I read an article by Joyce Meyer, called "Black Balanced Relationships". The article was in a local Christian newspaper. (I'm trying to find a copy of the article online - so I can link to it from here.) Basically the article was about women in relationships with helpless, flawed men.

Some of the points Joyce made:

- staying with a person that has an habitual problem could be the worse thing you could do for them

- after you've already tried to help and love them, if they still refuse to change, it's not time to try to help anymore

- needy men and nurturing women end up together

- if he hasn't been able to accept and get help from God's love, what makes you think he will let you help him?

- do you want to adopt a child or to have a husband?

- men who are still children rarely grow up

- Proverbs 27:17 says,
"As iron sharpens iron, so a man sharpens the countenance of his friend."
two LIKE metals - NOT iron sharpens tin or vice versa! If you are in a relationship with someone who is of a very different mind and heart, of a very different level of maturity and morality, instead of sharpening each other you will be grating each other.

- if the relationship isn't bearing fruit for BOTH of the people in it, then it is out of balance

- sometimes we have high standards for the friends we keep, but much lower standards for the one we date (or marry)

I think I should read this article every day between now and when the divorce will be final LOL

I have to accept the fact that my serial adulterer WH is not just having AN affair - but his 7th affair (just counting the ones I know about); and he's not just tossing out morality and being dishonest and selfish because of the current affair or the midlife crisis - this is the way he's always been throughout our marriage (the way he was raised and he has never shown a genuine desire to change).

Like it or not, the OW really is more his type. They share common (literally COMMON) 'morals' (or rather lack of). WH truly doesn't understand let alone appreciate a woman like me and actually prefers the type who see nothing wrong with sleeping with a married man, sleeping with someone besides your spouse before the divorce is final. A woman like me is wasted on a man like him. They are equally selfish and irresponsible. They have no problem with dishonesty. They are both very shallow and materialistic, all that matters is appearances. Their most important emotional needs are being admired and having money spent on them. And it doesn't matter to either of them if the admiration is false and the money spent on themselves was taken away from the kids. Both the OW and WH have proven they don't care about my daughters (they just want us to go along with their pretense of concern and to not spoil their fun with any mention of the deep depression the daughters are suffering). You know, I think they really ARE perfect for each other.

More importantly, I KNOW I and my daughters can do much better.

<small>[ June 22, 2004, 01:20 PM: Message edited by: meremortal ]</small>

You go!

Just from reading this I know you can do better too. And you are right, you cannot change anyone. They have to make that change. And they usually only decide to make that change after something drastic has happened, and even then they seldom do.

MM-

Wow! What a great post! It really got me thinking about my WW and our marriage. I hope you can find the article and link it or at least let us know where to find it. It kinda puts a whole new perspective on things….

Thank you, that just put a whole new light on my day.
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That was a great post.

I need to read it every day myself.

Also...

This article reminded me of something else I read (and probably should read every day):

In the Divorce Busting book a seesaw analogy is used to explain that couples fall into patterns of polarization. If one spouse does all the worrying about, takes on more than their share of responsibility for, a certian area, the other spouse is free to slack off even more, confident the other spouse will pick up the slack. It's sort of an unbalanced way to achieve balance... weird.

So as long as one of the spouses is trying to save the marriage, resisting divorce, worrying about the affect on the kids, etc., the other spouse knows they can continue their affair for a while, stall at making the changes needed to save the marriage, proceed with divorce plans, etc.

Even in couples who have been separated for years, one or both dating other people, I've seen evidence of this going on. My husband left over two years ago, was involved with another woman for most or all of that time, filed for divorce, and has told me he hates me... BUT when I do manage to follow Plan B consistently he starts contacting me and wants to come home. (Unfortunately he is unwilling to make the necesary changes for me to allow him to come home.)

In the book Reconcilable Differences, there is a chart showing a 'line of reconciliation'. The natural tendency for each spouse to take turns wandering away from the line of reconciliation and then back again is shown as a wave pattern. Very seldom do couples just make a complete break, both wanting the relationship to end at the exact same time, neither having a change of heart later. Each spouse usually cycles between wanting a divorce/separation, then wanting to reconcile, several times. And the longer the couple has been together, the longer this cycling continues. It's not uncommon for this to go on for years, with real reconciliation remaining a possibility even when there are OP involved. In fact, the odds are that the marriage will outlast any affair as long as there is at least one spouse near or moving towards the line of reconciliation at any given time (and coincidentally there almost always is). I can't remember exactly what I read... but for each year you were married, it takes several months to 'get on with your life' AND starting another relationship before that closure is complete just puts the process on hold for a while instead of speeding it up.

IMO, the OP's ignorance of this process gives them false hope. For that matter, if this stuff were more common knowledge, very few people would bother to become involved with a person who is separated (let alone still living with their spouse). If the OP really understood how long it takes a marriage to completely end, and the odds that adultery will pay off for them in the long run, they would wait until the divorce is final no matter what the WS was telling them!
And even then (after divorce) sometimes there is reconciliation and the WS remarries the BS. One of the examples in the Reconcilable Differences book was a couple remarrying each other after they had been divorced about 8 years AND one of them had been married to somebody else for most of that time! So even in cases where the OP feels SURE the marriage is over... been separated for a long time and dating other people... IMO the OP is taking a big risk by not waiting for the divorce before becoming involved.

The book advises the spouse who wants to save the marriage to make a committment to stay at the line of reconciliation, to break their pattern of wandering away from time to time, so that when the other spouse cycles back to the line, they will both be there at the same time and THEN reconciliation can happen. (I guess that's sort of like Plan A?) BUT it is not advised to do this forever. Because of that seesaw stuff, IMO sometimes one partner parking at the line enables the other partner to stay away longer than they would have naturally. So then the staying spouse has to stay away from the line (sort of like Plan B), in order for the straying spouse to be motivated to return to the line.

This can become a cat and mouse game...
My WH seems to only want what he thinks he can't have...
For me the divorce will put an end to it.
Id' much rather have him feeling 'trapped' with and resentful towards an OW, missing me and blaming her for that, then have him back but wishing he was with OW.