so in your case you still think your H wishes he was with OW?

Kds:

I've been troubled by your post.

Eav reminded me....

I hope you don't mind my speaking with you. I don't think I've posted to you before but I'm concerned about some things that you have said.



I am sad for you that you are thinking this way. Maybe I'm getting the wrong impression so set me right if I am wrong. You feel that you are happily recovered yet you think of the OW as being your H's wife?

Kds, there is no comparison between you and the OW. You don't walk on the same earth. She is not someone that he NORMALLY met and FELL IN LOVE WITH. Their R was adulterous and all that entails.



Don't you think that the FOW could have been putting on an act? In my situation, I knew that the fog was really breaking when my H said to me: "She (the OW) is just like any other woman". In their fantasy game, the OP is seen as ideal and she PLAYS that ROLE..easy for her to do..because their relationship is not at all normal or REAL.



IMO, it is not OK for your H to have been such a Momma's Boy. The HEALTHY PART of him wanted to marry you. It is not normal for him to have wanted to be with a woman LIKE HIS MOMMA. Thank God, he must have realized this. Plus, remember the OW was probably putting on an ACT...doing what she needed to do to steal your H and ruin your life. It seems that you are ADMIRING her and putting yourself down. That makes me sad for you. I hope that I am reading this entirely wrong.

This is where you seem to be putting yourself down (the quote below). I have sons who will soon get married and I hope to God that they will move away from me and PUT THEIR WIVES FIRST. It would be selfish of me to expect them to choose a wife to satisfy ME. Remember the vows, Kds? Forsaking all others....



Please, stop this, Kds!

You are a jewel. She is trash. She does not deserve to walk on the same ground that you do...to take advantage of a situation in which she is caring for your MIL..SICK! SICK! SICK! I say a BLACK WIDOW who captured them in her web. I AM AFRAID THAT SHE HAS CAUGHT YOU UP INTO IT TOO.

So why is your H with you, Kds?

my xh is RECREATING his life but without me in the place.

how did he do it?

he had ANOTHER AFFAIR last summer....with a girl five years younger than his wistress wife...who was a complete double for me...ten years ago. the girl looks exactly like I did...when xwh and I met.

he separated from his wife for her.

meanwhile...he has the following things/events recreated in his life:
1)makes ow/w drive SAME SUV AND IN SAME COLOR AND MODEL AS ONE I HAD WHEN WE WERE MARRIED (navigator)
2)built a french country facade on the lakehouse ...whas what I always wanted.
3)designed things in his bathroom and kitchen and fixtures that were/are "totally me"...things I had told him over the years I wanted someday in our home.
4)named HIS CHILD WITH OTHER WOMAN..SAME NAME I PICKED OUT FOR DS IF HE HAD BEEN A GIRL...can u believe that?????sick huh????
5)even named his new dog SAME NAME I WANTED TO NAME A DOG...from my favorite movie character, general maximus, from Gladiator.
6)jokingly "sees" me all the time...as per his business partners' wifey...says to them when in grocery store line...looking at magazines (star)..."wow. did anybody notice that britney spears and her baby looks just like peach did when our ds was that age? can you see the resemblance?" they said that his wife WINCED WITH FURY....

my xh has attempted on every level to recreate his life with me...but he can't do it. why? HIS WISTRESS WIFEY IS TOO DARN OPPOSITE FROM ME. He wanted chocolate when he had the sleazy affair with her...never believed she'd get preggers...meanwhile he was fully happy with his vanilla at home. she was simply put...different from me...in every way. we look NOTHING ALIKE. she's an idiot, I am educated. She has kids outta wedlock, I wait until married several years with stability. She has done drugs in past, questionable reputation, and was former party girl...me? clean, sweet former sorority chickie with sqeaky clean past pretty much...never did any "experimenting" like the wistress did.

she was his walk on the wild side.

and he has paid dearly.

how is it for me now?

I can barely stomach either of them. I know their future. It ain't good. I can barely tolerate seeing or speaking now to either of them.

It is the sheer stupidity and evil of the sitch that I see blatantly now. It makes me want to hurl. I hate seeing speaking or having any contact with xwh or her. they deserve each other now imho. and they will be miserable for a long while. unless he did a better job of hiding his assets, as if that's the case, it will be no time until they end this stupid charade.

and it's funny. in my ds's school annual, we took out an ad for him in it. in it is a photo of his dad and him (dad's idea of course...to show world how cute they are or something), and one of him and wistress' son, and others of my ds....again, trying to force their affair on the world.

but I got my revenge at the bottom. Sickly imho the ad signs off "we're proud of you! Love, Daddy, Mommy, Mrs. Family Values (they call her by her first name after Mrs.)and OC's name. So forever, the wistress wifey will NEVER be called mom or any mom-like derivitave. She will be referred to as Ms. First Name. She will forever have her NAME AFTER MY NAME in anything family oriented. It's sad. It will always have Daddy, Mommy, and then the mistress' name. Sick I know. And when one of my friends' who's child is also my ds' best friend from class saw it, she exclaimed, "my my my....Peach it is ironic. You divorce, and your WXH PLACES YOUR NAME BESIDE HIS AND BEFORE HIS WIFE'S. It's rather obvious that this is a strange situation...and that three makes an interesting situation nonetheless. I think the entire school will see it for what it is now thanks to Darth's excellent wording.
"

Peachy:

I find your post to be verrry interesting!

It's helpful to take a look at these patterns.

I doubt we will gain a full understanding about all of this crap, though..

Like your X, my H took "a walk on the wild side".

THEN, he turned around and tried to make her into me although in so many ways she is my complete OPPOSITE. She seemed to have bought into this...struggling,of course..and tried to become as much like me as possible...started going to college, for example, and I have a postgraduate degree ...One of my friends told me that she could never catch up with me in her lifetime...My friend told me that surely she would fail because of being so tasteless in every respect and clueless..that my H was accustomed to my style and way of relating to the world and could not continue to live the FOW's lifestyle....

SO TRUE....

This is the value of PLAN B that others find so hard to understand...

Plan B puts them in the OP's WORLD 24/7 with no relief. The WS has to accept the reality of what they have done..how low they have sunk. THE OP CANNOT KEEP THE SHOW GOING 24/7. From the understanding I can get, almost everyday during Plan B ended up being: A LESSON IN PLAYING HOUSE. How do we live in the REAL WORLD? OW says: "What kind of bath soap do you use?" H thinking: Mimi has always bought the soap. How in the heck do I know? OW thinking: I hope I can figure out the one Mimi buys in order to make WS happy. OW buys wrong soap. WH has to find the right brand and instruct her. WH starts to think: This is NO FUN ANYMORE. Wow, I miss Mimi. Moving on the LAUNDRY DETERGENT..... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

WH realizes: She is not an IDEAL, PERFECT PERSON. This is not all FUN AND GAMES. This is BULL CRAP. She has been putting on a SHOW. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />Who is this person anyways? Who have I become?


Interesting.. one of the last nails in the coffing of my FWH's Affair was the FOW's plot to become pregnant. She started saying that she wanted to have his child and "cried" when he talked to her about being there at the births of our sons.She actually asked about what it was like for him to be there. So intrusive..it gives me the shivers to type this..that she heard those birth stories. It seems that he ALMOST fell for this...YUCK..feeling sorry for her not having had a man to love her enough to be there for her during the pregnancy and childbirth of her daughter...that was the one thing that she thought that I had over her....

It's all such a charade..such a sick, sick farce...

Looks like your X is trying to actually LIVE IT and, as you can predict, that relationship is destined to fail..sad for all involved...PLAYING GAMES WITH THE LIVES OF REAL PEOPLE...YUCK...A TRAGEDY FOR THEM...

You have prevailed....YOU ARE A WINNER!!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Eav~
I think the excellent article you recently referenced about
affairs (from "Psychology Today") had some great comments in it in regards to the WS often having an A with someone
who is inappropriate or totally opposite from their spouse.

From what I know of my WH's OW we are somewhat similar in
age and looks, but MILES apart in character and personality.
I think OW is my WH's "walk on the wild side" because she
is all about "fun", no committment, and NOT real life.
(I think that in itself is part of the appeal).

I can't think that either OW or WH really think they have
some great "love affair" or anything that's really going
anywhere- they know too much about each other now, and
have to realize the other isn't the "perfect" person they
pretended to be at first. Maybe what keeps them together
after that realization is that they are already "addicted"
and it makes it hard to break free. Seems like the sick,
obsessive attachment to each other is about the only thing
my WH and his OW even have in common-

It's easy for me to think of WH and OW as doing all the fun
things that H and I used to do- like weekend trips, looking
at model homes, driving in the mountains, going out to eat
and to a movie, etc.. and I'm sure they do some of those
things, but when WH was at home earlier this year during
our brief (false) recovery, he told me he had missed some
of those things because OW "never wanted to do anything".

I figure OW must be one of two ways-
She could be grasping at straws to try to be "me" (what she
THINKS is me), by trying to make a cozy "life" and family
(dogs) with WH and being on her best behavior with WH.
If so, she can't accomplish this because she knows nothing
about me, and few truths about the life H and I had.

Or- maybe she is so confident that she is "MS Fabulous"
and has "won" by getting my "man", that she doesn't try
and treats WH like a puppet on a string (have seen lots
of examples of her doing this). That won't work either,
for long, because WH is going to get sick of it.

I do get a lot of satisfaction in knowing that WH has to
take his bipolar meds and AD's at bedtime. The bipolar
meds make him fall to sleep shortly afterwards, and he
sleeps hard, often snoring. Don't know about the AD's he's
on now, but some he's taken have had "sexual side effects"
(and hopefully these do too). Does't sound too romantic !!
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Just thoughts-
Slammed

Interesting subject - so you all tend to agree that WSs choose someone who is different from their spouses?

My WH always felt for beautiful girls, saying that they remind him of his mother who passed away when he was only 23 months old. Even though those girls all look so different, as long as they are pretty, WH always said "she looks like my biological mom", which was disturbing to me, obviously. But then the girl he felt for in the fall 2004, which triggered his impulse decision to get D, had a pretty heavy past, unlike me. She is a cute young girl, but used to do drugs and attempted to kill herself several times. I do not have such dark past and never tried anything that is illegal. So in my mind, she is very different from me. Yet, the interesting yet disturbing thing is that WH said to me later "why do I always fall for the similar type? In many ways she is like YOU". What???

And then when we went to see his IC (he has been seeing IC for his sex addiction) shortly after the discovery in 2004, he said:
"WH is psychologically broken because of his childhood experience and step mom. He is always looking for an ideal woman who reminds him of his biological mother whom he never actually knew. But he chose a woman (=ME) who is like his step mom, which makes psychological sense."

I was very shocked to hear this. So was he trying to imply that I am like his step mom who (according to WH and his IC) destroyed his life?

It sounds to me, all of your experience is similar in that WHs may feel that they are recreating their familiar lives with OWs, OWs are often opposite from BWs. Whatever it is, I do believe that truly wonderful women will not try to steal married men from their wives.

Ok....

We've indulged in this OW business enough...

It's time for us to start talking about OURSELVES and how WONDERFUL WE ARE....

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Sure lets talk about how wonderful we are, thats why they left us..... Sorry for the sarcasum but I am just tired and so fed up with this whole mess....

I know we all are wonderful in our own ways and yup we are better women for standing for our marriages and believes. But after some time and fighting so hard you start to wonder, am I really what they seem to think I am.

You start to wonder maybe he is right, maybe I am not who or what he really needs....... To damn bad it took him all these years to figure it out though ......

Maybe I am becoming bitter and angry for being treated so badly by the one person I thought loved me.....

Maybe, just maybe he finally realized I am worth more and he is not deserving of me and he knew it..... So he decided pond scum was more along his lines of a woman he needed. He threw away treasure for trash .......


Hurting

Don't be troubled by my post, Mimi.

I trust my husband now, and he is my husband, not the alien of almost a year ago.

I thought we were just picking at some old scabs, and examinining the what ifs.

And you are probably right, he doesn't want someone that is the mirror image of his mother, but I think part of the allure of her, was that he was sinking to the bottom, over the loss of his father, and sister and his mother losing her independence and mind to dementia and she gave him comfort and she had all the simularities of his mother and niece, and her compassion in my husbands wounded state, lead to the EA.

And yes, the bible does say to leave your parents and cleave to your wife, and yes, he had a very hard time doing that.

Yes, it was hard dealing with it over the years, but I did stick it out, and you cannot change the past, but you can change yourself, which I have been doing these past few months.

I think my point was that my MIL loved the OW, and I was feeling sorry for myself because of this. I do feel that my MIL would have rather of had the OW as the daughter-in-law, i'm sure, but that is not the way it happened, and I was feeling guilty of separating the ow from my MIL and the loss my MIL felt when the ow was no longer in her life.

Thats all.

The OW is still a rat in my book, and she will always be.

Sincerely,
k.d.'s heartbreak

Eave, I love my husband, and no, I don't believe that he would be with the OW if he could.

My husbands beliefs and values would not allow this to happen, especially after I did such a great Plan A, and he came out of the fog to discover, that I wasn't the horrible person he had thought I was.

So the answer to your question of whether or not he wishes he was with the OW, is a deffinate no.

Sincerely,
k.d.'s Heartbreak

OKAY FOLKS! Sorry, but this is probably THE most morbid and depressing post I've ever read that I had to stop midway.

What's holding you ALL back from moving on? I don't mean to be blunt. But most of you have come to the realization that your WS have moved on with their lives without you. Yet you are still "clinging" on to misguided hope that they will return.

I truly understand the pain you are going through because I am a BS myself. But there has to be that "DEFINING" point when each one you MUST ACCEPT that life goes on --- yes! YOURS INCLUDED! You CAN'T continue pounding on yourselves, overanlzying the OP or our WS A and expect to emotionally and mentally HEAL! If you want REVENGE, then START LIVING! Move on! That's the sweetest revenge of all!

I often advocate that each of us have a CHOICE in which direction we want to live or how to feel. So, go ahead and make that choice to live what's left of your lives.

Life is a gift! DON'T waste your time overanlyzing why your WS could have left you for some woman young enough to be their daughter or whatever the reason may have been. THEY ARE NOT WORTH IT! As long as you choose to allow you WS' CHOICES dictate how you live/feel, you will NEVER give yourselves the OPPORTUNITY to live fully OR allow yourself to be ready to love again! Think about it.

How can you truly be ready to love again or have someone love and cherish you the way you want when you haven't LEARNED to let go? If this doesn't ignite a WAKE UP CALL, read this question again. Consider THIS your life's lesson. Start learning it.

Stargazelily

Staregaze:

You must be new .... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

LM

Bwhahahahahahahah!!!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Just a quick learner... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I agree with everything you are saying, Star!

BUT...some people HEAL faster than others...just like some cars drive faster than others...

BSes have suffered a MAJOR TRAUMA...One of the primary cures for PTSD is telling the story..over and over again..until you are finished telling the story....

It is not easy at all JUST TO BOUNCE BACK and these women are being honest about their feelings. Women like to get together and talk about their feelings. I'm not sure if you are a woman or not but if you are you probably UNDERSTAND...

Dang it! We have to have our PITY PARTIES every now and then...

THEN, we pick ourselves up and MOVE ON until the next PITY PARTY....

I think it's ONLY HUMAN....

I had my GOOD DAYS and my AWFUL DAYS....

STILL DO..even though my PITY PARTIES are not about INFIDELITY anymore...

ETA: These women continue to LOVE their Hs..LOVE HAS TO DIE..the love bank has to be depleted..you can't just say STOP LOVING HIM and then it happens..

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Lem? I had to pop in here...I respect your point...

I had a mini-light bulb moment on monkeyboy5's thread...where OneToughCookie said (as the BS):

"I didn't give up on my H when he was in his fog having the affair...and now my H isn't giving up on me."

I realize from this thread's title, this isn't appropriate, really...but where the discussion went...this statement from a couple just past their first year of recovery was important.

I had to run right over here and show you.

Okay...I feel five years old.

LA

(Hi mimi!)

Hi, LA!!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

eav1967,

1967 was a great year!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hey, I don't have time to read your whole thread, but since you seem to be really wanting to hear from FWS's, I thought I'd put in my .02.

Your H has a 25% chance of success in his new relationship. Now, I'm not a bettin' gal, but these odds aren't what I would need in order to leave my H, my 2 kids, our home, extended families, etc. But I came close, and want to tell you about it.

When I was deep into my A, I could easily imagine all of the things your H has done. EASILY imagine my H would not be so terribly hurt. EASILY imagine my children would accept the OM and me after exposure. EASILY imagine my family accepting OM with open arms after they saw how happy he made me. I was absolutely positively convinced I did not love my H in any way, shape or form.

The whole FOG thing is such a mystery. I believe Dr. Harley is a genious for figuring it out as much as he has, but there is so much about it that no one but a truely remorse FWS can FEEL. Unfortunately, feeling what one does when they are in the fog, is one thing. Describing it to others is a whole different thing, and very difficult to do. I almost wish I would have been addicted to drugs or been coerced by some cult, so that I could be positive about how I believe the fog affects a person. I sincerely believe it is grounds for temporary insanity. I never believed in that plea, until I experienced what I consider to have been "an out-of-mind experience". Blocking things out, as you mentioned, is one of the easiest things to do when one is in this state of mind. Yes, a WS can forget any good times they ever had with their spouse. They can forget any feelings of love they had for their spouse. They don't spend any time whatsoever thinking about the consequences of their A. They are happy, for the first time in a long time, and this is ALL that matters. After all, they have been miserable for so long (most likely because of their spouse!), don't they deserve to be happy?! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Another great thing that happens in the fog, is you get really creative and imaginitive about who you are. Now, I told my OM when I first met him, that I had no intention of leaving my H or my kids. Wasn't that just so good of me?! But in a matter of 4 months, I was ready to move in with him! Amazing isn't it, that we opt for the path of least resistence, even with so much at stake.

Now, I could tell you that I'm not the average type of person that has an A. But I've learned through being on this forum, and by other means, that no one fits this mold perfectly. Good people (like my pastor, who ran off with the church secretary!) do bad things. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

If a WS has feelings of love for the OP, this person is not just "filling a space", they are feeding needs that have been starving.

Perhaps I am speaking for too many WS's here, and should add that the above was my sitch, and mine only. The point I really wanted to get across to you was, that ANYTHING is possible when one is in the fog.

I am so sorry for your sitch and for all the pain you have endured.

God bless,

KJ

KariJean

thanks for sharing your experience and thoughts. It was very helpful!

mimi

you said you agree with everything that star said....

are you saying that you agree with this?




because, in my opinion, this goes against the marraige building belief that the affair will most likely fail and then you may have a chance to restore your marraige

and it goes against what most of us here hope will happen