My WW has been in A for 5 months. D-Day was 12/7/01-almost 7 weeks ago. A continues, unabated. Both WW and OM have told me, separately, that it is up to the 3 of us to protect children from being hurt by not telling them of A. I tend to agree, IF A ENDS and our marrriage gets restored.
HOWEVER, if I am forced to move out of house (either thru Plan B implementation or WW action), or WW decides to separate and take kids, or the big D happens, I believe my 2 teenage D's should be told the whole truth:<p>that their father loves their mother and wants the marraige to work but that their mother has made a choice to leave father for another man and end marriage<p>My wife says if I ever told kids this, it would be a spiteful, hateful attack on her. OM says I can't possibly love my wife or kids if I would do this. But I believe WW and OM must be held accountable. Right now, they are getting a free ride. I have not demanded that A end, I just keep loving WW and Plan A'ing. But if she ultimately makes the choice to give up her marriage, she and OM have to deal with the consequences. This means the family knows the truth, our Christian fellowship of 10 families that we meet with regularly must know the truth, and our children must know the truth. They must know that if and when this guy becomes their Stepfather (ugggghhhh) that this A was the casue of our marital breakup. (Is this selfish or spiteful on my part?)<p>By the way, my WW has made comments to the effect that our Christian friends have accepted one guy's new wife into their midst, but I point out that his first wife died of cancer, no adultery involved. Her reply "So I guess you'll tell everyone what a terrible person I am?" I reply that "No, I couldn't do that." But, other times, my wife comes back from fellowship with these women and tells me how dirty and sinful she feels in their midst, so I know there is some conviction there.<p>Anyway, what do we tell our teeenage girls, and when?

OW and WW are too emotionally caught up in their trist to think straight about the kids. <p>They will say anything to raltionalize and normalize their behavior. <p>The EXACT same words coming out of thier mouths come out of my WH's. Don't focus so much on the telling of your kids right now. They will begin to ask questions and you can take their lead. And they will probably find out or make connections on their own without any help from you - if my 7 year old can do it then they certainly can.<p>Don't give your WW an excuse to use this against you. I know the urge to tell is great, but things have a way of forking themselves out. You'll see. <p>You can also ask them to talk to your WW about any questions they have and then follow up with them and go over her answers in a discussion format, so that they can get your explainaiton too. They will see who is dong the right thing and who is doing the wrong thing. <p>It's not cut and dry, but until ther eis an official divorce petition filed, you really don't know what the future will hold, and so there is nothing really concrete to tell them.<p>Be sure you are constantly reassuring them of your love and that you will always be there for them.<p>Also - I replied on your previous post about Plan A. K

Hey Boppo,<p>I generally avoid threads about how all of this affects our children because it remains the most painful part of what infidelity does to a family. <p>Just a little background. I'm a BS, almost divorced, 3 teens at home with me...WS sees them a few days a month.<p>I'll try not to make this too long.<p>I told my kids and it was the worst thing I could have done to their father...but I did not do it to hurt him.<p>I thought hard about how I felt when I knew something was terribly wrong with my husband and I was being lied to constantly. It was horribly confusing, wanting to believe him, but I knew in my gut that something really bad was happening. It led me to start investigating, which in turn led to discovery. I thought hard about putting my kids through that process. Having to force them to figure it all out for themselves and I decided that the one thing that my husband could have done to lessen the blow was to be HONEST WITH ME. <p>My husband (STBX) and I were married for 20 years and unfortunately we really never fought...so for the kids the seperation came from nowhere...one moment everything seemed fine, then BOOM...dad was gone. Also, the woman my husband was with when he left (OW#2) is a woman my kids and I have known forever...the kids have known her all of their lives (a co-worker...original huh?)My children deserved an explanation.<p>One thing though...I knew when I told my kids the truth that I would never want my husband back...my breaking point for the marriage was him taking up with this woman...I had seen it coming for a very long time and he could not stop himself. This was after discovery of a different two year affair he had just come out of. If I had still been working toward marriage restoration I'm not sure if I would have told the kids just yet...it's a huge LB, but my kids needed answers and it was up to me to provide them with them.<p>I don't know if this helps, and I hope it doesn't sound like I'm trying to justify my actions, but I knew my kids, and I knew they needed a reason for dad leaving. They had to know it was not their fault at all.<p>allison

“Anyway, what do we tell our teeenage girls, and when?”<p>Do not tell your daughters yet. You see, your wife will be less likely to react overtly, like try to throw you out, as long as the girls do not know. Wait until either your wife does something obvious or she moves to do something legally. Once you are in recovery, you and your wife can tell them together.. the message then is “See even adults do stupid things, but this is how an adult resolves problems.” All the girls need to know right now is that mom and dad are having problems and handling them the best they can. <p>“HOWEVER, if I am forced to move out of house (either thru Plan B implementation or WW action), or WW decides to separate and take kids, or the big D happens, I believe my 2 teenage D's should be told the whole truth:”<p>Ok, I’m concerned here. Plan B should not mean that YOU move out. Have you read the responses to your other thread? Do not move out. <p>If your wife decides to separate and takes the kids, she is make a unilateral decision. She cannot do this. Get a lawyer and have the courts order her to return the children to the family home. The firs time I filed for divorce from him XH I did this. The judge ordered me to return my son to his dad because I moved him without his father’s permission. I almost lost my son over this… moved back in when I returned son. It was the only choice I had.<p>If she files for divorce, she cannot make you move out of your home. Who moves where will be settled in the divorce agreement. I found this out too.<p>Will you please listen very clearly to the others and me. DO NOT MOVE OUT OF YOUR HOUSE AND DO NOT LEAVE YOU DAUGHTERS. Please listen. There are many here who have experience with this. <p>At this point, I think you need to see an attorney to learn your rights and to make sure you have any legal protections you need in place.

Zorweb wrote:<p>Ok, I&#8217;m concerned here. Plan B should not mean that YOU move out. Do not move out. <p>How do I stop all contact with WW during plan B if I am still living with her? I thought Plan B was to get her to see what it would be like to have all EN's met by OM, and to be free to see OM. I can't kick her out, can I? Also, I wouldn't do that to our children or their mother.<p>Zorweb also wrote:<p>If your wife decides to separate and takes the kids, she is making a unilateral decision. She cannot do this. Get a lawyer and have the courts order her to return the children to the family home. The first time I filed for divorce from XH I did this. The judge ordered me to return my son to his dad because I moved him without his father&#8217;s permission<p>So my wife cannot move out and take my kids w/o my permission? Wow, this is news to me. OM (who is veteran of two divorces) told me the kids go with WW, PERIOD. Is he trying to scare me?<p>Zorweb also wrote:<p>Will you please listen very clearly to the others and me. DO NOT MOVE OUT OF YOUR HOUSE AND DO NOT LEAVE YOU DAUGHTERS. Please listen. There are many here who have experience with this<p>So I must continue to endure the pain and disrespect of the affair continuing under my nose?<p>Note, that I was talking hypothetically in all this as I wouldn't do any of this for at least a while. I am only 7 weeks from D-Day and about 3 weeks into strong Plan A.

Boppo,<p>OK! Lets get to the chase. Zorweb has given you good advice. However, each state is different. Go to a lawyer today, tomorrow, a good lawyer and find out your rights. The OM may be a veteran of 2 D's but he is not a lawyer, and apparently not father of the year material.<p>As for telling the teenage D's? First, they have probably already figured things out. If not it won't be long. As was suggested earlier, make sure they understand you love them. If they ask you tell them the truth. If the don't leave it alone until something does happen.<p>The two fog bound lunkheads, telling you NOT to ever tell the girls are covering their asses and you know it. So don't listen to them in this regard. But, it will make things very difficult to resolve once they do know.<p>I personally think it is time you told your W to start making decisions. The A may not be over but them telling you how to behave is a little much. At least your W should respect your boundaries enough to keep OM out of your face and the lives of the girls. If she hasn't that is one demand I think you need to make.<p>Keep up the plan A, but start preparing for Plan B. That means talking with the lawyer. If you have separation papers signed, and financial support is arranged leaving the house is not considered abandonment in some states. Check it out.<p>My guess is that Plan B may well be on the horizon after a good plan A.<p>I do hope something I have said helps. This is tough stuff so hang in there.<p>God Bless,<p>JL

OM (who is veteran of two divorces)…- WOW, now he must be an expert on making relationships work, he should be on the boards telling us how to reconcile our M's and be better spouses. I mean he has a lot of experience, right? NOT! (I wonder how he explains these two D's to WS, probably tells her that it was the exW's fault, HAH!)<p>Boppo- You have rights and you need to know what they are, do not listen to any armchair attorneys on this matter. Do some research and find an attorney who specializes in fathers rights. I did, and I know that W was suprised that I would hire an attorney like that, I think it made her realize how serious I was with all of this, that I was not going to let her be in complete control of the situation, like she has been.<p>I believe that in most states it is the childrens welfare that is taken into account above anything else. That means keeping their lives as normal as possible. Unless the home is sold as part of the D proceedings, the kids are usually kept in the permanent residence. Also, they usually are not allowed to stay at the other spouses house overnight on school nights unless they live in the same school district. And, I would consider (if it comes down to it) having a court appointed counselor interview you, W, the kids and any other involved third parties (MIL, FIL, etc) to determine which parent should have primary custody of the children. <p>IMO- OM is blowing smoke out of his [censored], he is just trying to scare you. It's a wonder that WS doesn't see this as well. How can she respect a guy who threatens to take another mans children away from him. Boppo- Be very firm on this stance, this is a definite boundary for you.

The first thing you need to do is to stop talking to the OM!!!!!!!!<p>For God's sake, why do you let him speak to you?! You need to show a little spine and get that damn OM out of your life. If your WW is going to stay with him that is one thing, but you do not have to be his buddy.<p>One of my best friends is the OM my WW took up with so I know a little about this situation. I told the guy he was very lucky to still be alive and that if he wanted to stay that way he would never come within my field of view again. Many times he tried to contact me and beg for forgiveness. Eventually, after much time and prayer, I met with him and told him that I forgave him and that I hoped he could go through life without hurting other people the way he hurt me. However, I also told him that although I forgave him, I never wanted to see or talk to him again and he respected that and that is the last of him in my life.<p>By they way, don't tell your kids a damn thing until you are in a divorce court. Just love them and tell them you hope that they can respect your privacy in this area with their Mother. Let them know you are dealings with "surprises" that life throws at you the best way you can and with dignity and integrity. Always speak respectfully of their Mother... they are going to learn a lot about you by the way you handle this and you can hope to teach them what an incredible father you are. <p>Good luck.

By the way... take the advice given here and go see a lawyer at once!!<p>I am a lawyer and I still went out right away and saw a lawyer and had them take stock of the whole thing and give me advice. I learned a lot from those visits and it helped guide many of my actions for months to come even if I didn't file for divorce right away.<p>Be strong, take control of your life.