Welcome to the
Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum

This is a community where people come in search of marriage related support, answers, or encouragement. Also, information about the Marriage Builders principles can be found in the books available for sale in the Marriage Builders® Bookstore.
If you would like to join our guidance forum, please read the Announcement Forum for instructions, rules, & guidelines.
The members of this community are peers and not professionals. Professional coaching is available by clicking on the link titled Coaching Center at the top of this page.
We trust that you will find the Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum to be a helpful resource for you. We look forward to your participation.
Once you have reviewed all the FAQ, tech support and announcement information, if you still have problems that are not addressed, please e-mail the administrators at mbrestored@gmail.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 4 1 2 3 4
Joined: May 1999
Posts: 3,369
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: May 1999
Posts: 3,369
The more I think about this, the more I think that the OW or Abandoned Adult Children in pain living with their resentment, shouldn't be lamenting the "abandonment" and No Contact issues here on Marriage Builders where the majority of the posters are Betrayed Spouses who had nothing to do with the conception or birth of the child.

Since most of us are Betrayed Spouses and don't even know the NC OC, debating the NC issues over and over and over again just seems so redundant since nothing we can do or say makes any difference. It's like talking to my plumber about opening a checking account or asking my banker to fix my leaky sink. There ain't no connection...there ain't no obligation.

I suppose since Betrayeds are the closest people to the non-posting Waywards who do not read here, or care to, it seems the OW (or other people taking issue with No Contact and their own abandonment heartburn) feel compelled to dump it on the Betrayeds who are the ones hurt the most by the existence of an OC and the LAST people on the planet to be scolded about this issue that had nothing to do with them.

All this does is cause endless arguing and debate over something that has nothing to do with one side of the coin other than whether or not the Betrayed is reluctant to include OC into her life. And this takes time and the time line never corresponds to the OW's desires and demands. This topic is now and always will be at stalemate.

I guess I just don't get why this is our problem or why OW's keep after us about NC. It isn't our kid or our doing or our decision. I hate it when people who have done me wrong expect me to fix their mess and turn my life upside down to accomodate their intrusiveness into my life. especially when they have made my life a living hell in the process and never gave me or mine a thought or a care.

Now that I am five years post D-day, we are recovered enough where we could be actively involved in our OC's life but the OW never wanted that from us...just the cash. There isn't much we can do about that. Contact is something we would welcome at this point in our marriage but we had to go through the stages of recovery to get to this place.

Catnip =^^=

<small>[ December 26, 2003, 03:40 PM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>

Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 2,430
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 2,430
Thank you KT--point taken. I hope ST and others READ your story and take it seriously (WOW! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> ), but not holding my breath.

catnip, you're right on, but you know how much we like to skwabble. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> I'm surprised to hear you both feel you could handle visitation now, but we all know XOW isn't interested. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

ST, I'm talking to a brick wall. DH and I TRIED to stay in touch long-distance for the child's sake for 4 years. Like so many others, XOW made it CRAZY. Everything is filtered through the mother. If XOW can be believed, it seems she played up H's existance and absence, almost as it she enjoys OC crying for him--very awful, very twisted. XOW doesn't want ME to have anything to do with the situation. H and I were sending things together by joint agreement, but when H deployed, XOW emailed that things sent by me (my handwriting, both our names) had no meaning for them, that only H matters, only H should contact them, I should stay out of it, etc. etc.etc. There's much more insanity, but the last straw was when XOW sent pictures of OC with nasty sarcastic comments on the back AND a picture of a location she'd had sex w/H years earlier (with comment!)! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I REGRET contact. Contact only gave fuel for XOW to make OC cry. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> We cannot save OC from her mother, but we can save our family from her!

Another case I know involves an ex-wife who threw away long-dist. dad's letters, never let him talk on the phone, made him look bad, etc., and the one time dad had visitation, she called the cops and pretended it was a kidnapping! Gee, I wonder why he gave up?

Your nice relatives overseas and this stuff is NOT the same, ST. Please face reality.

<small>[ December 27, 2003, 03:06 AM: Message edited by: Jenny ]</small>

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 42
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 42
Jenny, why do you keep putting in snide remarks towards me? If you don't like the topic, don't read it.

As for your situation, of which I know ONLY what you've written on this thread, I'd say you and your family have tried to do the decent thing and been wrongly treated in return. At least you tried, and I don't think people can do more than that. The mother of the OC has not done right by her child, when you clearly have.

All of the things I've said - you've done with the OC in your situation - so you MUST agree and share my principles, no? If so, why do you continue to insult me? Is it something you see in yourself that you don't like about me?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

<small>[ December 27, 2003, 04:32 AM: Message edited by: Still Trying ]</small>

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 227
P
Member
Offline
Member
P
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 227
Jenny, What's up??

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do you really want to hear from people? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wasn't it you that said, be open to new possiblities?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do you just not care about reality, nothing could ever change your mind? And if so, why BOTHER with the thread??

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Who's reality are you talking about?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">ST, GET REAL! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Your nice relatives overseas and this stuff is NOT the same, ST. Please face reality.

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Again, who's reality Jenny? Must it be your reality, otherwise it's not reality?

I don't think so.

Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 908
N
Member
Offline
Member
N
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 908
Well you already know my feelings on this, but I will go further on this. KT, the xow is wrong with what she is doing with her child. It does not matter if it's her xh or xmm or one night stand etc. If she went for cs, then she has to take whatever comes with that and live with that. You can't have your cake and eat it too. With my stbxh, I share transportation. In fact I do most of it. No, we don't live in another town, but still it is not always convieant for me to go over to his place to pick my kids up but I do. It should of been put in your court papers seeing you don't live in the same town that driving is shared. As far as the child haveing to go to two homes, well I'm sorry, it can work out and is not as bad as that said. My kids know that there home is here with me. But they also know they have a home with there dad. I have primary custody of the kids but he keeps toys and some clothes there and has books etc there for them. Yes it would be best if our marriage could of worked out, but it did not and they are much happier this way. Yes there are ajustments, but they are working out. I have said this before and will say this again. If xmm decides to have contact, I know it has to include his family. For better or worse, that is the way it is. Unless his w is treating this child wrong I can't do a thing about it. That is HIS family and it's best for the situation. Why would I want him to "sneak" around to see his daughter? It would have to be out in the open and therefore his family is included. As far as cs goes.....I don't blame xmm 100%. Anyone who has kids and is receiving cs knows that it cost alot of money to raise kids. I get cs for my twins and it's not bad money, but between the cost of there expenses his cs does not cover all there expenses. He is giving me what is required of him and that is why I work extra to give them more. A lot of people do it. What's the big deal? I would go after my xh for support just as I will when this child is born. I don't want his life savings, I don't want to take away from his kids, I just want him to help with OUR mistake. I don't care that he is not able to make a decision with my body. He made a decision when he knocked on my door one or two times a week. That is a dead issue. Do I think it's in the best interest of my daughter to see him....yes. He's her father. If the 3 adults can't do it correctly and put her needs first then NO. It won't work. The adults have to be the "adults" and make it work. Which means all have to put feelings aside and do what's right for all kids involved. I've already learned from this site and have figured out there is a 99.9% chance that my baby's father will never be involved in her life. At this point in my life I'm ok with that. I also know it's him and not his Wife making the decisions. As wife does not know a thing. So I look at this as HIS LOSS. I'm sorry if you all don't agree with that statement. I would look at that with xh as well. It does not matter the title.....it's just the way I feel. It's the way I felt before this devastion happened. I think also that especialy in my case, xmm has left me no choice but to go the legal route and expose this. He has ran from this totally. He has said he would take the financal responsiblity. He has asked me for DNA testing through amino. I made 2 appointments and he has not complyed. He has ignored me through them. He is going to force me to have him served and have his family find out that way and spend extra money on attorneys to get him to even take the dna test. Now this is a man I was with for 13 months and saw 2 or more times a week and talked to at least 6 times a day. It was not a one night stand. So why should I allow him off the hook? I may not have the history of the wife, but I still have a history with him. He lied to me as he did the wife. I guess I'm trying to say, no matter what he has said to any of us, there is two sides to this coin. And even though most bs don't feel that the ow is affected or should I say has the "right" to be affected, she is. Feelings are feelings no matter what. In my case, xmm should be thanking his lucky stars that I AM who I AM or I would of already exposed him with all his crap. I won't do that to his kids though. I feel bad enough that it will happen when my daughter is born. They deserve better than that....they are innocent too. But as so many bs have said, I have to think of my daughter.

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 21
L
Junior Member
Offline
Junior Member
L
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 21
There are some very insightful posts on this thread. Alot to think about.

Lynng, if nc facilitated this level of healing as you say, I'd hate to know what contact would have done for you.

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 778
L
Member
Offline
Member
L
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 778
Oh, I'm fine. I have been reading here for months and am angry that the hurting people here are forced to read and get hurt by the other women whining about their plight, with no thought or remorse as to the harm their behavior has inflicted on others.

They see the obvious pain and suffering and come on here and whine constantly about the poor oc, with out a thought to the wives and husbands here who are fresh at this hurt. They seem to derive great pleasure from the hurt they spew forth. That is what gets my wrath.

As for my own life. I'm fine. I am a very strong woman and have very strong opinions. I feel protective for all the hurting women on here who are, right now confused, hurt and angry. I want them to know that they will be ok. That their feelings are ok. That their anger is normal. But above all I want them to know that it will all work out and they will be happy again, no matter what they decided to do. I don't want to see these people coerced into contact with the ow/oc just to apease others.

Contact would have never happened. That boy is not my responsibility, and had my H wanted contact our marriage would have ended.

If I sound angry it's because I am. I can't even believe that some woman would post on here how awful the poor little oc has it, how everyone should put needs of the oc first. How selfish. I would hate to see some poor hurting woman feel that she has to accept this oc to make life easier on everyone but herself. That is what makes me angry.

Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 908
N
Member
Offline
Member
N
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 908
Lynn, although a few have, not all have....speaking of ow. Sometimes I wonder if you just read the parts you want to and not the whole post. I don't see myself thinking only of myself and just my child. In fact quite the oppisite. I have put my feelings aside for xmm kids feelings over this. Most here are defined with there thoughts on this, but can at least see the other side of the coin. You on the other hand only see what is best for you and so when someone disagrees with you they are selfish and out for themselves. That in itself is selfish. Don't you think when it comes to ALL OUR children we are somewhat selfish and tend to look out for what's best for them.....and depending on what side of the coin your on is where your choices and reasons lie? Also, just because we have different thoughts on the subject does not make us selfish and just looking out for ourselves. It's just what is best for our situations. It's clear you are fine with all the choices you've made years ago and the way you went about doing them. That is great for your family and it worked for you. It does not mean it works for everyone. What I think of how you handle it matters very little. I'm not involved nor does it affect me in anyway. Nor is it my place to really judge you. Although I disagree with most of what you say I have learned from you and that I thank you for. I just don't understand why you can't accept anybodies thoughts that don't go with yours.

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 778
L
Member
Offline
Member
L
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 778
Oh, I agree that we all look out for our own children, that is for sure. I understand that the OW adore their babies. As mothers, we all do.

I was responding to Cee Cee. Her post was so, odd.

I know that their are lots of people with lots of hurt. But what I find selfish is that some people just automatically assume that the only innocent one is the oc. That is where I speak of selfishness. They assume that all the adults need to be adults and put the needs of the oc first. Yet, do not these same adults need to think of the others who are hurt also? It is extremely selfish to believe that one person is the only one hurt, and matters (i.e. OC). These wives are hurt also. They have children who have lives that are also torn apart. The hurt is all over the field here. The oc is innocent, to be sure. However, oc is not the only one. And I find it selfsih that some think that everyone needs to put the needs of the oc first, without thought or care of the other innocent people. It sounds as if once the oc is born, all other people, hurt or not, need to stuff their feelings and set aside their wants and needs so as not to hurt or upset the oc.

I am fully aware the the oc is an innocent child, and can be hurt by this. But, I am also fully aware of my own children and their hurt and their needs. Their needs and hearts are not to be pushed aside. In my home they are the innocent victims of this too.

I have never said OC is not an innocent child, but so to are the children of the marriage, the wife, and anybody who has been hurt and upset by the affair.

Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,342
G
Member
Offline
Member
G
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,342
While waiting to go to a wedding reception.....

LynnG, my husbands DR and wife have an older oc also. He treats me so softly whenever I go there and she is a confidant. Having said that, it's good to have women like you and Texasgirl, and ember here. You are all way past d-day and have continued on together...it obviously was a choice you and your H made together.

I think for the most part I'd like to leave this site. It sometimes makes me so sad for newcomers.

It's women like LynnG, and Texasgirl, and ember that make me want to stay and repeat my story.

Although all stories are the same, we all have different circumstances.

Catnip I haven't forgotten you! How could I? You were as I am now when you said things could work out. I prayed so hard. I never believed you but it came to be.

Needtomoveon,
Now listen to me as I won't flame you.

We also had men at our childrens births. Husbands, no doubt, but it was a happy time.

Not once was I abandoned because my husband had another woman in his life.

That is how it is for you and I am so sorry for you.

My husband and I cherished the birth of our baby. How sad because you believed a man a mere while and he may not be able to be there for your D. Um excuse me...the both of yours D.

At the risk of sounding redundant, you knew he was married and he was lying to his wife, after all is in the open, why would he protect someone who did what you did? His wife to him now is a saint...for better or worse and she has seen the worse!

See even though there are problems in a marriage, the one who steps outta line and their lover are the ones to get the worst backlash from friends and relatives. Then the WS almost always does what it takes to get back in the good graces of BS and family.... leaving the female op in the cold.

I am sorry this happened to you.

I am not trying to say your feelings are wrong. I am telling you that as the wife of a WS, and three years past, if the WS wants the marriage he'll do whatever to make things right.

As far as N/C....I also feel it's the only way to go on.

To have an oc around to me would be having my worst humiliation in my face.

Sorry if you guys don't agree...

Maybe I'll stick to the private board after this.

I really am sick of the way things turn into arguements about everything lately.

Needtomoveon you will see things differently some day.

Peace and prayers,

love
Debi

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 338
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 338
***email/webcam/letters & photos/telephone and perhaps a single visit for a few weeks on the summer school holidays each year***

What a stupid idea !!!!!
And just how are these methods suppose to work with an infant or very young child ?!!! Do you expect a 12 month old child to answer an e-mail, read a letter or talk on the phone ??!!!!
All that does is keep MM in contact with OW which is exactly what most OW want anyway and just what the MM is trying to get away from.
As far as visiting goes. Just who is suppose to pay for the cost of plane fare or long distance car travel??!! For many, after cs is paid there is NO extra money for such luxeries. And if the child does come and stay just who do you think is going to be taking care of it . MM ??!! Hell no. The BS is the one that will be stuck home caring for a child that isn't hers and just brings back painful memories.
You all have such lovely ideas of how things would be in a perfect world, unfortunatly this is not a perfect world.
You see things in black and white with no room for the possibility that you don't have a clue about what you are talking about. You are all so anxious to place the blame away from yourselves and to make everyone else in the picture look like the villian and you look like the poor little women that the big bad man abandoned.

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 178
T
Member
Offline
Member
T
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 178
hmm....interesting thread. A few things...Catnip, I don't know all the circumstances surrounding your story but had xMM decided on NC and then 5 years later wanted contact I would also say no...I think. I guess it would depend where I was in my own life and if I thought it would be detrimental to my child. There is also the question of what if he made contact and then changed his mind again. Unlike the BS in this scenario, the OW has not had the opportunity to re-build trust with the child's father and if it were me, I would not trust him to be a constant in the child's life. Make sense?

Okay, I am going to be perfectly honest here...I know why xMM and his wife have chosen NC. It is very simple really...he and I can not be trusted together and the set-up we had in place was for him to visit where I live without his wife. There is very little doubt in my mind, and I am sure his, that this would have lead to the affair continuing. The feelings after being together for three years were too strong for either of us to fight. I think we proved that when he came here for the birth...after months of not seeing each other, it took only hours for the affair to start again. The ONLY way to stop the affair is never to have contact again. Not saying every case is such, I am sure most aren't...but in our case it is. Sorry if that offends anyone, but sometimes affairs are about love and profound attraction. I'm not sure if I ever want to risk seeing him again.

One last thing...I agree with Catnip, this debate is futile. In my mind the question I have for the BS is why do YOU insist the WS chose between you and his/her child...if that is indeed the case. Aren't you afraid of future resentment or am I way off base?

Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 2,430
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 2,430
ST, the snide remarks are because I'm angry at being painted by your broad brush: "no contact is a crock for the child, AND dad's to blame." As in, "how can H look himself in the miror?"
[Is that not inflamatory?! Read some of your snide comments to Tony!!]

Our XOW blames my H's lack on contact on ME. OC will grow up thinking I'm the big bad witch that keeps her father from her, and the way you talk is not much different. That makes me angry <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> and sad <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> . It's lible of character and I'm sick of it.

REPEAT: ...when I tell our story... a person like yourself will say something like "oh, THAT makes sense, but I'm not talking about a case like YOURS!" Sure enough, heeeeere we go again!

Many people in my position, on this board, have tried to "do the right thing" and got shot down by XOW. But YOU started a thread on how terrible ALL "abandoners" and no-contactors are! Don't be surprised I or others feel defensive.

Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 472
T
Member
Offline
Member
T
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 472
My H's OC will be 10 in Jan. My son turned 10 in Sep. He chose NC because he believed the OW deliberately got pregnant after he told her I was pg and he was ending his affair with her.
He told me she gambled that if she was pregnant he would choose her over me. He told me the only reason he got involved with her was because she represented no responsibilities. He was going thru major midlife crisis, felt he had accomplished nothing in his life at age 38.
WE worked on our marriage, which I think would have been difficult to do if we had had to deal with the OC/OW situation at the same time.
The other thing was we lived in 2 different states. We were in Ky then, she was/is in N.Carolina. Now we are in TX and the distance is even greater. He traveled to N.C. on a regular basis then, and the job he did there was no longer needed.
Now sometimes I feel bad and wonder about that child. I would have/could have embraced her if I had been allowed. However, she is not my concern, she is her mother's child and my husband's child. My responsibility is to my children; ensuring their quality of life is my job.
I did what was best for my children. When the time comes we will deal with the OC. Her mother is not part of our lives. If she wants to visit us we will accomadate her.
NC maybe heck for the OC, but it will be heck for the children of the marriage. Do you think there would not be resentment toward that child for what he/she represents to those children?
There is competition between children who are natural born siblings. The competition between siblings in this situation would be tremendous.
In a perfect world the brothers and sisters would accept each other and glory in their relationship. But we don't live in a perfect world.
We all do the best we can, make the choices right for US and those we love.
I feel we made the right decision. It was the right decision for our marriage and our children.
I didn't ask for your blessing.
Did the OW ask for mine when she slept with my H, when she got involved with my H?
She took the risk when she slept with a married man. She knew that she was on medication that might negate her birth control pills, yet she didn't tell him to use another form of birth control. She knew the risk, she knew I was pregnant.
He said she gambled and lost. She had her child and we have ours. She gets money from us every month until her dau graduates from HS.
I take responsibility for my actions, my H took financial resoponsibility for his, (that mistake being having sex with a woman not his wife); the OW must take care of her mistakes. She has a child to raise.
What would she have done if she had been married and had a child and that man died? Would she moan and groan that her husband abandoned her and their child? NO.
You accept what you can't change and go on.
An OW has a child from her affair, she knew the risks and has to live with them. So rather than be bitter, raise her child to be a good person and not repeat her/his mother's mistakes.
I know if we had divorced my H would never have been an active member of my children's lives. Not because of his choice but because of the distance. I would have returned to Texas and he would have probably stayed in KY or gone to PA where his parents were.
We couldn't have afforded to send all 5 children to PA and he would have had to work to pay child support for 5 children. I don't think he would have had time to visit.
Well I have run on. I hope this makes sense.
The main thing is how contact would affect the marriage and the children of the marriage. Those are the concerns of the couple and their priority. The OW's concerns are herself and her child. Sometimes they cancel each out.

Basically, get over it! People make choices and have to live with them. In your case you feel the choice of NC contact sucks. Well in my case it would have.
I bet you didn't get all you wanted for Christmas either. Did that cause tremendous pain?

Texasgirl

<small>[ December 27, 2003, 07:59 PM: Message edited by: Texasgirl ]</small>

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 178
T
Member
Offline
Member
T
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 178
Jenny...starting out by saying I don't know your story but can I ask...why does your exOW think it is your fault? I am wondering because I was told by xMM that it was his wife's fault that he can't be in his child's life...something I don't buy for a minute. Nobody makes anybody do anything against their will. He said, and I will try and quote.."the only way I can stay a part of my children's (of the marriage) lives is if I never have contact with OC again. She told me I had to chose between them."

It is beginning to baffle me why the women are fighting each other when clearly the men in our lives are lying to all involved. I was harsh with Tony, because I truly feel that the MM bears the brunt of the blame in most situations. Yes we knowingly get involved with MM but the women I know are snowed by charm and lies and of course all those false promises and the dreaming out loud. Not saying I am blameless...not at all...and I am paying the consequenses, have been for years, but at least I am taking responsibility for my actions and not putting the blame for my decisions on a convenient scapegoat. (the wife).

For the record, I don't plan on telling my child that it is all the big bad wife's fault. Blame serves no good purpose in this area. I didn't care whose fault it was that my parents abandonned me, the reality was that it was done and nothing could make that pain go away.

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 338
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 338
****because I truly feel that the MM bears the brunt of the blame in most situations***

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

When I was 17 I had a MM tried to get me involved with him and even at that age I knew he was full of [censored]. Why does every single ow think their story is going to have a happy ending ??
And lets just say your MM did leave his wife and children for you. Then wouldn't you be guilty of making him choose between his children's happiness and you ?
Just what is the difference ???!!!

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 178
T
Member
Offline
Member
T
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 178
where did I say I would make him choose between never having contact with his children again and being with me? I don't use children as blackmail and I believe what I was saying was I don't believe his wife is either. I think he's lying again. If THAT offends you, then clearly you do need to perpetuate the war with the other woman your husband lied to. You don't think he is more to blame for cheating on you than she is? I don't get that...he is the one who betrayed you...if it wasn't her, then it would have been with someone else.

Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 908
N
Member
Offline
Member
N
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 908
Gemni, I did not take it as a flame at all. First of all though, his wife knows nothing of us, the baby etc. There has been no d-day as of yet. Yes I do feel that he betrayed me. I was there for him and he lied to me and everything was great until I told him I was pregnant. What do I get from that? Just that.......he lied to me. As far as the wife goes......that's another story. Won't go into now. Your right though, I knew he was married. The mere fact that he complained of being so unhappy and was with me all the time and talked to me all the time and all has nothing to do with anything.....he was married. I was old enough to know not to get sucked into it. Trust me everyday I say stupid stupid stupid stupid. I knew this man for 15 years and thought I knew him, but hey stupid me. And you know what......I don't expect him to be there for her birth. I think at this point it would be well....just weird. That is a intiment(sp?) thing you know? Alot has happened since I told him I was pregnant. I don't have that trust that comes with it anymore. I have had alot of reality since I became pregnant. It's to bad it took this to open my eyes and see what I have done as well. But as far as xmm.....and I'm not saying this about all, but his wife knows nothing....he is not protecting his wife and kids right now. He's protecting his own butt. At anytime I could of open this all up and he knows it, but he also knows the person I really am and in my opinion taking advantage of that. He was the one that asked me to do a DNA test through amino as soon as possible and he is also the one who ignored two different appointments that were at his request. Awhile I posted and someone here stated in a remark that I made about his actions that no time is a good time.....that's right there is no good time, but if he really wanted to make things right don't you think he would of gone to his wife and told her before someone else could tell her? We live in the same city, and work in the same area. I was in Starbucks the other day and felt someone staring at me from behind.....I turned around and low and behold it was him...as soon as I turned around he turned his head and we never even spoke. I see him now as spinless swine. He knows that I'm still legally married (but seperated) and that when I told stbxh he filed for divorce. In my state my husband can be legally responsible even though and with that he is allowing that to happen. My stbxh told me if xmm comes forward he won't divorce me until after the child is born that way I'm covered on insurance, and xmm does not care. How selfish is that? He would rather take the chance of me loosing my insurance for myself and the baby and having to pay 1/2 of all the costs then to just do what is right. So am I out of line to feel the way I feel? You can't see at all where he is spineless and selfish? Only thinking of himself? He does not want his kids to know ever but instead of doing what's right he is waiting for me to serve him with papers? As far contact goes.....I really don't want someone like that in her life. But I know if he changes his mind I have no choice and have to think about her and her needs first. I don't think I will have to cross that bridge though. At some point I know I'll have be in a relationship with somenoe later. Either he accepts me and my children or not and what goes with it. I made these choices to keep her and have to take what goes with it. I don't have any visions of xmm ever coming back into my life. The only vesions I have is getting this over with him and him finally allowing me to get on with my life as he has. I hope you understand better what I've said. And I never took it as a flame Gemeni. Although I got into a soap box.....it goes back to we all do what is best for what we have gone through and really no matter how old our kids are we do what's best for them and what we have to do to protect them. Depending on the side of the coin is what we feel about our situation.

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 42
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 42
N/c is a crock for the child.

It may make perfect sense to the WS, BS, and OW. But is it RIGHT for the child?

Jenny seems to think this thread is about her, I don't see her name in the title anywhere, but right from the start I'm "painting" her situation with a "broad brush". Jenny, I don't know who you are, I did not have you in mind when I started the thread, so go away if you get upset by the topic please. Every other poster seems to be able to state their views and share their experience without being nasty. You COULD have done that too. Did you have the best of intentions towards your H's OC? If so, you agree with what I'm saying. If not, well you sound like a hypocrite and no wonder it didn't turn out.

Like Twilight says, there are women bickering here, and the person who did cause the problem is staying silent.

Yes, the children of the marriage are innocent and deserve not to be hurt either. It's a shame their father didn't believe so strongly about that while he was spending family money and family time with OW. Why was he so willing to jeopardise his children's future?? Leaving out one-night stands, most of these MM devote months and years to jeopardising their children's future. They plan, they lie to achieve it, they plot about "when" they are going to leave their families, but alas when OC enters the picture, suddenly the wife and children are IMPORTANT. The men are so full of **** - but we'll argue forever that they are only thinking of what's best for their children. Well, imo, they continue to be liars, because the only person benefitting is themselves. They HAVE hurt the wife and children, they HAVE hurt the OW and OC, and carrying out that planned hurt didn't stop them from doing it, so to use "hurt" as the reason for n/c is justification at it's finest.

It hurts to know that you are married to a lying sack of ****, but we all better get used to it. We know what they are capable of and stay anyway.

If all adults DID do the right thing - that includes WS and OW - is there anybody who thinks n/c is still BEST FOR THE CHILD?

That there is a possiblity for an OC means that our husbands don't/didn't care about the repurcussions on our children - THEIR children. But somehow, the OW is supposed to take greater care of his children than him............I despair for your children if you think every other stranger/non blood-related person is more responsible for them than their very own two parents.

I don't think EITHER parent should contribute more than the other. It should be shared and be as fair as can be.

If a parent lives a great distance away, then costs can be SHARED.

jtigger, I don't expect a non-custodial parent to do any more in this situation, than I would expect a non-custodial parent to do after divorce as it pertains to a small child. The ADULTS can periodically update the other parent with information etc. I wouldn't think a 3 month old OC would benefit from any time with it's father than if a 3 month old child of divorced parents would benefit from any time with it's father. I thought that sort of stuff would be common sense - but you obviously missed it. Do you really think ANY baby cares ultimately WHO feeds it or cares for it?

I would be interested to hear how you think divorced parents (let's say they divorced very shortly after birth) should handle custody of that child.

Joined: May 1999
Posts: 3,369
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: May 1999
Posts: 3,369
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by twilight:
<strong> Catnip, I don't know all the circumstances surrounding your story but had xMM decided on NC and then 5 years later wanted contact I would also say no...I think.

=^^= My husband was diagnosed clinically mentally ill and has been ill since 1997 or perhaps even before then. He lost his 18 years of sobriety in 1997 and was unable to regain his sobriety until June 2003. He was prescribed an incredibly strong drug in 2000 after his suicide attempt but that was not effective until June 2003 either. During those five years, we faced losing our business, bankruptcy, forced divorce, foreclosure, 65% to 100% of his wages garnished and the very real possibility that we were about to lose everything we had worked so hard for during our twenty year marriage. The LAST thing we worried about was contact with the OC. In fact, we were fighting for our very basic survival and had neither the time, the energy or the inclination to consider the OC. We were almost homeless and my husband was in no shape to be any good to or for OC. Our recovery was delayed during his illness and our recovery did not actually begin in earnest until June 2003. We both feel we are on the other side of recovery now and feel we have been successful at rebuilding the marriage. We could have contact now and we could be good for OC now, but we would be engaging in an uphill battle with a very disagreeable OW who couldn't care less what we have been through and would refuse contact. We are exhausted, frankly, and we aren't that interested in initiating contact if it means having to battle. OW lacks the compassion required to understand anyone else's situation other than her own. Contact is probably too late for us under the circumstances and while I understand OW's reluctance becasue of the time issue, she does not afford us the same courtesy.


In my mind the question I have for the BS is why do YOU insist the WS chose between you and his/her child...if that is indeed the case. Aren't you afraid of future resentment or am I way off base?

=^^= I guess we "insist" on NC initially because in order to heal the marriage all the focus needs to be spent on each other without distractions otherwise there won't be anything there for anyone else including the kids...and spouses come first before kids. All kids. Even the kids of the marriage. Our kids have always loved seeing our devotion to each other. It made them feel secure and loved and that they could count on us. The marriage relationship supercedes any other relationship because it is the firm foundation with which to build a stable household for everyone in the family to enjoy. Until the marriage has recovered, no one is healthy enough to provide a stable environment for the OC. If recovery takes too long to suit the OW, then contact will probably never happen. If the OC is several states away and all the money is garnished from the earnings, there is no money to travel and maintain a relationship with OC.

And as far as future resentment, I'm sorry, but...hahaha. If ANYONE resents ANYTHING, it would be the Betrayed Spouse for what the Wayward Spouse put her/him through to begin with. If the Wayward resents Betrayed...so what? Get over it. We had to. If they don't get over it, then bye-bye. Show them the door. The Betrayed has done her part in even considering reconciliation after the Wayward has done the worst possible thing that can happen in a marriage. Resentment? Puh-leeze. I don't think a Wayward's resentment could in anyway match the resentment the Betrayed is entitled to. Fortunately, most Betrayeds don't hold onto their resentment post successful recovery.

I understand that this must be something difficult to fathom from your vantage point, and with your particular situation with your little one having had some health problems. I know you are deeply hurt by what has happened to you and your daighter at the hands of the MM, but if he is committed to recovery and fixing his marriage, then I hope you can let go for your sake and your daughter's sake and I sincerely hope and pray that one day you will meet someone that will heal your hurt and give you the home and family you and Hope deserve. I know how hard it is to raise a child all by yourself. I did it for 12 years. But, when you least expect it ...and when you aren't even looking for it, the "real deal" will just some your way and you'll wonder why you ever wasted so much time and emotional energy on someone who belonged to someone else and who hurt you and Hope so much.

Anyway, that is my New Year's wish for you, Twilight...for God to heal your heart and bring you peace within to open yourself up for someone who is worthy of you and your daughter because I think you are a pretty good kid who deserves happiness and a home with someone kind and devoted to you and Hope.

Catnip =^^=
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Page 2 of 4 1 2 3 4

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Search
Who's Online Now
1 members (NewEveryDay), 1,357 guests, and 77 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Mike69, petercgeelan, Zorya, Reyna98, Nofoguy
71,829 Registered Users
Building Marriages That Last A Lifetime
Copyright © 1995-2019, Marriage Builders®. All Rights Reserved.
Site Navigation
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5