Hi friends,<P>Here I am cleaning out paperwork, finding every bill I can for things all year. Trying to gather them for the lawyer.<P>I went to a stack of old medical bills that I sent H on a children visit in the first week after discovery. He sent the papers back.<P>Guess what was in them!!!!!!! An envelope post dated Oct. 8 1999, with, his name, mailed to his mom's address. Inside, a bank card for his new bank account. He kept asking back then if he got a new "credit" card or something but I never found one.<P>Now, those of you who know me, know H left on Xmas day to be with a woman he met 3 days earlier. NOT.<P>Now another important factor, we went out of town Oct. 8 for our anniversary which is Oct. 10. We went to Canada, and not knowing it was the Canadian Thanksgiving, some things weren't as busy as we'd hoped. Our trip was kind of bummed out and not much romantic happened, and I was upset about that. <P>Our car had recently broke, little things kept happening to us, and that was when he started getting a "little" distant. I mean we would have great times, (think out of his guilt) and we would have low times (thought it was out of holiday jitters). He started buying new clothes, leaving work a half hour early, wearing new cologne, fixing his hair a lot, working out more, not calling me from work as much. Not as much physical intimacy with us. <P>It all is adding up. He must have met her before. Also, he didn't go shopping for me for xmas until 4pm xmas eve day. I almost thought he wasn't going at all. Then I got a really stupid uncaring gift, so needless to say, I wonder if he was planning on leaving earlier and chickened out. He had went out on Dec 18 as well til one in the morning. I wanted to go and he said it was guys night. I looked at the bank statement, and BOOM a withdrawal for a club downtown, that is a "meat market", not a place where the guys go to shoot pool.<P>This is making sense now. He didn't lose his mind at xmas, he has to have been cheating on me for about 3 months.<P>Tell me friends, am I sounding logical or like a lunatic. A few of you suspected he knew her longer, a betrayer who replied to me once, giving me help told me he suspected it too. Could this be?<P>What do you think this means now to my current situation? The divorce papers? Don't forget he almost came home twice since he left and claims he still loves me. Any other ways I can look into things?? I suspect his mom knows more since it was her house this bank account went to. I am NOT happy about that either.

Dana,<P>The plot thinkens,huh...I know this just adds insult to injury..I find it absolutely astonishing how insencitive and uncaring a betrayer can be...<P>I don't have much in the way of advice...Just wanted you to know I'm here, and know what you are feeling...Be prpared for more stuff to be revieled...<P>After discovery for me I found out my W kissed this other guy she worked with...Let me tell you this guy is a bigger piece of junk than LRB...this guy is absolutely nasty...Anyhow, point being, try not to be surprised by anything else you find out...<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

I have to say that this is a common trait for betrayers. They feel they are "protecting" us by not telling the complete truth about stuff. They don't understand that it hurts even worse than knowing the truth up front. Sorry, I can relate to your pain and understand. God Bless!<P>------------------<BR>Chick's <BR>Bren<P>You won't see things until your ready to not be blind!

Hey Lonely,<P>It is absolutely incredible to me the similarities of the bits and pieces of all our stories.<P>Years ago I had been receiving calls regarding a Visa account that was delinquient. I told these people that we don't have a card through their institution. I asked Val about it. She denied it. Silly rabbit, "tricks" are for kids. Yep, she had a super secret squirrel account hidden from me. She did real well, had the statements sent to mommy and daddys house so I wouldn't be the wiser. Unfortunately she did supply the correct HOME phone number. OOPS, slight foopah. <P>I should have had a flag go up on this one. She gave me some [censored] and bull story and I bought it hook line and sinker. Boy, that's a lot of animal references isn't it. Oh wait, she was a stinker for trying this. Get it skunk? Never mind.<P>We should publish a book of all the signs and symptoms that all married people must have in their possesion before the knot is tied. We would make a million and save others from the pain of infidelity.<P>Just a thought. Looks like you are a Gal with a plan and sounds that you have joined the ranks of "Wer'e not going to take it anymore" <singing like Dee Snyder of Twisted Sister><P>Take Care<P>Tim

<P>{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{DANA}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}<P><BR>I would be very surprised if he had only met her 3 days before he left you for her. I would try and get as much evidence as you can from bills, credit card statements etc.<P>I can't offer much advice but wanted you to know that I will be thinking of you. <P>------------------<BR>Love and Prayers<BR>Nicole

lonelymom,<BR> About two months before W disclosed her affair,we were going to take out a large loan to remodel the house.At one point she said maybe we shouldn't.When I asked why,she said some things were bothering her,but didn't want to talk about it.I thought maybe she was going to quit her job that she hated.Silly me.But she let me take out the loan anyway.Before that,she brought home a John Gray tape she wanted me to listen to.I asked her where she got it.She said"A friend."I guess I'm not the brightest crayon in the box,either.But then I trusted her for 21 years.She had worked around men for years,and never got involved with them before(to my knowledge).It never dawned on me she was getting involved.Maybe we should all have"DUH" stamped on our forehead.Now that you have discovered more than you thought,you will find out,that in hindsight,it doesn't really matter in the long haul.You don't know what he told his mother.He could of lied to her.Don't be too hard on her,until you get more facts.Have you sat down,and talked to her?I did that to my mother-in-law,and told her things I'm sure she didn't know.As time goes on,I'm sure you'll think of more red flags that an affair was going on.Hang in there. --Murph

lonelymom,<P>PLEASE,,get a credit check done as soon as possible. Find out what other accounts may be in existence that you aren't aware of. <P>Helpppppppp,, to our lawyers out there!!! Is she responsible for half of these debts until she has filed for divorce?? <P>Protect yourself lonelymom!!!!!!!!!!

{{{{{{lonelymom}}}}}}}}}}}}}}<BR>You have to protect yourselves and your kids financially.<BR>Do you have joint accounts? Make sure h cannot withdraw all the funds and leave you with zip...it is strange how often this happens. Credit cards get cancelled, and you can find yourself with no money no credit...do you have your own credit card? If not apply for your own one immediately. Make sure you withdraw cash for an emergency fund if all access to joint funds dries up. He has had time to plan this.....but then in reality few betrayers have this all worked out and are flying by the seat of their pants anyway, so will threaten to do certain things and then react when you have acted on the threats to protect yourself s. However your H filed for divorce. Just like he did not consider the consequences of his choices on you, his children, or even himself, he probably has not thought this through all that thoroughly either. If you are lucky and have the wherwithal, make sure that you are as PROACTIVE as you can be in terms of protecting yourself and the children financially and for the future.<P>The reality is that he is also paying for OW...at least his part of living expenses, if not more.....and this is money you and your children are not getting. Sounds calculating and horrid, but this is the reality. He is not thinking with his brain , but with his other organ. You on the other hand, who are coping with so much and in horrid pain, have to focus clearly on the finances. (This allowed me to get even angrier, but to make sound decisions in terms of my finances)<BR>Why should you and the children have to suffer financially due to H's new life. So spend money to save yourself in the long run. Hire a lawyer who might be expensive (cheaper in the long run, believe me) who you can relate to and who will only act in your and your children's best interests, and handle the case legally without allowing you to bring emotions into the settlement. In other words do not let yourself be talked into doing something you do not want to, but do not settle unless you can live with this financially.<P>The most important thing is that you are on this site. Therefore you can "blame" your lawyer for the LB, explaining politely that it is out of your hands and you can continue to deposit love deposits in H's bank account, but make sure the financial deposits are coming your way.<BR>It is convoluted, but you are in a place you did not chose to be, H did. <P>We can all find things that changed...if we only knew the clues to look for. My H cahnged and withdrew from family life. I talked to him over and over again about what had changed to make him this way. He told me for months that he wanted to live a single life with single male friends of which he had none! (he also wanted to hang out at bars, eat out every night etc....something he had never ever done)I challenged him for over 8 months until he admitted to the affair which was in its 16 month!<P>Continued to lie during reconciliation as well..........which is why I do not visit board very often as I am trying to divorce him, but he is stalling and will not play fair financially. I have independent financial resources so this divorce may take years.<BR>In mean time OW has moved in with him and it is a big mess in terms of the children. He has continued to manipulate and lie to them and has tried to control their acceptance of OW by withdrawing his love and affection for them if they do not see OW, so my 13 year old d is very"messed up. He abdicated all parental responsibility and OW (read trophy next wife) has the no values and this is where stbx is now. There is nothing I can do to help the kids, but both younger ones are in therapy on a regular basis and will get through this no thanks to him!!!<P>Take care of yourself. You sound like a caring and compassionate person and a wonderful mother. Enjoy your children and do not let them be pawns.<P> <P><BR><P>------------------<BR>