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SidneyT Offline OP
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Say, thank you so much. You have been such a blessing!

I honestly feel defeated right now and completely discouraged about ever finding OW. He is being tracked and he is at home nights....even on the weekends!

I read some of his old journals and I am really disturbed by what I read. I have often thought WH was bipolar, but I am seriously questioning the possibility of Borderline Personality Disorder (I had questioned that years ago, much to my WH's fury). He fits so many of the criteria. I think Fred actually hinted toward that several pages back.

Over and over again in his journal I read about the chronic emptiness, seething resentment, black/white thinking, splitting (either putting someone on a pedestal or completely hating their guts), substance abuse, raging anger, thinking he (or others) are crazy or possessed or evil, depression so bad he felt suicidal, etc.

I have had thoughts throughout our marriage that I just couldn't compete with his mind, because I never knew what he was thinking and his thoughts so often seemed skewed. And I KNEW he resented me so much, so often.

Maybe my biggest hurdle isn't an affair, maybe my biggest hurdle is mental illness!

Oh, and today (out of the blue) my lawyer questioned WH's sexual orientation! This is another issue that seems to keep coming up as well.

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You are in my prayers. You know that you are well within your rights, even in God's eyes to choose D and no one would blame you if you do. Just take care of yourself and your DD. Remember that Plan A is just as much about you as him. Go get a massage, take a class, highlight your hair, start an exercise program, remodel a room. THIS IS NOT YOUR FAULT.

God's Blessings,

Say


Me, BW-57
FWH 54
4 kids and 4 grandbabies between us
In recovery since D-day, May 28,2007
FWH never onboard the MB boat but still clinging to the side.
One day at a time by God's grace.
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SidneyT Offline OP
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Well WH and I have been texting more and he even called me last night to talk about how things were going and why he left (still not admitting to affair, still no proof, and still rewriting our history). He actually thanked me yesterday after I said something he thought was funny and said it made him smile. That was the warmest thing he's said to me in the two and a half months since he left. I told him I was enjoying all of the beautiful flowers and trees he had planted that are in bloom now and what a blessing it has been to me (it has, it makes me feel closer to God to see such beauty).

Today I got the divorce papers in the mail and I just texted him and told him that it was sobering to see the papers in print and to realize that he has made all these monumental decisions in our lives and I've had no say at all about anything. I also told him I thought he was making the biggest mistake of his life.

He now wants to know why I think that and he said that I keep saying I would like our marriage to be different (I told him I didn't want the same old marriage but to work toward a better one) and he wants to know what this entails.

Is this where I basically come up with my part in why I believe our marriage was lacking? What do I say to him?

This is so confusing when I don't have proof of anything. I have followed him over his lunch hour and the past two days he leaves work alone and has lunch alone. I have someone checking on him at night and on the weekends and he's always home. I'm baffled.


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Originally Posted by SidneyT
Today I got the divorce papers in the mail

Get an attorney.
Plan B his butt.

He thinks he's going to divorce you and retain your friendship as good as ever.
Is this your plan as well?
Plan "friendly divorce"?

I'd not allow him any access .... if this was happening to me.
The minute divorce papers arrived ... I'd never speak to him again.

But, your milage may vary.


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Hi Syd,

I was wondering what was going on with you. Be honest with him about where you feel that you fell short. Tell him you have been reading some books and they were very convicting. Keep your cards close to your chest about this site but tell him that you have learned that love can die when a couple is not fullfulling each others ENs and that you think that the two of you could learn to fill each others needs again. Ask him if he thinks that you and him being in love like you were when you first married would be a better idea than divorce.

Be loving and kind, don't try to educate him and own up to your part in the problems in the M without absolving him of responsibility.

It is possible that there is no one else altough the signs point to there being someone. Keep your radar up and keep posting.

God's Blessings,

Say


Me, BW-57
FWH 54
4 kids and 4 grandbabies between us
In recovery since D-day, May 28,2007
FWH never onboard the MB boat but still clinging to the side.
One day at a time by God's grace.
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SidneyT Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Pepperband
Originally Posted by SidneyT
Today I got the divorce papers in the mail

Get an attorney.
Plan B his butt.

He thinks he's going to divorce you and retain your friendship as good as ever.
Is this your plan as well?
Plan "friendly divorce"?

I'd not allow him any access .... if this was happening to me.
The minute divorce papers arrived ... I'd never speak to him again.

But, your milage may vary.



Pep, I do have an attorney. I told him Monday after court (after he dropped the D-bomb and then wanted to talk) that I wanted to be his wife and wouldn't be his friend and I walked away. After that is when he suddenly started getting very chatty and friendly.

I will not be his friend if he divorces me! He told me he was still unsure about what he really wanted, and that his attorney told him if he didn't file D we would basically be in limbo and have to start over from square one (my atty. told me the same thing before court). That's why I was thinking I might still have a chance with Plan A, but you rec. going into B, huh?

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SidneyT Offline OP
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Originally Posted by saynomore
Ask him if he thinks that you and him being in love like you were when you first married would be a better idea than divorce.

That's a great question, Say. I will ask him this and mention the other issues you brought up. The way he's acting and talking right now he very likely will say that he was never in love with me at all, our entire marriage. I guess it's worth a shot, especially since we have not really communicated much at all since he left.

Thank you!!!


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I seldom disagree with Pep but in this case, I do. I know very happy couples that have gotten remarried after years of divorce so I don't think that you should base your decision on him filing. Printed words are flat, Syd. Only you can gauge if you detect any sincerety in your H. His infidelity at this point is speculation until you prove it and you are certainly being proactive about that possibility.

I say proceed with extreme caution. Guard your heart. I posted before Pep how I would handle it. Can you afford a session with the Harleys?

God's Blessings,

Say


Me, BW-57
FWH 54
4 kids and 4 grandbabies between us
In recovery since D-day, May 28,2007
FWH never onboard the MB boat but still clinging to the side.
One day at a time by God's grace.
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SidneyT Offline OP
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Originally Posted by saynomore
Only you can gauge if you detect any sincerety in your H.

I detect extreme confusion in him right now, and he even said as much after court. He doesn't know WHAT he wants.

Interesting you said that about guarding my heart. I have been praying all day for that very thing! I'm trusting God to work this mess out and to guide me, however today I realized I needed to start asking Him to protect my heart if the divorce is going to go through, because I'm not up for much more pain!


As always, thanks so much.

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SidneyT Offline OP
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Oh, and yes I would be willing to do a session with the Harley's. Do you mean both of us or just me?

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I don't know if your H would even agree to coaching with the harleys but as far as what I have read on this site so far, no one has regretted calling. I think they know how to gauge your sitch better than we would. Take care.


BW(Me)aka Scotty:37
DSx2: 10,12
DDAY2(PA)Nov27/09
Plan B Dec18/09
Personal R in works
Scotty's THING laugh
Newly Betrayed click here


Praying for walls and doors. Thanx MM

Surviving is important. Thriving is elegant.
? Maya Angelou

PROGRESS NOT PERFECTION

THANK YOU
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You ok, Syd?

God's Blessings,

Say


Me, BW-57
FWH 54
4 kids and 4 grandbabies between us
In recovery since D-day, May 28,2007
FWH never onboard the MB boat but still clinging to the side.
One day at a time by God's grace.
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My WH did the same thing and still does sometimes. Because he comes to the house in the morning to get our ds off to school while I'm at work, he sometimes washes the dishes ... something he NEVER did in 15 years of marriage.


BW (me) - 57
XWH-54
2DSs- 16 and 17
Married 16 years
D-Day - 8/21/09
XWH moved out 10-9-09
Divorce Finalized 11-19-10
XWH moved 4 states away (on 11/22/10) to live with OW.
XWH married OW 1-15-11
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SidneyT Offline OP
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The other day (same day I got the divorce papers in the mail) I texted my WH and said, "It's just sobering, the monumental decisions that have been made in all our lives by YOU and I don't get to have a say in any of it. I think it sucks. I also think you are making the biggest mistake of your life".

WH texted back: "Why? What do you want to do, really?"

I replied back pretty much verbatim what Say rec. that I should reply to him (wanting a different but better marriage, getting back to how we were when we were in love, and working at meeting each other's needs, etc.).

WH: "I don't know. Yes, I did love you, but I don't know if I could again or could trust that you trust me. I'm not talking jealousy, just overall trust and comfort to be who we really are."

Me: "Well who are you?"

WH: (after about 20 minutes)- "I don't know this week. I truly don't. Right now I know that I need to be alone. That sucks, I know".

ME: "OK"

WH: "Thank you" (I took this to mean 'thank you for not pushing me any more with this right now')

Since he has left he has mentioned 'wanting to be who I really am' several times and I'm trying to know what that means. I think he is, too.

I've been reading a ton about MIDLIFE CRISIS and I'm wondering why we don't really hear more about this, as in that it is a true life stage that many men (and some women) struggle through (and it's not just a cliche', like I thought). I really haven't read too much about the Midlife Crisis on this board, but it seems like so many fit. Of course an A can often be part of the MLC, but sometimes it isn't.

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Sidney,

The comment about your WH's sexual orientation raised a red flag for me.

Is there any possibility that your WH is gay? Has that ever come up in your marriage? If there is even the slimmest chance that this may be the case that would explain why you can't find evidence of an affair. If your WH is acting out on homosexual impulses, it is likely he is engaging in stranger sex or one-night stands. It would make sense that he is covering his tracks so carefully and maybe what he is hiding from you isn't evidence of an affair but evidence of gay clubs, porn and other activities.

It would also explain his waffling back and forth with you (although the same could be said for behavior because of an affair.) He may be going through periods of self-revulsion versus excitement versus shame versus guilt versus a whole new life.


BW (me) - 57
XWH-54
2DSs- 16 and 17
Married 16 years
D-Day - 8/21/09
XWH moved out 10-9-09
Divorce Finalized 11-19-10
XWH moved 4 states away (on 11/22/10) to live with OW.
XWH married OW 1-15-11
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SidneyT Offline OP
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Reva, the thought that my WH could be gay has come up time and time again over the years.

He has had a very close male friend (who is married) that has been a source of contention throughout our entire relationship. My WH has always called/texted this friend, repeatedly throughout the day and sometimes talking for very long periods of time (60-90 minute). If my WH and I would get in a fight, WH would go and call this friend and talk on the phone with him, which always ticked me off because I felt he was working out "our" fight with the friend instead of with me.

About two years ago my WH and this friend went away for the weekend to a sporting event. When WH came back, he said they got into a big fight and were no longer talking. He said the fight was over the fact that his friend was angry because WH had been sharing things with me about the friend's marriage and personal struggles and the friend felt this should remain private between he and WH. They didn't talk for nearly 9 months, but then they made up and the friend was once again on the pedestal and the phone calls/texts resumed.

The night of D-Day, WH had 17 texts messages back and forth to a phone number listed on his phone as being this friend. When I checked out the number it was listed as belonging to someone else (male) in a different state, though.

So yes, the question has come up before, both within myself and others (including some who read old posts on here, my lawyer, my friends, and a Clinician/friend I am close to).

My WH admitted to me recently that he did not feel he could be who he really is and said he had been hiding a lot from me the past year or so. ????

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Sidney,

I'm truly sorry for what you're going through. I wrote what I did because I was once involved with a man that I loved and who said he loved me but something wasn't right. This was many years ago. He broke it off with me abruptly with no explanation why. It took him more than 20 years before he finally admitted his sexual orientation and "came out." It's heartbreaking when this happens in a marriage and when there are children involved. I don't know if Dr. Hartley has commentted on this type of infidelity but I hope some of the veterans will chime in here with some advice on where you proceed from here.



BW (me) - 57
XWH-54
2DSs- 16 and 17
Married 16 years
D-Day - 8/21/09
XWH moved out 10-9-09
Divorce Finalized 11-19-10
XWH moved 4 states away (on 11/22/10) to live with OW.
XWH married OW 1-15-11
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SidneyT Offline OP
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Well, I'm not 100% convinced that my H is gay. I read years worth of his journals and he was definately VERY interested in women and never mentioned men. The time a few years ago that I knew he viewed porn on-line I went back and checked on every site he visited and it was all hetero stuff. There is the enmeshed relationship he has with this male friend, however I wonder if it's more of a thing where he's put this guy on a pedestal (BPD trait) vs. a sexual thing. However, anything's possible and that relationship H has with the friend was definately very strange and not healthy for our marriage.

I have felt much better about everything lately. I've been going to IC and she has really helped open my eyes to how extremely pitiful our marriage had become. My H worked so hard to always keep me at arm's length, always wanting his 'private time', always taking vacations by himself, always going out to eat by himself, going to games by himself, etc. etc. He was very selfish!!! IC even asked me what my 'limit' would be with H, because our marriage had become so void. I realized I was so determined to not be divorced that I no longer even had a limt! Sad.

I learned years ago that for me to try to talk about anything that I was unhappy about in our relationship was NOT worth it. The horrible fights that would ensue (and never be resolved) and somehow things often became twisted around to be my fault wore me down to the point of just shuting up about things and letting them slide.

The theme in our house became, "Don't bother H because he's so stressed out (ALWAYS so incredibly stressed out) and needs his space". We all had to be in our rooms by 9:00 each night so H could have his damned space! I always felt like I was scurrying off like a scared mouse so H wouldn't get mad about anyone still being up in the family room interefering with his time. He even had his own office (and later took over the guest room, too), but he still demanded this. Talk about walking on eggshells!

So I am now at the point of actually finding H repulsive! I've been praying for God to guide my heart and perhaps I've found my answer!!! I honestly can't imagine getting back with him anymore. The peace I have in my heart (and in my home) is priceless and I can't imagine wanting to be with someone who seemed so resentful of me and determined to keep me at arm's length.

My H is now fighting childcare for summer visitation. My mom has watched our D since birth, and I told H I would be flexible about what he wanted as long as D kept the same childcare. I feel like she's been through enough as it is without now sticking her with some stranger all day long when she could be with people who actually love her. She herself does not want to be with someone she doesn't know (she's 7). So now it's back to court on Monday for this matter.

I find it odd that he would want to thrust her with some stranger because he has always been extremely hypervigilant and obsessed about our D being around anyone who might sexually abuse her. He has even gone to the extreme of not trusting our own mothers to protect her (drove 4 hours in the middle of the night one X-Mas break when he felt like his mom wasn't protecting her from a male cousin who might molest her). His rule was that our dad's were never to be alone with her. And last summer he made a huge deal out of our D spending one day with an 8-year-old boy at my mom's house because he said he could tell this boy was troubled and messed up just by looking at him and would probably try to molest our D.

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I am glad to hear from you, Sid. Seems like your WH has some strange ideas. Do you think he may have been molested as a child? I don't remember, are you in Plan B as well as Plan D?
Any continued contact with him will just add to your feelings of repulsiveness.

Still praying for you.

God's Blessings,

Say


Me, BW-57
FWH 54
4 kids and 4 grandbabies between us
In recovery since D-day, May 28,2007
FWH never onboard the MB boat but still clinging to the side.
One day at a time by God's grace.
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