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#755290 08/07/03 12:14 AM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> he is buying bridesmaids dresses---how can he not afford child support? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Pat, I wondered the exact same thing!

I feel so sorry for your kids, this has to be wearing on them!

Taking YOU to court for contempt, ya right!

Do you think it is time to ask your lawyer for some help with having contact through a third party regarding the children?

Do you document and his messages from the answering machine, save them and play them for your attorney to hear? I sure would! I think this is harrassment!

As a matter of fact could you NOT have an answering machine for messages like the good ol' days? There is no legal requirement.

All of my messages go through my local phone companies voice mail service. It is $6.96 per month. Having the service is HEAVEN! You dial up the service number, put in your code you have chosen and listen, then save or delete messages. Your kids wouldn't have to bear the brunt alone at home and not wonder whether they should tell you or not. I do have a newer phone made for this service only, it has a red light that blinks when someone has left you a message.

That's it! A third party for a go between and no answering machine! You could get some peace within your own home so you can get your bearings.

You are the "glue" for your kids and probably always will be because your ex can't see two feet in front of his drunk/now I'm sober ego!

Glad you guys came here to Nebraska and kicked booty!

Gayle

<small>[ August 06, 2003, 12:24 PM: Message edited by: Ragamuffin ]</small>

#755291 08/06/03 05:15 PM
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Thanks Gayle,

I don't have that service...but I am going to check into turning off my recorder--especially when I think he may call. We are in and out so often, I hate to get rid of it completely because that is how I get a lot of my information for stuff.

I am amazed at how much of a toll this takes out on me. I feel miserable today...just drained. It will be interesting to see what my lawyer says tomorrow morning. I am going to go to radio shack and try to buy a simple tape recorder to try and record the messages he left on my phones and also on Meg's cell phone.

I just wish this man would leave us alone. I knew this would happen when we got divorced. He has justified his actions so much that he is really sick. He really believes it too. What a tremendous ego he has.

He doesn't accept what the kids tell them--and he continually attacks me. I am the evil person that caused all this mess--I have such a hard time figuring out how he can do this to me. I never did anything to hurt him--ever.

It sure is getting old.

How have you been? I don't get on as much as I used to be able to--just too much to do around here. Thanks for your post. Pat

#755292 08/06/03 08:03 PM
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Pat,

Did you recorder? you can tape like that, we did last yr when some girl had OS phone & was calling & leaving stupid messages on his voice mail.

The voice mail works really well, better than answering machine.

Good luck with your lawyer. Hope he can help.

#755293 08/06/03 09:00 PM
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Thanks Sing,

No, I still need to get a recorder. I thought I had one--but I haven't been able to find it. I think I will take a trip to Wal Mart. Wish I could get them recorded before my lawyer appt tomorrow. Will see.

Please keep me in your prayers...I hope we can do something to stop this man. Pat

#755294 08/06/03 09:55 PM
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All the shenanighans are annoying enough, but when money is at stake (survival money), it is a whole nother ball game. I feel for ya pat, and your choices are fairly limited....here's my thoughts in no particular order.

1. The usual advice first, let it (him) go, he is not going to behave the way you want him too, and if he is as off the wall as you post, trying to keep up, make sense, will just drive you crazy...and conflict in and of itself, tends to keep the craziness going....as distasteful as it may be, my advice is to be nice (certainly firm though) as possible, accomodateing as possible, and no fighting, drama, etc. That may evoke a more cooperative response from him. In addition i would detail all the financial needs (especially of the kids), in writing, give it to him, and tell him you cannot do all of this, ask him what the kids will go without. Include your kids in this discussion. The business about dresses but no money for child support is a big red flag for sure, I am just saying though, don't use it against him, just won't work. And whatever he agrees too, even if it is minimal, or nothing at all, just thank him for listening/problem solving with you.

2. Let the kids (especially 2 older ones) work out their own relationship, don't try to referee or protect them, it just confuses the issue, and keeps you stirred up. Like it or not, they are stuck with him, and must learn through hard experience how and where to set their own boundaries. This does not mean you shouldn't mentor them about behaviour and relationships, just don't try to run interference, a tightrope for sure, but by keeping yourself out of that loop you can work on your own relationship with them. It is hard not to defend yourself, especially if the other spouse is not treating you fairly with re to kids, but they will see the truth more easily, if you do not muddy the waters with defensive posturing.

3. Take the law into your own hands. I think in most states you can manage your own post divorce compliance issues. See how that works for you, and become an expert at the system. You will save money (something I know that drives you nuts when you have to turn to the lawyer cause of ex baloney), and feel more in control which will help your mental state.

4. You are doing a good job of documenting (it sounds like) keep it up, be absolutely anal about it, the legal system LOVES records, and generally ignores feelings, etc. Stick to the facts as they apply to the legal realities of your state.

5. Empower your kids to make their own choices. Such as the wedding vs sports committments. It is ok to tell them they should do what they want, and not be afraid to express their feelings to dad, but to expect a negative reaction. Teaching them how to set boundaries and not be manipulated is very important life training. On the other hand if they choose to particpate don't overtly or subtley try to undermine that choice either.

Likewise the vacation thing. Rather than sic the cops on exH, did you first ascertain whether the kids minded staying with him? Did you really need to engage in battle even if he was dead wrong? I don't know, maybe it was necessary for them to come home, but if not, perhaps you could have used your agreeing to his high handed action as an opportunity to deescalate the hostilities...ya know? This head to head war will do nothing but drain money from both of you, hurt the kids, and reduce much needed cooperation. Maybe you could apologize, telling him you know he just wants to spend time with the kids, and overreacted partly due to the financial stress you are under. Who knows, maybe he won't care...but maybe he will, and then been a little more willing to be financially responsible. Maybe your H is a complete narcisstic, sociopathic loser, and nothing makes any difference but brute force, I don't know, only you do, so this is just food for thought.

6. I am unsure if this applies or not, realizing you may vent here more than in real life. But I strongly advise not to demean or trash your exH girlfriend, nothing but illwill comes from such actions, and just makes your life that much harder....I doubt the fleeting (and useless) feeling of satisfaction at insulting or belittling her is of much value to your healing and well-being, compared to the consequences such animosity automatically generates (human behaviour 101). In fact, if you can make a decision to do so, treating her with courtesy, respect and basic civility would probably reap substantial benefits... regardless of how she acts or not.

7. It seems like you may (and understandable) be trying to do a little to much for the kids, be careful not to burn yourself out, and let them carry some of the burden too. You may already be doing this, just continue to do so.

Good luck pat, it may get worse before it gets better, but a good attitude and a willing spirit will get you to a good place in due time.

<small>[ August 06, 2003, 10:03 PM: Message edited by: sufdb ]</small>

#755295 08/07/03 12:17 AM
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MNM, I can "hear" the weariness in your posts...I'm so sorry. A dear friend of mine sent me an e-mail once that made me smile in the midst of all the madness...she said she knew the saying that God only gives us the trials we can stand, but don't I sometimes feel like saying, okay God, I'm strong enough, no need to kill me! There are days like that.
I don't know why there is such a common thread among WS's in their desire to somehow punish us, the spouses that they vowed to love and cherish all their lives...maybe they feel that in some way we will pay for their sins. I hate to sound to "deep" about this, I don't mean to, but it is something I have seen in my own stbx, a trait that was never there before (to my knowledge). The greed, the need to continue some sort of control, the need to somehow be in our lives still, even when the ink is dry on the paper. I just don't understand. It's almost a cry for attention.
I know my ramblings don't help your situation at all, I wish I could, but I do understand your frustration and pain.
I hope your lawyer kicks a$$ <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

#755296 08/07/03 01:21 AM
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Dear sufbd,

Thank you for your post...much food for thought.

You know, I have been accomodating for him...and he hasn't reciprocated. I don't think he realizes yet what he has done to this family financially and emotionally. He would like everything to just move merrily along....and there is too much damage for that to happen. Unfortunately, he is an alcoholic...and he has been drinking more and more. He is totally irrational when drunk. That doesn't help any of us when trying to deal with him. The weird thing with him is that after one of these abusive drunken episodes....he bends over backwards to be nice. He has done that as long as I have known him. If you could have seen me cradling my oldest daughter the other night after one of his drunken episodes. It was so sad. This isn't the first time he has done it either. She tries to work and relate to him between times--but you just never know what will set him off.

As far as his bimbo is concerned...we have no respect for her at all. She knew from the very first night that she met, kissed and slept with him that he was married and had 4 kids. She tried to force herself on all four of my kids before we had even thought of a divorce--or at least I didn't know about it. She attends everything in this small town, and the kids are embarrased by her. She is almost the same age as my oldest daughter. Now, she is trying to be a friend to all of us. She will never know what she has done to this family--she is not capable of it. Also, when he rants and raves in one of his tirades--she doesn't stand up for the kids--a role I always played.

Unfortunately, with my ex, he is still trying to control this household even though he gave us up. When I give him a little, he just keeps trying to get more control.

I have been trying to maintain control around him--but he sure knows how to push buttons.

The other night he called here about 9:30. I was on the phone. It kept buzzing so I flashed over and it was him. This is the night after the police episode and the lawyer letter. He asked, "Who's this..". I have only been with this man for 25 years--"I said who are you calling for." He asked to speak to K. I said "Sure just a minute" I started to give the phone to K, when I remembered I was on the other line. I told him he would have to call back. He then called my cell phone saying. "See you are not letting me talk to the kids again. I have documented this and I will see you in court". Well, I didn't know he had put that on my cell phone. So, when I got off the phone, I had my son call him.....that is the kind of crap I have to put up with. It is definitely not fun.

#755297 08/07/03 01:24 AM
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Thanks Broken X 3,

I hope it goes well tomorrow at the lawyer's also. I am just so tired of the petty foolishness. I am tired of fighting.

But most of all, I want to protect the kids from his irrationality.

It is hard. Well, I had better get to bed--I bet it will be a long day tomorrow.

#755298 08/08/03 12:08 AM
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Hey m&m...

I have been following this... hugs and prayers...

All I can say is to have FAITH and do what is RIGHT... as long as you do right, he won't have a LEG to stand on.

It takes two to make it a fight or an argument and he will look pretty silly when you don't rebut. Don't participate in his shenanigans... don't let HIM get YOU riled up... it is not worth your peace of mind...

Do let the kids negotiate what goes on between them. DON't pick up his slack. Don't rescue him. Let him deal with the consequences. After a certain age you can't MAKE children visit... Let the kids make the decision BUT make him do all the arrangements and payment... THEIR visits to HIM are NOT your problem... my mom did nothing except ask when we were leaving and when we were returning.

Hugs and prayers,
Cali

#755299 08/08/03 12:34 AM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Cali:
<strong>Hey m&m...

I have been following this... hugs and prayers...

All I can say is to have FAITH and do what is RIGHT... as long as you do right, he won't have a LEG to stand on.

It takes two to make it a fight or an argument and he will look pretty silly when you don't rebut. Don't participate in his shenanigans... don't let HIM get YOU riled up... it is not worth your peace of mind...

Do let the kids negotiate what goes on between them. DON't pick up his slack. Don't rescue him. Let him deal with the consequences. After a certain age you can't MAKE children visit... Let the kids make the decision BUT make him do all the arrangements and payment... THEIR visits to HIM are NOT your problem... my mom did nothing except ask when we were leaving and when we were returning.

Hugs and prayers,
Cali</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">sufdb...yep.

#755300 08/07/03 02:55 PM
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Hey Cali and Sufdb,

Good to hear from you both..I know I need to withdraw from this mess...maybe now I will be able to do that when he sees that he can't just keep running over me. I did file reports on him this time---guess I should have done that when I had a restraining order on him. Then, maybe he wouldn't have been pushing so hard.

I know the wedding will be a problem...and hopefully, the kids will be able to tell him what they want to do. It is going to be hard because they don't have any days off of school then, they all probably have soccer that weekend, and he is getting married on a Sunday afternoon in southern Florida. He didn't even consider the kids when planning this wedding. (He did plan it on his father's birthday--which has always come first with him.)

The kids are afraid to have disagreements with him because he is so irrational. The drinking makes it worse. I am really going to encourage them to hang up when they feel he has been drinking. You can't rationalize with someone who has been drinking. Sometimes though, he is hard to rationalize with even when he hasn't been drinking. He is always Right!!

Oh well--I feel like a weight has been taken off today. We are off to Omaha again tomorrow. My daughter is going to miss her birthday party--we wouldn't have time to drive up on Saturday because of her first game being too early. So, I am going to take them to the zoo tomorrow. I heard it is great.

We won't get home again until late Sunday night--then off to work for me on Monday. Hard to believe it is already time to go back to work--where did the summer go?

Thank you all for your prayers and advice. I will definitely try to do better in this situation so that we don't end up like we did this week. Thanks again...Pat

#755301 08/07/03 03:00 PM
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Sorry,

I posted originally...and lost it. I met with my lawyer this morning. I presented him with my response to ex's letter...he thought it was great.

He is going to write to ex's lawyer...and submit my letter...and tell him to go ahead and file contempt charges. We will be prepared, if necessary to take him to court and have a judge decide the parenting issues.

So, I guess it went ok. I do feel like a big weight has been taken off. Better Run Pat

#755302 08/07/03 04:44 PM
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Pat,

glad you talked to your lawyer.

Have a good wkend.

We went back on today. Fun. However I have been in & out of the building for 2 wks

#755303 08/07/03 09:45 PM
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Hey Sing,

Thanks....I should be doing so much tonight. I am going to be gone all weekend and then back to work. I can't tho...I am just dead, physically and emotionally. I haven't felt like this in a long time.

Boy, you really went back early. I thought we were early next week. What happened to starting after Labor Day? I think they are trying to get year round school going eventually.

I sure wish I was ready to go back, but unfortunately, I feel physically drained. I didn't get half of the things done that I wanted to this summer. Oh well...Thanks for your posts...Pat

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