Hey there,<P>Some of you may know that my husband and I have been in recovery only 2 months with D-day 5 months ago..<P>We have been doing good. We seemed to be getting along pretty well. but...<P>my husband has never been in the "public" eye so to speak. He has worked alone on a ranch without much exposure to anyone.<P>He has been on his new job 1 week. and in that week he has avoided me everyday after work. He finds something else to do. OR he stays late at work. He has started to cuss and awful lot and mentions some issues concerning women. Now, I do not want to be jealous or paranoid, but I JUST CANNOT HELP IT. There is a woman he workds with and before he started he reassured me not to worry about anything. Now, it is "she not my type". <P>He seems to have withdrawn from me. Maybe it is just my own insecurities, I do not know. I realy thought this move was for the best, which truely it is, but I am scared. Maybe I am going to reap what I have sown. But, whether or not, I have done what I have done in our past, certainly doesn't give him the right to run down that path does it? He seems to be a much better person than that, and I wonder if he isn't just having second thoughts on us. WE have moved, buying a house, working on our marriage, living with my parents until houseis ready, new jobs, new school ect ect. Am I being paranoid? HIs new boss is single and I jhave just noticed a subtle change in him. <P>I did write him a letter concerning all of this, but he didn't want to talk about it, just emailed me a short letter... I LOVE YOU. but, when I first fooled around I thought i loved him too.<P>I realize nothingis ever the ssame. But, here is the question...<P>Have you betrayed ever thought of Infidelity as a pay back? or ended up feeling very alone and afraid of your relationship, that you would think of infidelity?<P>I am really scared. I have been learning so much inour relationship. Learning to love, be honest, patient, ect ect... I do not want to get hurt, i feel like closing him out so he cannot hurt me...<P>Is this stuff normal? I post here all confident things are so great to end u pwith a road block I didn't see coming adn have no knowledge as how to get around or through it.<P>Any insight would be helpful..<BR>thanks<BR>mercy

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mercy:<BR><B>Have you betrayed ever thought of Infidelity as a pay back? or ended up feeling very alone and afraid of your relationship, that you would think of infidelity?</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Uh, sort of. I told him I wanted to know what it was like to come home, crawl in the bed with him after being with someone else and look him in the face. I told him I wanted to know what it was like to hold someone else in my arms and have no thought of him home alone waiting for me, loving me. I told him I wanted to know what it felt like to lie to him over and over and see the conflict in his face as he believed my lies. I told him I wanted to know what it was like to have an affair so I could understand how he could do such a thing. <P>Would *I* do it for the knowledge or the "payback?" Absolutely not. There is no way of knowing if your H would do that kind of thing. There are lots of emotions going on and it certainly would be a human response.

Yes, I did think about it at first. Maybe I'm lucky I didn't meet anyone I thought would be worth it.<P>I don't know if you have been following the Harley plan, but it is important to address the time you are spening or not spending together. If you could encourage him in that, not in terms of any possible OW, but your needs as a couple to shoot for 15 hrs/wk, it would do you guys a world of good.<P>That and you both being open about your feelings. Maybe he is just scared/excited, whatever about the new job. It's a big step. We really have based our marriage on Harley's four rules, and it has changed our lives as well as our marriage.<P>------------------<BR>Cindy

Yes, I thought about it at first out of anger and retaliation. But there is no way I would conciously inflict that pain on myself. My husband even has said that he wishes I would go out and have one so I would know what he is feeling. I ask him why he would wish that pain on me? We also went through our first weeks together living with my mom, finding a place to live, and looking for new jobs. That alone was very trying, without throwing in these emotions that we both faced. I agree with schizzo that you should be spending as much time together as you can and sticking with the Harley principles.<BR>P.S. I also have thought about skydiving, quitting my job and hopping a plane to Australia, or going on a huge spending spree, but I wouldn't do those either!

Popeye,<P>Just got done reading your recent post on the Divorced/Divorcing forum.<P>Just a quick question: How long were you and H married?<P>I know you sent me stats on the infidelities you've experienced, and I too have suffered from my H being what they call a "serial cheater". I've dealt with OC (2) fathered outside of the marriage and more than one affair in our 15yr marraige. (total 20 yrs together)<P>I don't know why I am puttng up with this a second time. But the first time we didn't have the Harley principals to guide us/me. I know everyone's situation if diff, but aft I read your post I feel like I may need to re-evaluate what I'm asking for IF my H comes back and wants to reconcile.<P>I forgave him the first time but never forgot. The existence of 2 OC made that impossible. It weighed on us both.<P>So back to my question, How long have you been married to H, hence put up with his infidelity.<P>-Jo<P>note: You know, I've only been on this forum for a week, but in that short time have so much respect for you and value your words. If you choose to no longer post to this forum, you'll be sorely missed. But I understand a need to move on.<P>

Hi Mercy,<P>As you know, I was the betrayed. But I can honestly say that I never considered cheating. Not before my husband betrayed me nor since he did.<P>Don't jump to the conclusion that your husband is considering the same thing. Moving and starting a new job are both extremely stressful, particularly if he feels that these changes were caused by your infidelity. I am speaking to you as someone who has been in your husband's place.<P>My husband's affair caused many changes in our lives, many of them things I would not have chosen. Sometimes I feel very resentful that I have had to alter my life in unpleasant ways because of bad choices he made. It often seems that I am giving up so much while his life goes on just as before, and it does make me angry and cause me to withdraw from him.<P>Add to that, your husband is working in a new environment with coworkers who probably make comments that remind him that he has an unfaithful wife. You know the kind of macho talk that men sometimes do, and the other kinds of comments that can be made by people that have no idea what is going on. I've certainly experienced those. Comments from friends about how perfect my husband is, how it must feel good to be so loved, etc., along with statements about never putting up with infidelity, blah, blah, blah.<P>Remember me telling you about the ups and downs of recovery? This is a down. My advice would be to talk about it right now before it builds up even more. Deal with it immediately, before your imagination runs away from you.<P>Best wishes,<P>Peppermint

Mercy,<P>I'm not a betrayed, but I have some thoughts to share.<P>What kinds of comments about women is he making? <P>My first thought on this is that the stress of the move and the new job - all of the changes - is catching up with him. <P>I also agree with Schizzo about spending time together. You should probably discuss with him the issue of spending time togehter. Try to do something together that is a de-stressor - like a quiet walk together after dinner.<P>If you do talk to him about the woman at work issue, be careful not to LB about it. And don't make it the focus of all your conversations with him. focus on the positive things that are happening and help him to see the positive side of all these changes.<p>[This message has been edited by TruthSeeker (edited May 30, 2000).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>Have you betrayed ever thought of Infidelity as a payback? or ended up feeling very alone and afraid of your relationship, that you would think of infidelity?</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I think it would be more of feeling very alone and afraid of the relationship that would cause infidelity. After years of being faithful to my wife, despite my own unhappiness in the marriage, my W's infidelity nearly destroyed me, how could the person that I loved and trusted most in the world do something like that. The lies told to me after discovery to protect the OM led me to thoughts of suicide, I felt alone, confused and unloved. My pride was all but gone, my male ego had been destroyed, I had been emasculated by the one person that should have protected me, it also didn't help that my W gave little to no effort in rebuilding our marriage, she sat around waiting for me to make her love me again, totally forgetting that prior to her adulterous relationship that I wasn't the happiest man in the world, and I certainly wasn't very happy at that moment, my love for her was slowly diminishing.<P>I ended up sleeping with an ex-girlfriend and for those few hours my ego had been restored, I no longer felt emasculated and I knew that I was actually in the arms of someone who TRULY wanted to be there with me and not because they felt obligated. I only slept with her that one time, but I must admit that it was very, very hard not to do it again, considering that my W's attitude and effort did not change, along with my ex-girlfriend constantly telling me that my W was no good, that she really didn't love me and that I could find happiness with her, it was very tempting to leave. Initially I didn't leave because I didn't want to hurt my kids, whom already had to suffer because of this whole thing, later I didn't leave because I had promised to work on our marriage for at least a year.<P>I tell you all of this in order for you to really understand what emotions a man goes through after his W has an affair, his manhood has been attacked and depending on the circumstances of the affair, destroyed. If you don't want to feel the pain that you have brought on your husband, you need to impress upon him everyday that you are sorry and remorseful, something that my W never did, you need to make him feel like he is the king of the hill, the other woman will certainly make him feel like it. You will need to assure him everyday that you love no one but him, that you are with him because you want to be, not because he is the consolation prize. He has been devestated beyond your wildest imagination, all the energy and thought that went into your affair must be paled in comparison to the energy and thought that is put into making your husband feel wanted, needed and loved. Failure to do those things will create a huge temptation, trust me, while my W has improved in many areas, there are many areas where she continues to leave me wondering, and that creates temptation.<p>[This message has been edited by F A (edited May 30, 2000).]

Mercy, I'll jump in as your worst nightmare. <P>10 years ago, I was selfish & lonely and had an affair. My H has told me that there have only been 2 times in our marriage that he's wanted to cheat on me, one was right after my affair and the other was 2 years ago, when he did. <P>The betrayed spouse feels a lost of self-esteem, attractiveness, worth...and if there is someone of the opposite sex who fills those needs during the recovery time...it is a big problem. The betrayed's thought pattern easily twists to "my spouse did it, why can't I?" The people who posted above were strong enough to disregard that thought and not act on it, even if it was just because no one was appealing enough...I wasn't lucky enough...as my H & I separated several times throughout his affair, there was a man who became my "friend". So, my H & I have made yet another revolution of the infidelity roller coaster.<P>Mercy, if you want to save your marriage, and since you are here, I've got to think you do...you have to do the best Plan A you can. I know you've got withdrawal, but thing with infidelity, both spouses end up terribly needy. The betrayer is used to having needs met by someone else...the betrayed is heartbroken.<P>Make SURE you are doing your part to meet your spouse's needs--and no lovebusting since he has someone to potentially talk about your bad behavior with, creating bonds with HER.<P>I wish you the best.<P>------------------<BR>Lor<BR>"Let love be genuine...hold fast to what is good; love one another." Rom 12:9-10

first of all, Thank You All for all of your imput!<P>When hubby came home last night, we had a talk. I told him EXACTLY how I ws feeling. He reassured me that he is just preoccupied about everything that is going on. He(as we all are) are trying to adjust to our new lives. And YES, he does have to put up with comments about certain situations which does bring to light my unfaithfulness. I am so sorryfor what I have done, I only want my husband and I am definetly on the down side of this very hilly roller coaster. I remember the bumps, but I think my imagination is running wild. My husband said he wouln't do this to me and if he was ever tempted, then he would tell me so that i could help him keep from doing what I did, meaning try to meet those needs someone else is. He did assure me I have been meeting everyone of his needs--except conversation, but that isn't my fault necessarily, we are living in my mom's living room and we never ever have any time together. NEVER. <P>schizzo, you reminded me of something. I havent'been able to spend any time with him, never mind 15 hours, but I forgot that part of the recovery... My book SSA, is packed and I rarely look anywhere else these days..<BR>thanks for the reminder. We have been using Harley principals, they have been a big factor in our recovery. As a matter of fact, they are principals we have had to teach to 2 other couples getting ready to fall apart. Due to infidelity. this could also be something my husband is upset about. one couple are veryveryvery dear to us, and he is thinking of stepping out, but my husband was able to share with him a lot of stuff. Unfortuently, he only knows because he has been there.... my husband did say he wanted to talk with me more, but not aroundkids or family...<P>You all have given me food for thought... I always take all i get anduse it somewhere..<P>There is something that I do know. and that is without a doubt, I love my husband and want nothing more than to have a "normal" relationship, without suspicion, worry ect ect.<P>Thanks,<BR>mercy

Mercy,<P>It's sometimes hard to share in this medium since I don't actually know you or your h, so I mostly can only refer to what I've learned and hope it helps.<P>At first we thought spending 15 hours together was a total fantasy. Then we started making the time, but it wasn't at all fun. He was in withdrawal, I was very hurt, and on top of it we were still faced with the same problems we had before the affair.<P>But we hung in there for months, making our time a priority. Lately we haven't needed to count the time, it has been way more than 15 hours. And we love being together.<P>It is mostly fixing the STRUCTURE of your lives. At first we had to let almost everything else go. The kids suffered a bit. <P>Living in your mom's livingroom must be really tough, so go places if you can't get Mom to go out. Like teenagers do, find ways to get away, make it an adventure.<P><P>------------------<BR>Cindy