Dr Harley says this is very foolish. If you want to teach someone how to look after money, you don't 'forgive' a huge debt and offer more cash. You get them to earn some self respect, pay you what is owed, and THEN you forgive for the original offence.

Your WH is still talking about how much he wants to protect OW from any blame and you are forgiving? Covering up for his whore. That is sick. He is still foggy and has a loooong way to go.

Just Divorce now if this is going to be a forgiveness fest lining up a FR.



I'd agree with this, its a very typical A caused by poor boundaries. The trap any good person could fall into.

This WH is by no means a lost cause, I could easily foresee him being a full on MBer once out of the fog.

He isn't one of the serial cheats who love the lifestyle and are dead set on staying in it.

But he will NEVER get through remorse if you stand in his way of earning forgiveness like this.

Take the polygraph. Right now, WH is quite clearly a liar, minimising his shame and sticking to his guns on this (very foolish) lie. He is too scared to pay you back here with truth. You should stand firm on a polygraph and get him out of this habit of lies and into a recovered marriage.

Even if he HAS given you complete truth already, this will still be a remorseful action for him to earn forgiveness with. It clears the air and expels doubts if you give him a chance to prove it.

Blank, blind forgiveness is patronising and actively hinders his chances to make amends to you like a man.

A remorseful man ALWAYS wants a chance to prove he is a truthful man.

I thought I'd let you know that I have an autistic child. I spend many nights taking care of my kids as my wife is in school. I am the only one with a job. I go to school to finish up a second masters. I get maybe 4 hours a sleep a night most nights.

If I drove that far off a distance to meet s woman, it would be to have sexual conduct for my selfish pleasure. There is nothing more to read into this or to provide excuses or reasonings fo. Your husband is the same. And this is typical, not even close to worst case scenario

That is a very TYPICAL affair, BB. In fact I have never seen an A where that did not happen. It is not unusual at all for one person to lie like this and 'use' the OP to keep the flirting going.

One WW felt sick at the idea of having sex with OM but she was addicted to the needs he met. He even blackmailed her in a wayward sense, as she knew if she didn't sleep with him, he would stop meeting the needs she had become addicted to.

Do you think the OW in your WH's A never demanded physical contact? That she would have continued meeting his needs if he rejected her physically? Do you think he was allowed to reject her physically in the A without punishment?

I dont think so and I think your H is holding on to a lie here.

In the example of the WW above, obviously the BH did not take her word for her lack of desire for OM, he had her take a polygraph. She passed with flying colours as a few days prior she told him some extra lies she had held on to to 'avoid hurting' her BH.

The extra lies were not pleasant as the OM was a depraved piece of work. After the A was bust up and exposed he went on to abuse a teenage girl.

The WW in my example went on to do great though. After the polygraph she became a zealot about Radical Honesty and defending boundaries around members of the OS. She is one of the most remorseful waywards I have ever seen.

Yes. Dr Harley has written an entire article on the damaging effects of unconditional love. You require care, and faithfulness. Those things are conditions. And there are conditions for recovery that must be met. NC, proven truth, Just Compensation for the BS.



That quite simply is not true. If you were in a coma and were not meeting any needs at all he should still know how to be faithful.

Needs meeting has nothing to do with an affair. If a man admires me and makes me laugh, it is STILL pleasant even if I have a spouse doing the same things at home.

In fact it is even more of a rush of brain chemicals if two people love you. The problem is people think they can flirt, enjoy it and use self control to stop it going any further, but they can't. Good people fall into this trap all the time.


Polygraph.

The operative word here is "selfish". All affairs are an act of selfishness. I can see, KT, that you are very busy, but I doubt lack of time changes anybody's vulnerability to selfish motivations. The only reasons for any affair would be based in pure selfishness, regardless of convenience or emotional entanglements.

It has been many years since my autistic son was your son's age. I am his primary caregiver nowadays. While it's not a job I would have sought, it has it's rewards. Hang in there. It's worth it.

I agree with you; it doesn't take much analysis to understand the motivations of an affair.

Blond, you not meeting his needs is not why he had an affair. It is because he chose to and he nothave appropriate boundaries. AffaAffairs have happened when a spouse is meeting emotional needs. It comes down to having boundaries and not engaging in inappropriate behavior and dialog

I have a 4 year old with autism as well. It has been a terrible strain on us but we are getting through it (it is a fairly recent diagnosis although of course, we've struggled with him since he was born).

All the more reason Blndbabz that you should be demanding a polygraph, get the TRUTH out there, and then use that as your foundation for recovery. You need a stable home and a rock solid foundation to start with because having a child with special needs is harder. Blindness has led you to this point already many times.

I will be following thru with the poly. I have a friend who works for the local police force, he has pulled some strings and the poly will be free.

I'd write up a list of questions you want answering (dont be limited by the ones which will ACTUALLY get used in a real poly for now). Most certainly nail down EXACTLY what physical contact happened.

I'd tell WH he has a couple of days to answer all questions, truthfully and in full. Tell him you will expect him to pass a poly very soon to prove his answers so you expect him to hold nothing back.

This is where it gets rocky, but that's OK. He may start to hem and haw and give half truths which is painful. He may tell you some new truths, which is also painful - but good.

Breaking out of wayward habits is painful for many, so be prepared for anything.

BB, have you told him this yet? The reaction to this request is usually quite interesting but we can help you navigate this rocky road.

My WH only met up with the OW once. She is also married and lives quite a distance away. WH had a medical issue -- Ok, I'll say it -- He had a gigantic infected bleeding hemorroid -- caused by stress -- which prevented him from performing any sexual acts. I helped him care for it both before and after he left on his trip to see her and know that there is no way he could have performed any act with that amount of pain and discomfort. I know what you're thinking -- ORAL. Nope. No Oral. he's too vain -- Wouldn't let her see his areas with such a large problem on his hind quarters. I also spoke to OW. She did not want a physical relationship with him until he made the committment to leave me. He wouldn't do that for her so she refused to put out in any way. They only shared a few short kisses at the airport. I completely believe this.

I think it is also important to point out that I caught the A very early on. They began talking mid June and I intercepted the phone bill at the end of July. The messages of love and affection had only just begun a week or two prior to my discovery of the A. OW is also married, and there was a lot of guilt for both of them. I honestly believe that I found out just in time to squash things before they became physical.
I�m not stupid. I know that if I had not found out about it, the EA would have escalated to a PA. WH has also admitted this. He told me that he would not have made the trip to Florida to see OW if he thought they were going to escalate the EA to a PA. He said he wasn�t ready to take that step. However, upon seeing her face to face for the first time and seeing the way she looked at him, he admitted that if he did not have his medical issue, he probably would have tried to convince her to do �at least something physical.�

Yes. He knows. He said he still wants to do it. He said he wants to clear the air and that everything he has told me is the truth. He also said he wants me to take one, too... "because I have a few questions for you!" (spoken with a sly grin and a wink)

Just so you know, BB, none of the reasons you give here are credible to an objective observer. But, a polygraph will settle that question.

Have you scheduled the test yet?

That's great! When do you have it scheduled? The typical reaction of a WS to a polygraph goes like this:

1. "sure I will!"
[they readily agree initially in the hopes that this will reassure you enough to drop it]

2. When that doesn't work, they resort to mild threats: "if you distrust me so much that you would require a polygraph then we shouldn't be married!! A good marriage is built on trust and if you don't trust me, this is hopeless!!" [demand for unwarranted trust]

3. When that doesn't work, they make a "confession" that usually consists of a few little crumbs. The hope is that if you believe you have the "truth" you will cancel the polygraph - it is almost ALWAYS the partial truth and more comes out on polygraph day

4. when that doesn't work there are usually some threats to move out coupled with rants, raves, crocodile tears

5. When that doesn't work, they sing like a canary all the way to the DOOR of the polygraph tester's office

If the BS can withstand all this, they usually end up with all the truth by the PS is done!

BB, were you able to reach the OW's husband and parents?

It is not scheduled yet, waiting to hear back from the guy who works the machine. I hope to have it scheduled for the next week or so.

I did give him questions that I want answered, tho.

1. Were you in love with OW?
2. Did you have sex with OW?
3. Did you have any other sexual contact with OW aside from the kissing you already admitted to?
4. Have you had any other EAs while we were married?
5. Have you had any other PAs while we were married?
6. Is the A with OW really over now?

As for Exposure Plan -- I have not been successful locating the Lowes where OWH works. I think he may have put a request in to have calles blocked because I have tried several stores now. I anticipate the letters should hit florida today.... so we will see if I get a phone call from him or the parents.

I have not had any replies to the FB messages I sent out. I really did not expect them, tho. I did notice that OW has not posted a single thing to FB since WH ended the A. .. this is out of the ordinary for her, as she was one of those who checked in EVERYWHERE and posted messages very frequently � 5-10 per day. I�m not sure what that�s all about. Depression maybe?


New Question!!!

Should I contact OW? Or keep my distance? I had promised WH that I would not call her, but he has since told me that he is OK with it. He said that he has nothing to hide, but fears that my contacting her will re-open wounds that he is trying to heal� for both of us. What are your thoughts?

Did you pay $1 to get them placed in their inboxes? If you don't do that, they put them in their "other" box which most people don't even know about. In order to do this, the messages have to be sent on a PC, versus a tablet or phone. You can even tell if they have been read.



How would he know that she is ok with it? That makes me extremely suspicious. And tells me they have colluded to get their stories lined up.

Agree. This is a

I think you guys misread what her H said.

If i interpret the comment correctly, the H said that HE is okay with his BW contacting the OW if that is what his BW needs to do.

LTL