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Hi again everyone,<p>As usual here is my husbands latest letter. <p>I've been going crazy lately over this and could'nt wait till morning to go see it, so I took a drive tonight. Been having alot of mixed emotions !<p>------------------------ Tues. 7:41 pm 11-27-01<p>Well you got my note but you did'nt leave one.<p>I see you and Tony got your letters from the solicitors last week. I guess that's why he's moving. I saw a U-Haul in front of his house this morning or should I say he's running.<p>Hey I guess your moving the junk from one room to another. Yea when was the last time your front door was open, 4 - 5 years ago. I guess it's still an improvement for you though.<p>After that last note you left, I kind of wondered if your going backwards, to hating me again. Or have you just stopped going to your therapy sessions ?<p>You had me thinking last night, but then I got to buzzed and fell asleep. When I woke up this morning I saw a cigarette butt outside my door. (Mental - Basics). Was it yours ?
We're you there ? Or am I just imaging things ?<p>I have a roll of Romex cable for you (12-3) if you can use it. I was going to leave it here, but thought better. So if you see it on the little car it was me.<p>---------------------------<p>He was'nt as sarcastic as usual, and I guess in his own way he might be starting to softing up. I don't know.<p>No, I did not leave him a note this last time.<p>Tony is my ex-husband, who I have to testify againsst in a legal crimminal matter. If he runs great then I won't have to testify, like I really care.<p>Yes house had been clittered with all the renovating and such, I already told him I got rid of a bunch of stuff.<p>Last note, all's I said was another holiday come and gone. Happy Thanksgiving.<p>This was my shot at hitting him with not going.<p>I had him thinking about what ? No I was not at his place, he is imagineing things I guess. Not even my band cigarettes but I guess he figured close enough.<p>The cable again is for the remodeling we started and never finished. Now I'm trying alittle at a time as I can afford it. I really want to tell him to shove that cable where the sun don't shine. But will keep my mouth shut for now, I don't know what I'll do if he drops it off here at the house.<p>I did leave him a note, yes he got me all rialed up, that's why I don't want to talk to him in person or on the phone.<p>This is what it said. I really hope I did'nt mess things up, but as they say I could'nt help myself.<p>I know yes I can, o.k. I wanted to !<p>---------------
10:00 pm 11-27-01<p>I've been to hell and back over this situation.<p>When are you gonna stop cutting me down ?<p>A person can only take so much !<p>Stop my counseling, no I haven't miss not one time.<p>Have you even begun over our situation ?<p>-----------------------<p>Well what's everybody think ? Have I screwed up am I doing something right, what ?<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

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Just a quick note here.<p>My husband dropped the cable off on top of my little car about 8:15 pm last night, as I figured he would.<p>I suppose he parked out on the street, walked up the drive and placed it on the car, no there was to note along with it.<p>He then drove to the end of my deadend road turned around and came back out.<p>When he got in front of the house he blew the horn and rode real slow till I open the front door, he continued this way till out of sight.<p>No phone calls last night.<p>Shortly I'm on my way to the graveyard to see if he left a note there, and if so I'll post it here a bit later on today.<p>Take Care Everyone,<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

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Hi Everyone,<p>I sure hope alot of people get a chance to read this one, and give me plenty of feed back !<p>Well here it is the newest letter. It's good the way I see it, it's not all negitive, nor as cutting. It's also the longest one yet. I guess my short note yesterday helped somewhat.<p>-------------------------------------
11-28-01<p>Cutting you down ? <p>You told me you went two nights a week and Tuesday during the day. <p>Today is Wednesday, your home, last night you were home, & Monday was the same.<p>After your phone call asking about hospitalization I thought there was some change in you. <p>I've left notes and asked you why you didn't come by and answer my questions. <p>Have you ? No !<p>Why are you afraid I'm going to put you in jail or afraid I'm gonna F--- you, because you are the last woman I've been with.<p>Me start counseling, remember I went, did it help with you ? No, you put me out.<p> Spent money on the credit cards after telling me I couldn't, spent money left and right and cried about a pool payment.<p>What have I done but ask John to take care of you and help you no matter what.<p>Went and got you romex cable for your electric & if I knew what kind of box I would have got you breakers.<p>You always wanted to talk and now you don't. <p>I don't know weather or not we'll get back together. I know there are alot of unanswered questions from you on why. After you said you would never do these things and you did. <p>Then you say trust me I love you, I want you back, and all's I keep seeing is negative not positive. <p>So why should I talk to a counselor. <p>I sit in this graveyard talking to a dead man wondering who has it better him or me. HIM, he doesn't have to go day to day wondering, listening to songs that were at one time special, now only sorrow. Dreams once again taken away, no trust for the future. Never thinking I'll be able to catch you here to talk. This is the best I can do now.<p>I've had alot of different thoughts the last couple of month's and most are not from ours. But people who were your friends years ago are saying Don't do it again. So you tell me something better. Tell me the truth, face to face not on paper.<p>Don't tell me where, when or what time you'll go to group sessions. <p>Don't tell me what time you come here.<p>Don't show up at my door.<p>Don't ask me why I'm sitting here for 2 hours waiting to catch you.<p>Don't be honest - Keep everything a secret so no one can share your love 100%. Then ask me why we are not together as husband & wife. <p>Don't get mad Debbie, just think like I have for these past month's.<p>And you weren't here Wednesday night.

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Hi all,<p>I suppose I should have added some of my own comments in the last post to help explain him alittle, or his note.<p>It just re-enforces what I said about him listening to his friends and the influnce they have over him, I know he said my friends but he meant his.<p>I never told him I went to group sessions twice a week at night, I just told him I was going to a counselor and belonged to two support groups. This board is one of what I am calling my support group because that's the way I feel about it.<p>He still wants me to answer his questions, his letters.<p>So right or wrong thats what I did. I tried to answer openly, truthful and un-attacking as possiable. Some of his questions required answers he's not gonna like, but only because he does'nt want to believe.<p>I told him nothing I was saying was meant to hurt in any way, but he wanted the answers. <p>So this was the truth and if he choose not to believe me than don't ask. <p>Also that if he choose to vent to me about his life with me, me in general or just life in letters that was fine, but if he got nasty or degrading not to expect and answer back, I was not his doormat. <p>I have come to far to allow him to continue to try and tear me down, it would go against everything I've been working towards for the betterment of myself. <p>Oh yea I told him I was'nt mad, nor did I hate him I was disappointed in him. <p>That I did not want to see him in person right now we were both still to angry. I also felt that he was not ready, because he constantly seemed to be trying to start another arguement.<p>I left him my book there and told him he could read it if he'd like, if not fine.<p>I hope this answers him, it are enough of what he's been wanting, that it works and does'nt send him backwards. But he keeps insisting that's what he want, answers !<p>Thanks for listening and for your support,<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

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I hope someone is reading this and can give me some advise here !<p>My husband just called, I did'nt answer I let the machine get it.<p>He said he did'nt know weather I was here or not, but he left me a letter out at John's grave. He said the only thing he ask is that I read it with an open mind and open heart.<p>Oh Lord this scares me, but I have to go get it to see what he has to say, <p>His voice on the phone sounded down in the dumps, depressed.<p>I guess I'll find out, be back in a little while.<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]

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Hi all,<p>Well I guess I did it this time for good. I did'nt take your advise and I pushed to hard.<p>I don't see what a open heart and open mind has to do with his letter.<p>But here it is, one step forward and ten steps backwards this time.<p>OK, I guess it's really time to give up this time
I can't keep on like this. <p>Really no matter how hard I try I can't get through to him.<p>He writing without anger or nasty insulting words, but he is still twisting things around to suit him.<p>I guess he really must believe it the way he tells it.<p>There is some explaining to do with this letter as usual, but I really don't think it'll make a difference anyhow. <p>I'll try and explain it at the end, so it might help someone else out there.<p>I need to tell you also that on the outside of the letter I had wrote. Please read this without having drank even one beer, it'll help you to understand what I'm trying to say and it'll help to keep you in the proper frame of mind.<p>----------------------------------------------
11-29-01<p>I've read with beer in hand and understood and agree with things you said, not all but a lot.<p>That explains why I have been doing alot of thinking.<p>My life is a mystery for the last 3 month's, no.<p>I've just stayed away from you and the places you go.<p>They are yours not mine or ours anymore.<p>Nothing of mine has been anyplace since you, Debby. Sorry I never paid attention and always spelled it that way - my fault.<p>We have both so much hate & hurt towards each other that it blinds us both.<p>No I didn't leave Debby, you hit me told me to leave and called the police that night. <p>A week before you told me to leave and I stayed because Dawn once told me I run to fast.<p>I stayed for that reason, but you never gave me a chance.<p>Tonight I was in your backyard to look things over for myself and yes on your porch.<p>Because for some strange reason I wanted to say something.<p>I went to leave and felt you, I turned saw you, you closed the door.<p>I stood in the street but you didn't come out, so I left.<p>I'm sorry that I have bothered you, but I felt that I had to talk weather it was good or bad - and still do, maybe as constructive arguing. ( Do you understand ? )<p>But I'm not going to bother you anymore or John. It's time I let his soul rest.<p>I have alot of fear from our arguments and times you have thrown me out.<p>Please don't get mad but look back at the times & arguments, when you didn't respect my opinions and how it went down hill into a fight.<p>Don't answer, don't write, I'll never be back here again. <p>I will read the book because I know my life is not right and I don't do things right.<p>But think Debby, I always tried, I gave into you when we had fights.
This last time I said no more I didn't start this I'm not wrong - I stopped trying to save the marriage. Maybe it was wrong on my part, but I was tired of seeing it over and over again.<p>If you would have said wait or I'll be right out I would have stopped in my tracks, but you didn't.<p>I vent most of my anger on paper Debby, face to face it might not be that bad.<p>That choice would have been up to you.<p>My fears are to strong to tell you anything positive, that's why I have said no way to getting back.<p>Maybe if we could have talked some more or at all, maybe things could have been different, I don't know. I can't answer that at this point.<p>The F--- you thing - I guess anger and being horny, I'm sorry.<p>You won't see me in your yard or porch anymore.<p>I won't be here anymore.<p>Good Luck with your life.<p>Good Bye Debby
----------------------------------------<p>Explanation for this was alot of answers to things I had asked him :<p>1. Explains alot of things, it does'nt explain anything to me.<p>2. He had said how I kept secrets about my life over the last 3 month's. I gave him the answers, and stated that his life was the mistery. He totally backed off and hid everything he did, also brought up the other woman.<p>3. He always spelled my name wrong, and I pointed it out to him.<p>4. Both have so much hate and hurt, no I have plenty of hurt but no hate.<p>5. He said he was leaving, yelling and screaming just like in his other letter's you've read of his. Made a threat to me, my daughter Dawn who is 16 came out of her bedroom and got involved. He somehow had her fingers bending them over my shoulder and she was crying. Yes, I punched him to try and get him to turn lose of her. He said hit me again B----, I said if you touch my daughter again I will. I backed down the hallway to the phone and called the police. He later claim he thought my daughter was coming after his throat. I told him I'd drop charges, because knowing my daughter it was quite possiable and she claims not to remember how it happened. This issue was never settled, and I have not dropped charges decause I was advised against it, when he filed for separation.<p>6. I did'nt tell him to leave the week before, maybe a month before. Like I said we were at each others throats and it did get quite hard to live togeather, so much thrown back and forth.<p>7. In my backyard and actually on my enclosed back porch (this was to be a new bedroom and diningroom), it has'nt been opened up to the rest of the house yet, but that was really close.<p>8. Had to say something than why did'nt he when he had the chance. I saw him turn and thought he had just got there and got caught and chicken out. I did'nt know he was standing in the road waiting, it was dark and there's tall hedges in front of the house, that's why I moved to my daughters room to look out.<p>9. I never said he bothered me, but have repeatedly told him I don't want to argue.<p>10. Respect his opions, how about mine I don't count!<p>11. Don't answer or write, but I'm suppose to understand that we need to still talk, or have a constructive arguement.<p>12. He kept the book he knows his life is not right and does not do things right, why if he don't want to work on our marriage.<p>13. Yes he did try, when things were going good, before his back surgery. After that not really. But me too.<p>14. Didn't start this fight, it had been brewing for four days who knows what really was the cause for it other than to much togeatherness with him being off work for four month's.<p>15. Yes he did stop trying and yes he was wrong especially after he realized everything I was trying to do to get us back togeather.<p>16. If I'd of said wait, yea right he could'nt get things out fast enough down to bringing the strongbox out to me with the police demanding his old coins, bonds and credit cards. Went the next banking day and took all the money out and reopened one in his name only.<p>17. Anger on paper in person not bad, right again he's very load and boysterous, and being big in size quite threatening.<p>18. Fears are strong that's why he said no to reconsile, but not to much to spend the night with me and have sex, a few days before he filed.<p>19. If we could have talked maybe things would have been different, that's all I ever tried to do until his lawyer threatened me with a restraing order and to stay away from him and his neighborhood.<p>20. At least he finally apologized for something. <p>21. He got the last laugh and last say. Good Luck with your life, Good Bye Debby. Oh that hurts, bad !<p>Thanks for listening, and thanks for everyones help through all of this. I've been shot down again !<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

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I'd really appreciate any help with my husband's last letter.<p>I'm running out of time, I have to have my lawyer file papers back by Monday.<p>If I can or can't work something with husband depends on how I'll have the lawyer answer served papers.<p>Please some input here.<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]

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surmay - What I see is you and your husband repeating the same patterns over and over.<p>Of course nothing will change.<p>Blame and defend doesn't work.<p>I have no suggestions for Monday, but I do think you need good help w your husband to see what is possible.<p>I know you both had tried counselling from your thread. Someone had suggested you try the Harley's.<p>Have you? I think no matter which direction you go in ( reconcile or not) it would help you two to change the hurtful patterns you are in.<p>You aren't able to say what you feel to him.<p>Call the counselling center at MB and make an appointment. With help you may be able to see what is really possible in your relationship.

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Thanks alot familyman, I really appreciate you suggestion.<p>As far as both have tried counciling I don't really see it that way.<p>I have been in counseling Since Sept. 22nd, 2001, since we have split. I go once a week I've never missed. I think it has done me a world of good.<p>My husband went 3 times over a three month period. His appointment's were suppose to be weekly also. He never made it any kind of regularly. His work pays for it through the IEP program. <p>With him not going like he was suppose to and missing appointments all the time yhey closed his case out, two days before I started going.<p>There was no commitment by him in really going, so of course it did'nt do any good.<p>I have tried many times to get him to go again either togeather or separate he's always refused.<p>Thanks again and appreciate anymore input into my situation.<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]

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Hi everyone,<p>I made plans to try and talk to my husband, this is how it went.<p>To begin with I had planned to be at his place between 8:30 - 9:00, knowing it being a work night if he had went out he'd be home by then.<p>Well got there at 8:45, he was'nt there. Parked got out and sat on his porch, making sure I put my cigaretees butts on his sidewalk.<p>It was chilly out last night luckily I had wore a sweater. I walked around the neighborhood a few times to keep warm. <p>He finally showed up at 11:00. I grabbed my bag of potatoes stood up to great him. <p>He smiled , I told him it was a peace offering to for him giving me the cable. <p>Thanked me ! Handed me a pack of already opened pack of my cigarettes.<p>I said where'd you get these, they were mine.<p>He said I know I said I was'nt gonna go back to John's grave but, I passed you on Friday night on Hyw 90 so I knew where you were coming from so I stopped too.<p>While there I saw your cigarettes on the ground. He said I knew it was almost a full pack, and that you'd be back for them. I saw the 5 candles and 5 roses, and sat your cigarettes on top of the candles so you'd find them.<p>Saturday night I stopped again to make sure you'd gotten them, but there they still sat. So I picked them up and figured I was gonna try and catch you here or leave them off at your house with a note.<p>Good huh ! Anyway it went real well conversation wise, neither of us got mad but was very nervous even laughed a few times.<p>He did bring up family court and not to get mad about having to go. I said look Felix if there's any chance that you might want to work on our marriage and get back togeather. He said he'd talk to his lawyer tomorrow and see what he can do. I said, don't do this to me. He said do what ? I said Do you have any idea what the cheapest lawyer is I could get ? $1500.00, so please don't make me spend the money if you think there's a chance. I don't have the money, I'm gonna have to take a loan against the Jeep if you do. <p>He said it's only separation papers, we can get back togeather down the road if we work things out. I told him in the state of South Carolina there is no such thing as Legal Separation, so what was the point right now other than spending money that I did'nt need to be spend right now. (His lawyer is free, he's a friend). Have your lawyer postpone or pull the papers back for awhile, till your sure anyway please. <p>More conversation about the bills, the suburban payment's and the mileage he has put on it, stateing I would'nt want it anyway because it's 5 month's old and with the trip he just took it now has over 10,000 miles, with driving the distance for work. He might trade it get something else used to get the payments down, and later on we could get another after things have settled. <p>He asked about my support group, I filled him in on this whole disscussion board and how you all have helped me to keep my head straight. <p>He asked about my bills and how much will it cost him if he were to come home to catch the bills up again. I told him nothing everything is up to date. He said how many house payments are you behind, I said none. He said none, you've been going out buying supplies and paying someone money to work on it, and looking down at my shoes says new shoes too, The potatoe business must be doing really well ! I said I'm doing the best I can. <p>We talked about counseling, and he said he had been thinking very seriously about going, I think he's gonna start. <p>He said I see your mom has a new car it's brown. I said yes how'd you know that, he said I still go over there (the ow that he claims is just an old friend) a couple times a week, and told me not to get mad but he had promised to help her put up her x-mas light's Sunday so he'd be over there. I tried my best to act like it did'nt bother me, and said yea I know you already had plans, and got off the subject. <p>More talk then after about 2 hours he said can I intice you to the bedroom and to stay the night ? Long story short I did. Woke this morning first words out of his mouth was Thank You I said your welcome, but I have to get going. <p>He said it's a good thing you showed up last night, because I was gonna somehow get up with you. <p>Gave me a hug and kiss and I left, half way home I called him on my cell phone.
Told him I was calling to see if his mom still called in the morning, he said no, but I know calling to make sure I did'nt fall back to sleep, he said no I'm sitting here drinking a cup of coffee. <p>He said I did'nt get much sleep last night, so I'll be home tonight I won't be going anywhere. I said yea I probally will too.<p>One thing I don't think he knows is I definately don't need to pay the lawyer now, and if he wants to still go forward with this he has to refile the paper work now. Last night nullified everything as far as that goes.<p>Well what do you think ?<p>Appreciate any advise on how to proceed !<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

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Debby,<p> Have you ever gone to the site Gentle and I mentioned? www.restorem.org? It is good. If you send me an email at morriggs@yahoo.com, I have the book in ebook form. You can print it out (160pages) or save it to a floppy, but please read it.
Barb

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Morrigs,<p>Thanks for your help here.<p>Yes I have been to that site, it is a good one.<p>I know god and everything, and leaving it in his hands.<p>But I need to know how to go and handle things now, I've come to far to mess up now.<p>E-mail, surmay@sccoast.net<p>Thanks alot I'll read the book, thanks again,<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

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wow good for you surmay [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]
it looks like this has a real chance to make it!<p>you definatley need to talk about the things that make you happy, as a couple. sounds like the first time communication broke down...am i right?<p>ive been lurking reading your thread since you started it, never had good advice for you tho [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img] <p>back when everyone <doctor , hubby> was begging you to talk to him , and you wouldnt i was ready to choke you LOL
it seemed as if all he really NEEDED was to talk , and when you did things got better didnt they? at least by degrees. <p>you both have a long way to go but it sure looks like at least the door is open for talking and loving now...keeo it up [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>and keep us posted too, CONGRATS on the ground you HAVE made!

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soulmate11,<p>Thanks so much for responding and offering your congad's and of course advise.<p>It's been a very hard time for me , him, the family.<p>I did'nt want to talk to him for a few different reasons.<p>1. He had been angry for so long, he was just starting to come around and verbalize but it was still so filled with anger. I had tried to talk for month's he did'nt want too, shut me out.<p>2. I was now afraid to meet with him at this point because of the anger he felt, I just thought he needed some more time to vent and get it out.<p>3. I guess I was also afraid of what he might say, his words had been so harsh. I did'nt want to be hurt anymore.<p>But I guess the timing was finally right !<p>We've continued to talk, everyday and night.<p>He's been to consoling with me and has set up some for himself.<p>He had a couple of days off work, he came to where I sell produce both days he was off and helped me out.<p>Came to our home last night reconnected with the baby, and had dinner with us.<p>The baby thrw a fit when she had to go to bed because she knew daddy would'nt be there when she woke. He tried to asure her we were truing to work things out, and he told her daddy was coming home real soon. That really did'nt me anything to her though because he's been gone so long, and she's just afraid he'll be again. She's a daddy's girl, even though she's not his biological child, he's the only dad she's ever known.<p>Everything so far is going great !<p>I only pray it continues on this path.<p>Again thanks for your encouragement. And believe me I could understand your never having anything to say. It's been a very crazy and mixed up 3 month's for us all.<p>Thanks again,<p>Debby<p> [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

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