guarantee that I would take her back because I have new GF now, and if faced with the situation there are a lot of ways it could play out. But the words "I was wrong" from her are *not* a prerequisite. And I don't think they ever will be. It's just not a situation where I feel I'm due an apology.<P>As far as letting WS know the door is still open, I have been really, really closed to her emotionally since the divorce. I have done a few things to be decent toward her, but mainly I have been distant from her and she has been distant from me. <P>The closest thing I have done to a lovebuster I did was when I spotted a Drudge-linked wire service story about a dog killing a baby and it turned out to be a Pomeranian that did it. Since this toy breed is seldom thought deadly, I sent her the link with an admonishment to watch our former dog (now hers) for threatening signs (my sense of humor here) ... she e-mailed back and said to only send her nice stories!

gsd-<P>I had a gut feeling that something was wrong shortly before my wife said anything to me about being unhappy. Even months before when her parents started building a new house and we would visit the work site, I could never picture being a part of the finished house. Looking back on this thought is very strange for me. Then we were visiting some of her relatives out of town and something inside me told me that this trip was the last time I would be seeing these people as part of my family. Later that night I received the news. I still have a little voice inside myself telling me that she’s going to admit that she made a mistake and acted to hastily. I honestly don’t know what I would do if that day ever comes.<P>I have started to move on with my life and am just getting my feet wet on the whole dating issue. I have told two members of her family that I started dating, including her mother, but I didn’t give her much detail. I haven’t said anything to my ex about it as the topic as not come up. At this point telling her wouldn’t do anything but hurt her and I’m not after that. I only mentioned it to certain members of her family because they were worried about me and wanted to make sure that I was really ok. I told them so they would know that I was getting on with my life. I didn’t lie to them and said that it was a very hard thing for me to do, but it was something I needed to do right now.<P>I may feel differently if I find out that there was OM in the picture which caused the sudden divorce, but I really don’t think there was. I think my ex is a very lost and confused person and can only hope the best for her. She got what she wanted, but I often wonder if she had a clue as to what she really wanted. I’ve heard so many stories of failed marriages involving abuse, infidelity, lying, betrayal, drugs, failed therapies, etc…I’m still at a loss because my marriage had none of that. At worse we had some issues in regard to emotional needs (hers) and physical needs (mine), but we never even fought over them. There was an incredible amount of love and respect for one another. In many ways, I could only hope that my next relationship/marriage will be as strong in this area. <P>In many regards, I am still very lost myself just trying to ponder my life and wondering what the future hold. You are correct though, I have not reached the point of where I can honestly begin to think that I have let go or that I have quit trying. <BR>

It saddens me to say that I'm quite certain she will not. I would not want her to say it was a mistake, rather that it was a hasty decision, that is worthy of reconsideration. I would never ask her to say she was wrong for leaving, all I would ever ask is for her to show a desire to take a chance to save our family.<P>I'm sure that this is a mistake, but I know that by the time she sees that this was all unnecessary, I will have moved on. I love my son & would do anything to restore him to a normal family environment with his birth mother, but I cannot and will not wait forever for her fog to lift.<P>I deserve to be happy again someday, as do we all. I will not wait forever. Nobody should.<P>Take care...<P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain <BR>and makes the sun come out again

hi Jayhawk,<P>I don't think so.<P>He is a conflict avoider of the biggest type. I think for him, to come back and put this marriage back together would take too much hard work, and make him address issues within himself that he is not ready to address.<P>He has chosen the path of least resistance, ie, new girlfriends etc rather than the hard road of me and our family.<P>As far as keeping the door open, I sent him an email the day after our divorce. It said basically that I felt there were no bad times in our marriage, just times where we didn't put each other first. I ended it by saying that if he ever needed me I would be there for him, and that I love him.<P>Since the decision to go ahead with the divorce I haven't discussed with him *us*.<P>I let him know so many times before then that I would be willing to work on us, but he always came up with some excuse like his heart wasn't in it, or similar variations.<BR>So no, since the decision to divorce I guess I haven;t had the door open.<P>It's funny this should come up. I had a passenger the other day tell me that I should not let pride get in my way, I should ring him and ask him point blank whether he wants to come home. (BTW, I don't tell pax my details, however, he heard me say something about my children and asked who had them while I was working. I said my ex-h. He then told me never to underestimate the effects of divorce on children, even if it is amicable with no nastiness)<P>He is a radio producer over here, and said that if I ever needed some advice, or if my ex-h wanted to talk to someone, he would help. He had gone through a divorce many years ago, his kids are now in their 30's, and it's only now that what they went through is starting to manifest itself in their relationships. His eldest son will not commit to any relationship. Spooky how all these complete strangers keep telling me to bite the bullet and reconcile with him....<P>And I have always had the feeling that this is not over, and that it is just not right. I've let him go, and moved on, but something in side says that we're not done yet........<P>WHERE THE HECK IS MY CRYSTAL BALL.........<BR>(Zippy, did I put it in the oven again!!!!)<P>I don't think about reconciling anymore. What will be, will be. I can't make him love me, or come home. That has to be his choice, when he is ready. If ever. Anything else would be foolish for both of us. I did a big post to WilliamJ about our contributions to the end of our marriages. I won't repeat it here, but it says basically all that I now honestly feel.<P>I seem to have become a lot clearer in the last couple of weeks. yay, finally Joey is maturing!!!!!!!!!!<P>hugs to you<P>JO

In a word, no. I think he thinks he did what he had to do. It's all justified and the repercussions are not his problem.<P>CJ<P>------------------<BR>Judge your success by what you had to give up in order to get it.

good question,<P>DOUBT IT! because only a dentist would get her to admit she was wrong! Although miracles do happen.<P>I am making her do the final paperwork stuff, legal stuff, etc. I dragged her to get a framework, and something we can work with in writing until she decides.<P>Her family is always correct, they are discussion avoiders, and her parents would believe everything she says or does.<P>she manipulated a therapist to agree with her, of course without me present, and by bringing up tons of stuff that happened in the long ago past, so she can justify anything!<P>she might admit it if the kids do really badly in school, but even then it would be doubtful, remember, teachers have all the answers, that's why they teach people who don't have the answers.<P>tom<BR>

gsd- <BR> Wow, I feel like I could have written that post... The whole issue with trust. My H was also sleeping with me while seeing her (unknown to me..). I felt like such a fool when I found out.. Yesterday my H called me and told me that he and the GF are on splitting up. I am not sure if this is a temporary thing or what.. He called twice yesterday after not calling for several days. Wanted to talk.. I met him on some neutral ground (following the advice some wise people gave me last week.. ) and we talked about everything that went wrong with the GF and us.. He is starting to see where some of my frustration came from during the marriage. We did not talk about trying to get back together, but I have told him before that the door was still open.. Said he would call me today.. He has.. twice.. Will be calling me again tonight (or so he said). <BR> Anyway, I am out of town in Virginia and he has told me that he wrote me a letter and wants to mail it to me. No clue as to what is in it. I am very torn right now on this whole subject. Part of me wants him back more than life itself. The other part of me says that I would only make his life miserable since it would take so long for me to trust him again. Particularly since I have a job that requires travel (sometimes weeks on end) and his GF was someone he worked with. Guess the bottom line is I have no idea if I would follow my heart or my head???? I guess only time will tell. <BR> I did make vows for better or for worse, but I am not sure that I can take the pain of wondering if he would just leave me again when someone else came along??? Anyone here taken the ex/stbx back after something like this??? <P>arm6868@yahoo.com

No I dont think my H would ever admit it. I really think sometimes he continues his relationship with OW just to spite everyone because we all know it is wrong.<P>He is still in that very selfish stage and probably isnt man enough to admit it.<P>I will not leave my door open for him I donot want him back. He has his cake let him eat it. <P>Remember this is still very new to me he left on 1 November 2000, but I will not be treated like this by someone I have dedicated 8 years of my life for and then he throws it in my face that his unhappiness is all my fault and makes me feel unworthy. The other woman gives him what he wants good luck to them

Since my exH is getting married to his OW this weekend I don't think he will ever admit that getting divorced from me was a mistake. He may, years from now, admit getting married so soon after our divorce was final (3 weeks) was a mistake but I am not sure his ego would ever permit it. He usually pondered something for about 5 minutes, made up his mind and then it was set in stone. He would never admit that he had made a mistake about anything.<P>He ended the marriage in such a hurtful and heinous way that I would be masochistic to even entertain thoughts of ever taking him back. Besides, I realistically don't ever see him doing this. <P>Boy it is such a beautiful day here in Southern California - blue skies and about 70 degrees - why am I moving to Idaho?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gsd:<BR><B>On the other hand, I have been puzzled by many people's need to cling to hope. I wonder how they can reconstruct their life as an individual when they stay so focused on rebuilding something that may never actually happen. It's like planning your retirement based on lottery winnings.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Some of this may have to do with the nature of our marriages. Looking at my marriage with as much objectivity as I can manage, I believe that my wife and I are very compatible and very complementary. Further, the mistakes we made in our relationship were due to confusion and misunderstanding rather than selfishness or ill will.<P>Some people have difficulty looking back on their marriage and finding anything worth preserving. I don't.<P>Further, like Sisyphus, I have come to understand that my wife "did what she needed to do in order to keep her sanity." Or, more correctly, she needed to do <I>something</I>, and she did the only thing she could think of, given her understanding of the situation (distorted as it was by the very unresolved issues that threatened her sense of self in the first place). Unfortunately, her choice of action is virtually guaranteed to make matters worse for her. She <I>must</I> learn to face her inner demons before she can come to love or believe in herself. And if she does that, if she comes "out of the fog", how will she feel when she discovers that she has destroyed some of the best things in her life?<P>How can I abandon her under those circumstances? I can't. And not just because I love her, but also because I would not be able to respect myself if I abandoned her.<P>Regardless of how little hope I may <I>feel</I>, for me to give up hope and move on to another relationship would require me to give up too much of myself. I would have to give up my self-respect, my belief in my own moral integrity, my faith in God's healing power, and my faith in my wife (who is much stronger than she believes).<P>I'm not planning to sit around pining for my wife - for the marriage we used to have, or for the dream of what we could yet have. I have other dreams and goals I can pursue, and I do not pin my hopes for future happiness on my hopes for a restored marriage.<P>But I will not turn my back on my wife, and I will not close the door.<BR>

All along my STBX husband kept telling me that "some people are better off with other people". And although he tried to do the right thing and come home, he had long since transferred the deep love for me to the OW. I will be moving out of our home on 2/1/01. I like to think he'll at least (in his own mind) believe he made a great mistake in divorcing me, in as far as admitting it, I seriously doubt it. He has much to much "pride" and ego to do that. I have left the door open for him to come back and for us to rebuild the marriage. I have let him know that I still love him, and although that might sound weak, I felt I needed to tell him that. This has been the most difficult thing for me to face, what with the affair and now divorce, and I really felt (and still feel) that I will never get over it. Time is the greatest healer. I hope that if he was to admit that he made a mistake and wanted our marriage back, I hope that I would be in a better place to look at things truly objectively and not purely based on emotions.

My H told me he made a mistake... but I don't know he meant it or not since he's making the same mistakes right now, it's just a word for me..His words don't mean anything anymore.<P>And no, he didn't want to reconcile(also I told him beforehand that even if he wanted to come back as long as he's the same I didn't want to be with him)<P>Meg

I quess since I am the one who filed the divorce...the question would be addressed to me. I didn't make a mistake. In the one year that this nightmare has continued...I continually looked for a sign that things would change. But, you know, if seems as though we are speaking two different languages and neither one of us understands the other. It is maddening. My stbxh is bent on revenge on hurting on making my life a hell on earth. Of course, he would say no, that I deserve everything I get because I don't love him anymore. I am so exhausted from the separation, dealing with the games, the lies, the fighting, that divorce is the only answer. I never imagined that someone I had been married to for 16 years could be so hateful.<P>

Oh sure. He called me three months after the divorce to apologize for the way he treated me. That was nice. However, he did nothing to show me he was willing to do something about it. He told me "I wish I could be a better man". Ok, nice. Wishing and DOING are two different things. Doing something about it was apparently too hard for him.

WIFFT:<P>What is your deal with teachers? I sense a hidden animosity there? <P>Gnome: <BR>Will you ever marry again? If so, what would you do ten years from now if your ex came back?<P>My main issue is that I will always feel that we did not give it a fair shot. He did not give me a fair shot. We knew there were problems in our marriage. We just made some half-cracked efforts at fixing them. Even I will admit that. But we never went far enough. There will always be that what if question lurking around. It is too painful to focus on it and think about it. I do blame him for not giving me a fair shake, though. How can you fairly and clearly evaluate your life and marriage when there is another person dangling a carrot in front of your face of a life that could be? That is why I am so bitter.

<B>He did not give me a fair shot</B><P>That about sums it up exactly. Change the He to She and you got me pegged! I was willing to do anything to work on our marriage, but she flat refused. She was unhappy, she made up her mind that she wanted a divorce, then she told me about it. By then it was too late. She made up her mind and that was then end of it.<P>I told her that I felt very betrayed, very rejected and most of all, very cheated that I, and the marriage was not even being given a chance.<P>Here I am 7 months later and the anger really hasn't set in yet. I was told that anger is one of the most important steps in all of this, but I just can't seem to get there. Maybe one of these days I'll just wake up angry as hell? Maybe then I will be able to move on.....

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jayhawk 93:<BR><B><I>He did not give me a fair shot</I><P>I told her that I felt very betrayed, very rejected and most of all, very cheated that I, and the marriage was not even being given a chance.<P></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Well, you had your fair shot. She just called it a failure before you even realized what was going on. Reminds me of that old <B>Pink Floyd</B> lyric: <I>"No one told you when to run ... you missed the starting gun."</I><P>It happened to me too.

Jayhawk,<P>Little bit of a departure from your question, but it struck me as an introspective question. How many times have I been wrong, how many mistakes have I made, and how many times have I refused to admit that I was wrong! Or even when I did admit I was wrong, still tried to minimize and deny the extent of it. There were a whole lot more than I would care to admit, even with the anomnimity that this forum allows.<P>As I get older, it gets harder and harder to blame that on someone else, whether it be my ex wife or the in laws. It took me years to figure out that the facts aren't really important, she is never wrong, period. It was never a good idea for me to tell her she was wrong or to try to set her straight. It was an even worse idea for me to try to compel her to admint she was wrong. Dumb, Dumb, Dumb.<P>Pastor John Hagee from Cornerstone Christian down in Texas has a real good saying: "Arguing with a woman is like trying to blow out a light bulb. The argument you think you won with her last night, It isn't over yet!"<P>Bumper