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I guess that is what I hope we can start to get with MC tonight - a plan. My MC is the person that I saw for the two years after the first D-Day. He knows my history. He knows all the work I have done. He is a Christian pro-marriage person and I think that he is going to say this is salvagable.

I think that is what I am afraid of. It is easier for me to deal with everything if I can be done and move on. That is where my mindset is at this point.

I am not sure that I am ready to be open-minded and to consider working on a relationship with this man.

I never thought I would be to this point, either. The point of giving up.

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I wish you would call Steve Harley or Jennifer anyway. They are the pros when it comes with dealing with infidelity and it's aftermath.

I know it is hard. I am very glad that I am still married even after all the ****** we went through.

At this point you know the devil you've got. Every other man out there is going to have some baggage or another. This man is the father of your kids. It is worth at least trying. But, it is your call. I know you feel like you've already given it 4 yrs. I think you allowed your H to eat cake and have the best of both worlds, unfortunately. I can't fault you for not seeing it sooner...I did the same thing the last time.

Last edited by Trix; 01/17/06 11:05 AM.

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(((((WTW2)))))

Emotions are raw. It's hard to sort out heart from head.

Praying for some clear signs for you to follow.

The only times I was ever "sure" what I was doing was the right thing is when I gave it over to God.

If this MC was okay with how things were before can you trust him completely? I second the motion for a call to the Harleys. Can't hurt.

BTW, H & I are in a recovered mariage, well over 4 years from d-day.

(((((WTW2)))))

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I can't help but have the gut feeling that he has read this thread, and his change of heart is more about protecting the OW than the marriage.

By this thread, he knows:

1. You have contacted a lawyer
2. You have solid proof via the GPS
3. You have BEEN ADVICED TO EXPOSE THE AFFAIR to the workplace

and so on. He miracously had a change of heart on his day off when he had plenty of time to scour the computer's history. It is so easy to leave trails on the computer. Where is the GPS tracking info??

I am sorry, but I really don't buy into the timing although it is possible to serve as a wake-up call. But after a solid 4 year affair - it is easier said than done. He has basically had unimpeded affair time with his Friday night poker games, etc.

Best of luck and keep your eyes wide open. Not moving back in my bedroom would be a "hill to die on", and I mean immediately.


Married 27 years 2 sons 24 and 22 1 SS Age 33
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That is the really strange thing.......... I don't really have any emotions now. Most people around me don't even know that anything has happened. I don't cry. I don't look sad or confused. I laugh at jokes and participate in coversations - just normally. Last time I went through this, it was written all over me - everyone could tell after one look at me.

It all seems to be my head this time - my heart has no feelings. The confusion is that I don't know if I am just numb from the shock of all of this, or if there just aren't any feelings in there anymore.

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Waiting, I'm awfully skeptical about his motivations. If you go to MC with him, I’d think that has to be one of the first questions asked. I just don’t buy him having an epiphany right when you start to investigate and document things. Something is not right. And, like everyone else says, words don’t mean a thing right now.

It may also be that you have to decide that all of his words and actions are just too little, too late. That happens. Sometimes it’s the only solution that will keep one sane. I think Daisy used some very thoughtful words in her post. My kids would surely not have benefited from two parents who could no longer respect and love each other. It happens, and the children do survive quite well.

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He offered to move back to my bedroom last night. I don't want him there right now. He asked if he could come back if he swore not to touch me, but I said no.

The computer I use at home is a laptop and I have been taking it with me when I leave the house. That is where all the info is. None of the equipment is in the house - i keep it with me so it will not be found. If he is reading here, he would have had to find the site himself and figure out who I was and which thread is mine. I doubt that happened. Sure, its possible, but not probable.

He was devastated when I told him that I had a lawyer. I don't think he already knew that.

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WTW wrote: "WH called MC and got us an appt for today at 5pm. I’ll go – but I am apprehensive about it. I have just gotten to the point that I accepted it was over and I moved on emotionally. I am not sure that I am ready to do the work anymore.

I know that sounds selfish and I hate it. But, the reality is that is how I feel."

You are absolutely NOT being selfish. Your H has been the selfish one since his 1st A, which resulted in another 4 yrs of deception and ****** for you. Don't you forget that! I am not saying the M is necessarily over, just that if you decide it is that's OK.

I'm curious what caused this sudden conversion in your H? The timing is just so coincidental. Did he happen to mention why now all of a sudden he wants to work on the M? Is it just because he picked up on your current vibes? And definitely keep that GPS device running. THAT will let you see just how serious he is. You need to sit back and let this man do ALL the work right now.The burden of proof is on him, not you. And it's perfectly OK to not know what you want, and to tell him that. IMVHO this is beyond Plan Aing the FWS. You did that and he kept his A going another 4 yrs. I agree with Aphelion that LTAs are a different animal altogether.

I sincerely hope that the MC you are going to is not the one who said working with OW was OK. If so you might as well cancel yout appt. My H's A was 9 months. During that time he tried to break it off several times. The OW always begged him not to leave her. Now I realize how of course the A wasn't going to end just because he wanted it to. He'd tell her they needed to end it and see her the very next day, where she was right there encouraging it to continue. He'd get his OW fix and it continued on. There has to be NC so it doesn't surprise me that your H's A didn't end, even if he maybe wanted it to after the 1st d-day.

WTW, don't fold on anything you need now. Still talk to your attorney. Then watch and wait. CV

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www2, i love trix's words and i ditto them. my vote is you are numb because you have a plan this time. you are indifferent. regardless of mc tonight, make a list of the things your h must do in order for you to stay, one being the no contact letter. the harleys are way better than any ic. they make you hold accountability. money well spent.
let him do the work. he's off to a great start. don't plan a thing. he must prove to you w/his actions. let him make all the plans and arrangements and you stay neutral. my problem is that i try to do all the work. it's not up to us. hugs again. wish you were nearby so i could take you to lunch.

Last edited by 2334pem; 01/17/06 11:12 AM.

"The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched. They must be felt with the heart." Helen Keller
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WTW2,

Go back to the beginning of this thread. You were having plenty of emotions when you first started it.

Call it shock or whatever you'd like, the body has a way of protectig you when it is too much to handle.

I wish I could predict the future for you and ease some of your anxiety, but you will just have to watch as each hour, each day, each week unfolds.

IF you decide on recovery, you may want to move to the recovery board. IMHO the kind of support you will need will be easier to get there.

Still thinking about you, hoping you can sense all the good thoughts and prayers being sent your way.

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Quote
What difference does the GPS proof make now? He admitted the A. I hope she didn't divulge that info at this point. Really, I don't know if she needs to tell him about that for years or ever. But if he did read here he knows about it anyway.

If H does not suspect/know about the GPS

she ought to continue to monitor his whereabouts IF she decides to try and reconcile.

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I think timing is everything. I am so glad you found out about A before he told you. Who knows why he picked now to come clean. Maybe it was a combination of things, A lost its glamour...you were behaving differently this week...started him evaluating his life...went to the funneral big eye opener especially if deceased friend was close to his age.

He is now ready and willing...let him. Have him call SH to help him form a plan. You've given it 4 years already whats another few weeks to see how it plays out? The goal is not to just stay married but for you to be in love with eachother and happy...what better gift for your children.


aka-confused42
BS-45 me
WH-42
DS-14 & DD-12
together 21 yrs, married 18.5yrs
"I love you but not IN love with you" speech 6/3/04
D-Day 2/25/05; WH moved out 3/15/05 & back too soon 3/22/05...He left again 5/8/06
5/25/06 Plan B.....NC letter 6/18/06
Recovery finally began Jan 2007
We are IN love again!!!Sept 2007
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I believe that that friend's funeral could have affected him in this way.

Let us not forget that this is a marriage building site. I guess we all project from our own experiences.

I totally understand that you lack similar emotions this time as last. It is up to him to prove to you this time. He has to keep showing you this new attitude and resolve.

You have to see that he has lost his selfish entitlement.

When I had yet another D-day believing it was the last I said we will just split everything and go our separate ways.
My FWH did all the work. 3 yrs later and he is still sustaining that attitude. He is still showing me by his actions that he is in this marriage and wanting to keep making it the best marriage for both of us. I wish the same for you. Your kids are younger than mine were.

I guess I am not as cynical as many folks here.

I wish you the best, W2W. You deserve it.


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Agreed.


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He keeps telling me that it was going to the funeral of his highschool friend that broke his soul. He said that the situation had been laying on him for awhile and he didn't know what to do so he did nothing. He said that as he sat there listening to people talk about his friend, all he could think about was what people would have to say about him when he died. He said that he feels like there is nothing good about his life right now. He told me he feels like he has a great wife and great kids and that somehow he has managed to mess it all up. He said he used to be a fun person who loved to do things and had lots of friends, but that now he has become a lonely person who has isolated himself from everything. He said he wants to change all that and have a life by my side.

He said that sitting in that church for 2 hours on Saturday was humbling and that something inside him changed.

He also said that he wants to start going to church with me and the kids. He has never done that regularily before. Of course, he said alot of things. That doesn't mean they are going to happen.

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The hand of God works in mysterious ways. Guide him to SH or your own MC while he is still motivated.


aka-confused42
BS-45 me
WH-42
DS-14 & DD-12
together 21 yrs, married 18.5yrs
"I love you but not IN love with you" speech 6/3/04
D-Day 2/25/05; WH moved out 3/15/05 & back too soon 3/22/05...He left again 5/8/06
5/25/06 Plan B.....NC letter 6/18/06
Recovery finally began Jan 2007
We are IN love again!!!Sept 2007
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Unless he read a book on "how to tell your BS all the things they want to hear and be a model WS", it sounds like maybe he is finally feeling the impact of the mess he made of his life.

The test of that might be how open he is with the MC. Does he know you told your parents & friends? The reaction to that could tell you alot,too. No more opportunity for a secret life if it's out in the open to everyone.

Is there a reason you don't want to try using SH?

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I believe him. Time will tell by his actions.

If you do decide to try again...I hope you won't hold onto your anger and unforgiveness long. Dr. Willard Harley says that the BS is the greatest threat/hinderence to real recovery at just this juncture. You will eventually have to give that up and invite him back into your bedroom. Spend some time in prayer and meditation. I believe God has answered your prayers...but in His timing, not yours.

Seek the Lord while He may be found...

Last edited by Trix; 01/17/06 11:27 AM.

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I am excited for you because I can see the potential for a great marriage and family.


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W2W,
I have read this whole thread from start to finish - and I so feel for you. Stay strong!
Something that I read disturbed me though - you say that your H set up the MC appointment, and it was with the MC that you saw last time? Correct me if I read this wrong - but isnt this the same MC that advocated that it was ok for your H to continue working with the OW??
My, his advice really helped!
I know you think that he knows your case well, after all, he helped you for 2 years, and it had to be individual (thanks to the lack of trying from your H) but I would be concerned about going back to the same MC - especially as your H seems to have chosen this one too.
Im not putting the MC down, put I wonder if perhaps your H feels that things worked out well for him last time due to the MC's advice, and using the same one, it could do again??
Sorry to sound cynical - I am of the opinion that all marriages should really be worked at, but it is impossible if its not worked at by both, 4 years of chances is a long time - and it does seem that he has only come clean because he suspected you had already discovered him.

I only know what you have posted about your H, but have to say that he must be an incredibly sneaky individual to have promised you the earth 4 years ago, and then to have continued his deception quite happily up until the point you already knew about it recently????
Seems to me like he likes his cake and eat it. (Understatement!) I would say not so much fog as incredibly deceptive and selfish!
Please tread carefully here, people like this can be very very clever at getting what they want at all costs - it is easy for those of us individuals who see the best in everyone to not be able to comprehend the lengths that some people will go to to protect themselves, but in the long run they only hurt others and are selfish individuals who only see their own feelings and wants in life.

The other thing is that the OW is obviously under his spell too, if she has let him live with you for 4 years and not given him an ultimatum. She is an enabler and is dangerous to any future your marriage may have. I dont believe that if she has allowed this for 4 years, a phone call from your H to her, in front of you, is going to dismantle this relationship.
I would suggest talking to her to see what lies and rubbish he has told her.
Dont forget, he is a liar!
He needs to hit rock bottom before he really sees what he has done. It is an addiction, similar to an alcoholic.
Only you can decide what is best for you - but bear in mind that you have 4 years of deception and lies to work through,
on top of his broken promises from before. How many years will it take before you can truly trust him again, and are you prepared to live your life that way?
I admire your courage and bravery! Do not let him manipulate you. It would be awful to see you here in a few years with more of the same.

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