i havent heard from wh for LONG LONG time. he called yesterday to see if he can pick up the girls (one of which is his 11 yr old daughter and OUR 5 yr old.) sunday would be the only day since sat we have plans. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

the oldest begged me to not force her and my little one told me the reason she DOESNT want to go is cuz she hates him. now i know a 5 yr olds thinking when she is very confused is probably not as clear as the 11 yr old, but i do not know what the heck to do. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

i called my lawyer but is out of town till next week. i was served w/"kit" divorce papers that were filed in the court. i dont want to look unreasonable to the judge, but my heart is w/the kids, they are my life. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I haven't followed your story so please excuse me if I'm way off base here.

First off, I highly recommend that you get your girls into counseling. It was wonderful for my 3 girls and it also helped me with some tools to use when I saw certain behaviours.

I, personally, believe that you should do everything "reasonable" to foster a healthy relationship between them and their father. I don't know what type of father he was when you were together. Obviously by basically abandoning y'all he's screwed up in the head but children should not be pawns in any game. I pray for their sake that he is realizing the err of his ways and trying to establish a healthy relationship with them.

About your oldest hatred. Again, don't know the situation but it's my experience that more times than not these feelings come as a reflection of the parent. Granted he's a total jerk in my book but has she heard to much adult stuff about the situation? Again, please get her some help.

Hugs, Thoughts, & Prayers

He is probably trying to establish his parental rights, which he has. He will need to prove to the courts that he wants parenting time.
He was probably advised to do this by his lawyer or family members.
The separation is between you and he, not the children. He is still their father.a

hmmmm.... tough one. But ya know, he is there father - good, bad or ugly. There may come a time after the divorce where you so want him to have a relationship with them, but if you stand between them and him now, that might never happen. I'm dating a woman with 2 little girls and it makes her so sad that her X spends just enough time with them to make himself feel better. She does everything she can to foster their relationship with their father, but in my opinion he doesn't really care that much.

Be thankful that he is trying - a father figure is an important thing in a child's life. But let him know how the girls feel about him right now - tell him what they are saying to you, even if you have to write it in a letter to him. Don't blame him, just let him know what is going through their minds and that you are doing your best not to put any negatives in them...

I can only imagine the pain you are going through - I went through it with no children in our marriage, so I can see how children only amplify the pain and sorrow (and anger). You may have to force them to go with him, but in the end, it will be the best for all involved...

be strong - God Bless...
mike

Get those children into counseling. for the younger one, their is a good book called "Dinosaur Divorce" she might enjoy and benefit from. Came well recommended when I was going through my divorce.

He is their father, as you know. You definitely need to try to say nothing negative about him in their presence. And to talk about your anger, hatred, whatever, out of their earshot. Even on the telephone.

While I don't know that you should exert undue force on them to go, I do know that you should encourage them to see him and spend time with him. Both parents have important roles in the growth of children. Unless there is abuse.

Oh, and don't get the divorce without an attorney.

<small>[ June 05, 2003, 08:15 PM: Message edited by: cinderella ]</small>

kuljey,

Something you can do is encourage the kids to go..

yes, they are hurting inside right now, and don't understand why 'daddy left them' but let them know
that daddy really would like to see them..

Maybe discuss with him a time frame..like a couple hours at first--and if the girls decide they want to spend a little more time with him once they are there..ask him to call and let you know..but, by the same token if they are ready to come home in an hour..he should bring them home..

I agree, he was probably adviced to spend time with the kids now..even after so long..

And I would tend to disagree that the 11 yr old hates her daddy..more like she hate's that her daddy left her family..and that age, heck even as adults, we don't always grasp the difference of seperating the sin from the sinner..so imagine how hard it is for kids to understand the difference..

Yes, daddy made choices we don't like and agree with, but we all make choices like that sometimes
that hurt those we love most..

She may also feel going to spend time with her dad
will make it seem she is betraying you..and she doesn't want to hurt you..like he did..

So let her know it's okay for her to want to spend time with him..and that you are okay with it
and that you know her daddy really loves her--

My kids all experienced those feelings..(came out in counseling) and we worked through them, by my letting them know..they aren't hurting me by going to spend time with their dad..because I know they love him just as much as they love me..
and that it makes me happy for them that he wants to spend time with them and they him...it would hurt me more if they didn't..because that would hurt them even more..feeling it wasn't okay to love their daddy..

<small>[ June 07, 2003, 08:02 AM: Message edited by: ThornedRose ]</small>

I am sorry. I am so sorry. I will pray. It's hard. I think you should let the kids see their dad..but..

This post here is not about what their dad should have/not have. About you and the kids surviving. Get an attorney and get them on the case. Your x is in total fog and is really thick around him.

Everything's moved so fast that he can't see which way is up or down. He stopped paying? Take him to court. And don't be suckered into believing anything he will say right now about "taking care of you and the kids" or anything like that. When they are in the fog, they are unable to do anything for anybody else other than themselves...or maybe their lover...

We know this. For now do a plan B. Concentrate on surviving. I say from my experience, get the d as fast as possible and get the good attorney on it. Get a decent settlement. Take heart. Most affairs do not end in marriage.

I think about two years from now when the reality of his sin and his affair hits home, really hits home, he will kick himself. You can always remarry if he wakes up and gets out of the fog but for now you have to stand tough and do what's best for you and the kids.

Yea, let the kids see the foggy one. That's not what's important right now. What's important is you getting a game plan together. You're still stunned at the happenings and I know all about it. You feel frozen and helpless. But you are not. Act earlier than I did.

If he's waffling, he will waffle with her. If they've lied to you, they will lie to each other. There was a poster who spoke of something called the "dynamic triangle". Do plan B and B out of his life. Let him have visitation but don't get suckered into his little drama of the affair. Let them know the dynamic triangle is now over. When you're out of the equation, they have to turn on each other and all the venting and frustration that may be focused on you and the divorce right now will be their problem. Reality sets in when they realize they have couple problems too.

Think they're little fling will reveal to them that it's only a fling. That she's not his soulmate after all. But just believe it in your heart. That is all.

He's riding the high of the affair roller coaster right now. Soon she will LB and he will LB. It's a matter of time. But you can be sure, the OW is pushing for this divorce. After all, your H did send the contact letter because you wanted him to right? Well the OW is upping the ante by making him file the D papers. He's easily manipulated as I can see by her.

Think their affair will die a natural death like MB information. But you can't cover it up. Has to hit the light of day. Think now's the time for the light to be exposed on this. Stand tall. Hold your head up. Be a good mom. Love your kids. Stand up for them and for what's best. God loves you and we do too. Life is hard now but things will change. I believe it. I claim it for myself and for my friends here.

Peachy, who has been struggling with her own issues lately, has jumped in to give you some great advice. She's right about getting the D done fast, mine is dragging along because friends have said I was too "nice".

I'd like to add onto this. They do need to see their father, it's not about you and him. The children are the most important focus right now.

And, as much as I hated being away from my girls, I really needed the time to gather info. and file the papers for the D, and to see counselors and spend time on myself, reading or meeting with friends, or support groups.

Someone had a great idea earlier. Parenting time doesn't need to be overnight, he can see them for a few hours at a time, and you can use that time for yourself.

Good Luck.