Hi,<P>I've been at MB since Jan 01. Now OW claims she is preg. She did the home test and claims it came back positive. Well to add to this, so am I. Mine is a bit more conclusive, I saw the baby's heartbeat at the doctor's last week. <P>Anyway, H who is currently home wants to keep contact with OW until he is sure. I have put a long post on the GQII side about this whole ugly mess. <P>My question is how do you handle this? Contact with OWs while preg? What is his obligation? I don't trust OW for a minute. She and H secretly setup a voicemail account after he moved home, had sex 3 times in 5 weeks and now this preg thing. YUCK. I don't trust any contact between them at this point, yet understand to some degree if she really is preg where it may be necessary. I do firmly believe, she will use this as an excuse to keep her ea/pa with H going. She tells him she wants to go out with other men yet loves only him. Confusing isn't it!@?!? She earned the name Psyco Babble. This makes H jealous. YUCK. <P>I personally think contact via a 3rd party should be done. I have offered to be that 3rd party, if OW really is interested in the welfare of the potential child. Even though she has made statements of being preg, the rest of her actions and conversations are not maternal in any manner. She has no children and claims to have miscarried last year (blames me, I haven't even seen her yet). She did not gone to the doctor the last time and so far did not go this time. She is 45 years old so there will be other issues to consider. Double YUCK!!!!<P><BR>Anyway any insight is helpful. <P>Thanks,<BR>L.<BR>

Orchid,<P>Well, you have come to the right place to post your question. I am not in your situation, I am married and had a child by another man, but I have been around on this board since Oct 00. I have really gotten to know the women on this board, and know that they are wonderful people. I am sorry that you have to come to this part of the Marriage Builder's site. I would never wish it on my worst enemy!<P>Now, for the one part of your question that I feel the strongest about, should your H have contact w/OW while she is pregnant? Absolutly, positivly NOT!!!!! Not even for the little things that this woman is going to end up going through, ie: amnio, ultrasounds etc.... If he has moved back with you, and really wants to make your marriage work(and I'm sure you have heard this before) he needs to break any and ALL contact with this psycho OW! There really is nothing your H can do for the child at this point. It is entirely up to OW to seek medical help, and if she chooses not to, it is her fault and no one else's. Any contact/help your H gives OW is not supporting the child, but the OW. I am not completely familuar with your story(length of ea/pa, counseling...)but H really needs to get off the fence before he becomes castrated(a little phrase I used a few months ago for a similar situation) He can't have it both ways. His vows were to you, but if he continues to have one on one contact w/OW, those vows are being broken. <P>Hopefully, some of the others will be along to offer their advice to you, from their experience. I hope I helped in the answer I gave, from my experience.<P>Tigger

Orchid<P>If you want 3rd party mediator, I'm not sure it should be you at this point in your life since you are pregnant. It will add extra stress to your pregnancy and you and your baby DO NOT NEED that. My h didn't tell me until after oc was born. Relationship w/ ow consisted of 3 sexual encounters while extremely drunk and depressed. She got pg the 1st time, but didn't tell him til later. I was 3-4 mo pg at time. Looking back, I'm glad he waited until after the our baby was born because I was too distraught after d-day. Don't add extra stress to yourself, but do emphasize to your h that you need his complete support during this time. I wouldn't suggest much one on one solo contact w/ ow. Mine told truth, but also added lots of bs in hopes of completely destroying our marriage-ie beware of ow motives! If he does want contact and wants to make your marriage work, then suggest you be present w/ contacts. I believe ow less likely to be hurtful/ugly just so he doesn't see other side of her. Got to go. My little angel is calling. You've come to right place to discuss situation. A lot of these courageous women here have helped me through dark moments tharough their posts and encouragement. <P>ivc<P>

Orchid,<P>rest assure..the OW is not pregnant. It is extremely difficult to get pg at 45..this is my field of medicine..I am a Perinantal RN ( high risk OB RN). The egg at 45 is very difficult to penetrate usually Pg is achieved by IUI, or IVF at this age.....does it happen by accident? Of course<BR>but the Miscarriage rate at her age is up in the 50-60%..you had NOTHING to do with her miscarriage at age 44..I had 6 miscarriages age38-42 ( had a baby in the middle of it..but knew it was not going to be easy)...her miscarriage (if she had one) was due to OLD EGGS..and her rate of having a chromsomal abnormality at age 45 is 1:30 (in that range) so if she is preg and does not miscarry...hope you H is ready to take care of a downs child or worse...maybe that will keep the willy in his pants( sorry I just was where you are at) My H OW was 44, but H was NOT the father..this was also her first baby...and we have now heard rumors..that this could have been a donor sperm artificial insemination..or donor egg (we found out she had gone to fertility clinic) But she has vanished, she recieved alot of CS she will have to pay back.<P>Tell your husband ..that YOU ARE pregnant, and this witch of a woman..is upsetting you. tell him to stick to his NO CONTACT...because if he does not she may end up PG, and he should get on the internet and look up babies with Trisomy 21, 13 and 18 these trisomies can survive ( though alot end up in Miscarriages), he should read about their quality of life and what it takes to support these children...SORRY But I am really sick of these women...HOW DARE SHE!!!!..<BR>She is only doing this because you are pregnant...tell her and her OLD EGGS to stay the ****(there moderators I did it for you) out of your life.. NOW if your Husband needs medical proof. there is a test it is called a Beta Quantitive (blood test) if she is pregnant her doctor will be running this probably every other day...do see where the pregnancy is going the rate should increase by 66% (every 48 hours) if it is a viable pregnancy. if her doctor has not ran one..it is VERY approprate that she ask...Have your husband ask for a copy of that test. I bet she wont do it...CUZ she is NOT pregnant!!!!..anyway just rest assure...dont give her another thought...hopefully your H will wake the heck up!!!

Hi,<P>Thank you all for your support. Your words are helping me make it through today. <P>MyCross, I am not in the medical field but did learn about the % being lowered by her age. I am not far behind, I am currently 43 and will be 44 by the time my baby is born. So I am also in the high risk category. In addition to that, there is a fibroid tumor in my uterus that the doctor is monitoring. My condition was discovered last week. The doctor says the baby is not in danger but I need to be monitored. I have not told my boss or work yet (doc says I am about 8 weeks). I did let my boss know about the tumor but that is all. The problem is since my visit last week, I feel like I am already starting to show. I was like that with my 1st child (this is my 3rd preg - 2nd miscarried last year). I lost a lot of weight with the A diet, so I am self conscious that I will look prego even quicker. <P>Since I lost the last one at about 8 weeks, this is even adding to more stress. I am afraid I might lose this one also. I hate all of this coming down at once. But being a survivor, I will survive. My family outside 1 cousin, does not know of the preg. <P>One of the things that bothers me is that with such a high risk, OW has proved herself a very selfish woman in wanting to get pregnant. I fear for the life of her child irregardless of who the father is. See she has stated that she is will or has been with other men (H won't admit to that 100% so this child may or may not be his) but she did say H did not want her to date others when she wanted to. So much for this woman's morals, she is still married. <P>As far as her going to the doctor, I wish she would. Even though I loathe this OW, everyone needs proper care. However, I refuse to allow any member of my family to pay for her maternity care. If she does deliver a child, paying for that cost will need to be weighted but it will by no means be cheap. I am the one who carries the medical insurance for our family, so I hope her medical bills can not be extracted from me. <P>I am not sure what else I need to be dealing with right now. This is all so new to me. Guess I am kind of still in shock. Also, I am feeling emotionally drained and angry at H. My love for him has diminished so much I don't know where it will end up. <P>Thank you for the medical information. I will be sharing this with H. There is a lot to talk about and he speculates a lot in OWs favor. I resent that but have to deal with it for now. <P>Mahalo,<BR>L.<P><p>[This message has been edited by Orchid (edited June 15, 2001).]

Orchid,<P>There is still a BIG difference between 43 and 45...<BR>She has 2X a greater chance of problems ( trisomy's etc..)<BR>your risk is high but hers is TWICE AS HIGH... I know it seems strange but it is light years difference.. at OUR age they count in months not years. as far as the risks, and they usually do use the age that we are when we give birth.<BR>as far as your fibroid..I have seen babies delivered and the moms had fibriods the size of canalopes..of course location is important...and of course you will "show" sooner because of it. Sounds like your doctor is not too concerned...which is good.. Your Miscarriage was probably due to age ( like I said I have had 6, and have every test known to mankind to r/o any problems...all normal) which tells me I had "old egg" bad luck...you said you got a heartbeat...even YOUR Miscarriage rate now drops to 3 %...if the heartbeat was a good one. so just relax ( yea right) and do not be the go between for your H and witch lady....find someone else..you need to take care of you and your little one...Good Luck...MC

Dear MyCross, <P>You are such a wonderful person to be helping me. You have made my miserable day more bearable. Thank you for your info. My heavy heart is feeling a bit lighter. <P>So you are saying that even with the home preg test she still could not test positive? Not wishing or anything, just wondering. My doctor told me the baby looks strong. But the one I lost last year was about 8 weeks so I am a bit nervous. My first child was born when I was 37, he is a healthy boy, I was nervous with him also but he is fine. Kind of cute, if I may say so. <P>My fribroid is about a size of a golf ball at this time. Yes, I am starting to show. I am kind of scared of telling people I'm preg but I may have not choice. Otherwise, they'll look at me funny, maybe they already are! LOL!!!!<P>Here are the newest developments (this is starting to feel like d/d all over again, this play by play minute by minute stuff):<P>Now let's give you all some new info. OW is going to the doctor on Monday. OW claims not to have any insurance. Mind you this woman may not be divorced yet (checking into that status), so her H should be covering her insurance. All of a sudden she is saying she has to move to the east coast because her 'family' here will shun her. <P>Her are the new revelations I just learned today. <P>1. She doesn't have medical insurance. (she previously told<BR> H, that she was making about 80k a year, that salary<BR> you can buy your own if you are self employed)<P>2. OW's H believed in an open marriage and was fooling <BR> around on OW. (she previously told H in a e-mail I read <BR> last year that OW's H would be 'hurt' if he found out<BR> and that she needed to break it to him gently and once<BR> OW's H found out, he wanted to work on reconciliation). <P>3. OW's family will shun her for being involved with a M/m<BR> and now with an illegit child. (she previously told <BR> that her family would accept him with open arms and that<BR> they would love H & any children they had together, that <BR> her family was not unloving like H's family)<P>4. Here is the clincher: OW is asking H for $100.00 per <BR> month. Starting when and for what? I don't know. <P>Smell a rat? I do and it stinks...... <P>L.<BR>

Orchid,<P>goodness size of 1/2 golf ball?? dont even be worried..I had 2 of those when I was pregnant @41. Again a good heartbeat reduces your risk of miscarriage to 3% just like a 20 y/o.<BR>As far as YOUR OW...YOU WIN!!! SHE IS THE DEVIL HERSELF...she not only sounds psyco she is SCARY!!!..how dare your H risk you and your son to such a PSYCO...DO NOT GIVE HE A RED PENNY...You have that H of your insist she gets a blood test ( Beta Quantitive) your own doctor may have been doing these on you early on (every 48 hours) very common in us older woman esp with a history of miscarriage.<BR>If she refuses...she is a LAIR..and if by some small chance she is pregnant..then she will get state mandated aid...all states have it for anyone who is pregnant...Now you may have to pay it back in the future..if she claims H is the father and it is confirmed by blood test...but it will still be cheaper than paying private. GIVE ME A MAJOR BREAK..no ins and 80,000/yr...she needs her own show and take it on the road...I swear I thought my OW (houdini..we now call her) was the worst..nope you get that honor..<BR>so YOU are not responsible to give her anything...all states will presume her H is the father until a paternity test is done. I am bummed I am going out of town for the weekend...I cant wait to hear what she comes up with next..<P>TELL ME your H does not believe this???...I thought mine was gulliable ( my OW told him she was 38..she looks 68) court papers had her 44...MEN !!! I tell you...and my H has 2 advanced degrees...stupid just plain stupid ..sorry MB's I am trying to work on that LBing thing...just is not my thing..I spew it and then I get over it...if I hold it in it will fester...H is a good sport..he takes it like a WOMAN.(HEE HEE).. have a good weekend Orchid, when your H gives you more Babble from OW...do that "talk to the Hand" thing...and make sure he does not give money bags a dime..((((huggs to you and mini Orchid)))))

Orchid,<P>I'm sorry you're in this boat too. One, your H owes her NOTHING at this point. Can H agree that you should be XOW's contact?? If so, let her know at next available opportunity and stick to it-period; no need to let her jerk you guys around, trying to stay attached like a leach. IF she is pg and IF she carries to term and delivers, THEN you can request DNA BEFORE any ch-support is paid. It would then be up to you and H by joint agreement IF you both want to arrange visitation of OC (courts will back you up there). If the A was EA as well as physical, your H should not have ANY contact or his withdrawl starts from scratch with each contact. Hopefully this XOW is just trying to hang on by her nasty fingernails and this will blow over as nada...<P>Prayers to you today,<BR>J in recovery 2+years

Well, OW called to say she went to the doctor and they comfirmed she was preg. YUCK. Then she said the doc (all this told only to H, breaking the informal POJA), the doc told her she was high risk due to her age that her eggs were old. She needs to undergo extensive tests and is in jeporady of losing the baby at any time. H did not ask how far along she might be, just asked if she was showing. H figures 3 - 4 weeks. YUCK. <P>I asked for written proof from the doctor. OW again asked for money. H did not promise any. I told H that anything OW wants needs to be done via legal channels and I needed to see doctor's proof of everything she is saying. <P>I learned this driving home from work today. Not a pleasant trip. It is so hard to maintain composure with this type of info. Oh yea, OW complained again that she was annoyed with how I 'talked' to her last week. On the GQII post, I went into detail about who yelled at who. I was not the one who cussed or invaded her privacy. She called my home and called me a B, etc. <P>Anyway, that is the latest. <P>L.<BR><p>[This message has been edited by Orchid (edited June 21, 2001).]

Orchid, So sorry to hear of this recent pain and distress for you. I do not think at this time that your h should give the ow any money at all. This is just my view, but what if she really is not pregnant or what if it is not your h child. It would not be the first time a woman has used her condition whether true or not to just earn money. If your h really thinks it could be his child maybe putting some money aside each week and holding on to it would be a better way of preparing for the worst. If she loses the child then you keep it, if she carries full term and dna shows it is your h then after an amount is determined at least you would be prepared. In some cases back $ would be owed so this plan would also prepare you. You are in my thoughts and prayers, Peace, Gabi1116

Extensive TESTs GAG ME!!!!...she will have to do blood test every other day, and have Ultrasound @ 6 weeks to determine if there is a heartbeat. then later she will be offered an amnio(which everyone over 35 is offered), she will have to have 1 hour glucola about 25 weeks (which every pregnant woman has) Boy she is high risk ...NOT...age does not make you high risk anymore..it hasnt in years, they dont send you to a perinatologist for being older, only if you have a problem...and I dont see emotionally wacko, as a reason for high risk...NOW you on the other hand, having documented fibroids, will have to be watched, cuz they can grow...still they are common and you sould be OK. MONEY what in the H*** does she need money for??? if she is 3-4 weeks...did he pay her for sex and he didnt the last time???...if she is PG she will get state aid for PG..there will be no medical bills, they will even pay for her prenatal vitamins...tell her to go jump in the lake...and tell your H to wake UP!!!(sorry)...you are pregnant, with a viable pregnacy, he should be protecting you and the "real" baby...PERIOD...JMHO...sorry you have to be going through this, this should be a time of joy for you, and you should be only worrying about you..forget that Bimbo, she is so full of it...pay me money...yea...tell her to find a better street corner (sorry again)..best be going..this is a heated thing for me..you take care of you...and you only...(((huggs)))MC

<BR>Orchid,<P>I don't want to come across as unfair, unkind, or whatever. But you and your H should absolutely NOT give any money to the OW at all. Anything you give her is regarded as a gift. It will NOT be credited against a later child support judgment against your H. In fact, I have read of cases where gifts in excess of a state guideline CS order were considered extra income, and the CS order was ratcheted up forever as a result. You have absolutely nothing to gain by giving her money now, and you have a lot to lose. Don't do it. <P>Bystander

Orchid,<P>Let me tell you what you and your husband owe ow right now.......A BIG FAT NOTHING!<P>Do not let psyco babble talk you or him in to anything. You being a third party, someone else..here is what my opinion is for what it is worth. Even if you were for sure this baby is H (which you are not, esp if she is married and in an "open marriage" how disgusting!) Tell her to call when she has the baby and give her a number to a party you trust. Then you can have dna done etc...voila...then you can deal with her through the proper channels. Until then let her find her own moral support. Just my 2 cents...<BR>Love and Prayers<BR>bw

Hi,<P>Just current info. H informed OW that he will no longer be taking her calls. She is to call his pager in case of emergency only. Hm..... She was suppose to only call the house phone. H is changing his work phone and not giving her his phone number. <P>OW said that she did not want to call the house since she that would mean she could not 'freely' talk with H. Hm... Don't you get it OW? You can talk, just not the way you used to talk to H (dirty smutty stuff). That kind of talk should only be for your H not other M/M. <P>OW told him that she told her doctor that she has been 'abandoned by everyone' and that even the baby's father has 'abandoned' her. Then she proceeded to ask for $150.00 per month for 'prenatal care'. H said "I don't know about that". He was suppose to say, no get your own insurance or go the the state. Still too wimpy. OW has family and is still married. OW's H moved out but they are still married so legally he needs to cover her medically. I do not feel anyone in our family needs to provide her support financial or otherwise since this preg thing is what she personally wanted anyway. Now she may be having 2nd thoughts???? Thought this was an intelligent woman that said I was dumb? Hmmph..... Oh well, live with life's consquences. I told H, he does not have medical insurance, I carry it for our family. So in reality H is not even paying for my prenatal care, why should he even consider giving her money?<P>If anyone knows of the sites that show where OW can go to get assistance, can you send it to me? I just want to have it available, since H thinks I am making all this up. I have seen it before but don't remember the name. <P>She was a big talker about how much money she had, let her use her own money. Big manipulator. Oh am I venting? Yes and it feels good.<P>OW says she must go to the doctor weekly. Ok. Go. She wants the husbandly support. H says he can not support her because that would mean he has to abandon his family. H says he will not do that. <P>I guess the piece that hurts is the fact that H says he still doesn't know if he would go to OW if there were no children involved on either side. I guess it is a mute point but I just can't help feeling hurt that 10 month A can even compare to a 10 year marriage. Hmmmph..... need to get H to counseling. <P>Right now I am going up and down with this thought, even want to tell H to get out. Just pure frustration. H is in a depressed mood now and still is not meeting our needs. He is home at night in body but not in heart. He is still doing more for himself than for us and this hurts. H is angry that he has to give so much of his paycheck to pay for his bills. What he doesn't realize (even though I show him) is that his paychecks are only covering his bills and daycare, not even rent/utilities/food/misc/entertainment/family insurance,etc.<P>Right now I need to concetrate on what I can do. H needs to DO what he should and can. I expect nothing more. H is feeling the burden I have carried all these years. H does not like it, well neither do I but you don't see me crying. <P>I will be going to the doctor to tomorrow. I am a little apprehensive. I feel like I am growing quicker than I should be and know that could be a sign of diabetes &/or the fibroid(s). Had to go out and buy new clothes. That was a little fun but I am only suppose to be going on 10 weeks. My weight hasn't gone up just my size. <P>Thanks for letting me vent. <P>L.<BR>

Orchid,<P>How many previous pregnancies have you had? That can often cause you to look like you are growing too quickly. I just delivered my 4th child, and I know that I was HUGE! I was very concerned that I could have had the pregnancy induced diabetes, or a much larger baby.(Abbi was 9 lbs 4 oz and a week early) Also, your muscles may not be as tight as when you were in your early 20's, so they don't hold the baby in as tightly. At least that's what my Dr told me when I questioned him about my size. I had also gained about 60 lbs by the time I delivered. I didn't have any complications, as far as medical problems, just some major joint and back pain due to Abbi's size and how low I was carrying her. I believe that I was also out of my regular clothes by about 12 weeks, but can't quite remember. I will pray that all goes well for you at your appointment, and will look for your update.<P>Tigger

Hi Tigger,<P>One full term 7 years ago, 1 miscarriage at 8 wks (last year) and this current one). I had pregestational diabetes with my first preg and failed the 1st test with my 2nd. Diabetes runs on both sides of my family so I am concerned. Also, being 43 has its major disadvantages. At the last ultrasound, the fibroid was much larger than the fetus so I am concerned at its growth pattern. Guess I won't know anything until tomorrow. All the speculation in the world is not going to make things better or worse. Gotta bit the bullet and just wait. <P>L.<P>

Updated status: I went to the doctor for my 3 week visit. As suspected something was wrong. The fetus did not have a heart beat so I had to have a D&C done today. Now the only one left is the OW's child. This 'mis-misscarriage' was harder to take this time than the last because of this A issue. I was very angry at my H. H even said that he wished our child was the one that survived. That was not to be. <P>I must now muster the strength to deal with the possibility of the OW's child being a reality. This is going to take a lot strength for me. I have been reading your posts and learned a lot from many of you out there. <P>Tonight is a sad one for us. We told our 6 year old of the lost baby. Our son always wanted another child. We told him since his cousin just had a 1/2 brother born and the 2 boys speak of these things quite often. I did not want our son to think we were holding out on him. NOw he is asking for another baby. This is so hard. I don't think I can do this again. <P>Well, that is all for now. I need to go and get some rest, but I am almost afraid to go to sleep. <P>L.<BR>

Dear Orchid,<P>I am so sorry for your loss. You are in my thoughts<BR>and prayers at this sad time in your life.<BR>Try to rest, you are even more vunreable now.<BR>I wish there were easy answers as to why these things<BR>happen...please take care, fluke

Dear Orchid,<P>I am a long time member of the MB Forum but I have not been able to post much lately. I read your thread this morning and just want to tell you how deeply I feel for you over the loss of your child.<P>I am in the midst of a high risk pregnancy and I have had multiple miscarriages over the past few years. I know how painful it is to lose a child. My H produced his OC when I was in the midst of suffering one miscarriage after another and undergoing tons of fertility treatments. The news that another woman was carrying my H's child when I was trying so hard without success was completely devastating.<P>I know how hard it is, but, for your own sanity please don't deal with the OW at this time. Tell your H that whatever will happen in the future, if the OC actually materializes, you will deal with then. But, for now, he is expected to take care of you and to rebuild your life together.<P>I hope he will understand the type of torture you will be going through if you have to deal with this OW's pregnancy at this time. You will be constantly in my prayers. God does answer prayers and He does help us find our way if we ask. Please don't give up hope. I went through so much before giving birth to my two children, but I don't regret it for a minute.<P>For each of my miscarriages, I put whatever mementos I had (doctor appointment cards, ultrasound pictures, etc.) in a shoebox with the name of the child on the outside. People do not understand that a child in the womb is a child just as real as your son. From the moment we find out we have hopes and dreams for that baby. Take your time and allow yourself to grieve fully for that lost child and lost dreams.<P>May God bless you and give you strength,<BR>love,<BR>heavenly